I am pretty sure he has already made the decision on which units to test.....your a little late for suggestions now!

 

Anyone that has been to Las Vegas has experienced this themselves. Jump in a pool on a 100 degree day. Get out of the pool. As the water evaporates from your body, you will feel cold.

If you consider scientific variables like dew point, etc. it is possible to have temperatures below ambient.

 

ummm so when is this test going to take place?

 

Looking forward to the test!

 

The only reason i asked becuase the outside air is used in a correction factor.

My reference for calculations regarding intercoolers, you may have this link already
http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/turbo/intercooler.html

 

Haha I like your intercooler tongue test. While it's somewhat of a simple, primative experiment, I think conceptually it makes sense. I'm glad there are people on this forum that think for themselves and look beyond the "it is impossible to cool below ambient because I said so" nay sayers who were quick to discredit nisei's previous intercooler tests as being tampered with. You can tell that a lot of time and energy went into their testing with the pictures, data logs, measurements, etc, and it was disappointing to see it so quickly discredited.

 

The tongue test is not at all equivalent to an intercooler with ambient air flowing over it. The tongue test is equivalent to an intercooler with water sprayed on it. The temperature probe in the tongue test shows less than ambient temperatures because the saliva on the probe changes state from liquid to gas and takes energy (heat) from the probe in order to do so.

An intercooler in ambient air (no matter what the humidity) will not be the same, because there is no liquid on the intercooler. The moisture is already in the air, so no change of state is occuring.

 

the amount of liquid on the intercooler required to get the inner temps below ambinet is going to a lot! more than a thermocouple that records the SURFACE TEMP
you are comparing apples to eggs....

big big difference!

second,, try acetone instead of water,, although i think the latent heat of vaporization is a little less than water, it happens much quicker and at lower temps...

third....
if one intercooler in a test shows the ability to drop temps below ambient. ( still incorrect... go get a thermo book and find out why...) the others tested would as well.....

I bet the neisie test had someone with a spray bottle infront off their own intercooler and not infront of the others!

 

this guy is smart!

everyone read his second paragraph again... he hits the nail on the head!

 

you're wrong. it's the equivalent of a swamp cooler test.

when the air is injested it's hot, this has a higher moisture retention. when the temperature is lowered the moisture can be pulled out. you'd expect this, the front half of the intercooler on the inside would be dry

the latter half would be less so.

this accumulation of moisture is inconveniently situated where you'd like to take a measurement of termperature.

 

not necessarily so. any number of things can happen when you're doing REAL WORLD TESTING. how long you let the car run, this and that. so what should you do? let each car run the same amount of time? up to the same temperature?

in the end it's sufficient to say you CAN have a disparity in temps but THAT'S THE NATURE OF TESTING. any number of reasons can be used to describe why but in the end the real reason is because it's in the real world.

sunlight hitting bumper? moisture in air? probes placed in differing locations? many many possible explanations


you're wrong by association

 

This is exactly what I mean about people who are quick to make judgments but have not presented any data, research, or explanation for those statements. I understand the concept in thermodynamics that an air to air intercooler cannot drop temps below ambient in a CONTROLLED environment/experiment. However, the testing and data logs provided in the nisei test was a real world test done while traveling 80+mph on the freeway at night. So to respond to your comment about someone standing in front of their intercooler with a spray bottle, you must not have read the analysis because the testing was not done on a dyno. They couldn't possibly have stood in front of the car while it was traveling down the freeway for goodness sakes.

Humidity in the air while traveling on the freeway hitting the front fascia as well as humidity in the charged air flowing through the cooling tubes could have contributed to outlet temps falling below ambient. But really, you can speculate all you want. I for one, do not believe the tests were tampered with. We can agree to disagree.

 

As the temperature of air increases, relative humidity decreases. So, a turbo spooling and heating up the intake charge will decrease the charge's relative humidity. What effect will having a lower relative humidity in the intercooler have when higher relative humidity is passing through it?

What about hitting a patch of fog during the testing?

 

for humid air to cool the inter cooler it must first go from a vapor state and condense to a liquid phase on the intercooler... then it would have changes states again and become a vapor once more.

this won't happen... ever.....

argumentum ad hominem... latin for argument against the man..

instead of attacking the substance of the argument, you attack the person making the argument...

if you know nothing of heat transfer, don't add to the thread....

and by the way,, quoting a thrmo text book with a bunch of steady state equations and attempting to apply them here is crap too!

I want to see compressible flow, and transient conditions, applied to this...

oh... no one can?? weird,,, i though you were all experts.....

 

that totally happens on the outside of your ice cube filled coke glass doesn't it? vapor state to condensed state and then the air takes it away when the accumulated moisture's "pressure" is greater than that of the passing (was depositing moisture) air.

seriously, why does it have to condense onto the intercooler? you've heard of fog right?