Evo 8 ACT Clutch Noise
Jun 15, 2007, 01:56 PM
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Evo 8 ACT Clutch Noise
Hello all,
My name is Brian and this is my first post here at evolutionm.net.
I was wondering if I could get some feedback in regards to a clutch issue I have been having since I upgraded to an ACT 2900 lbs clutch kit (MB7-HDSS) and an ACT Streetlite flywheel (#600205) for my 2003 Evo 8. I received the clutch kit, flywheel, alignment tool, and throw-out bearing via UPS and called my local Mitsubishi dealer to schedule an install time.
The dealer installed the new clutch and I picked up the car. During the break-in period, I kept hearing a grinding noise coming from the front of my car when I would decelerate while leaving the car in gear. Sitting at idle in neutral, a slight grinding noise can be heard, but immediatly goes away when I push the clutch in. I immediately took the car back to my dealer. They were baffled as to what it could be, because the stock clutch and flywheel never made that noise.
I called ACT and spoke with Richard and he informed me that ACT kits for STI's makes a similiar noise but had never heard anything from an Evo owner. Richard suspected the throw-out bearing as the dealer mechanic said it didn't fit as tight as the orginal.
After informing the dealer, they said no problem, going way above the call of duty, and replaced the throw-out bearing for me AT NOT ADDITIONAL COST. My dealer, Prestige Auto, in Eau Claire, WI is the best dealership anywhere!! They even took the ACT clutch apart and inspected to make sure everything was ok.
After putting in the new throw-out bearing, it still makes the same grinding noise!! I called ACT back and spoke with Richard. His response was that he would check the forums of various websites and call me back later today.
That was this morning, and around 3PM my time (1PM ACT time) I called ACT and was greeted with a "Sorry we are closed, you called after hours" message when it says on their website "8:00am - 4:30pm Monday-Friday".
I have owned my Evo for 2 weeks before the stock clutch went out, no big deal as I have heard that the stock clutch is weak from the get-go. It has been sitting in the shop now for 2 weeks and I am very frustrated at this point as I can't even enjoy my new car.
If anyone has any suggestions or feedback, I would greatly appreciate it. I own a computer repair company and the Evo was going to be my repair vehicle (sure beats the guys in the black and white VW's!!!!). I have pics and mods up at Car Domain; was trying to get on Bullrun, no luck there tho.
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2650256
Thanks for the help,
Brian
My name is Brian and this is my first post here at evolutionm.net.
I was wondering if I could get some feedback in regards to a clutch issue I have been having since I upgraded to an ACT 2900 lbs clutch kit (MB7-HDSS) and an ACT Streetlite flywheel (#600205) for my 2003 Evo 8. I received the clutch kit, flywheel, alignment tool, and throw-out bearing via UPS and called my local Mitsubishi dealer to schedule an install time.
The dealer installed the new clutch and I picked up the car. During the break-in period, I kept hearing a grinding noise coming from the front of my car when I would decelerate while leaving the car in gear. Sitting at idle in neutral, a slight grinding noise can be heard, but immediatly goes away when I push the clutch in. I immediately took the car back to my dealer. They were baffled as to what it could be, because the stock clutch and flywheel never made that noise.
I called ACT and spoke with Richard and he informed me that ACT kits for STI's makes a similiar noise but had never heard anything from an Evo owner. Richard suspected the throw-out bearing as the dealer mechanic said it didn't fit as tight as the orginal.
After informing the dealer, they said no problem, going way above the call of duty, and replaced the throw-out bearing for me AT NOT ADDITIONAL COST. My dealer, Prestige Auto, in Eau Claire, WI is the best dealership anywhere!! They even took the ACT clutch apart and inspected to make sure everything was ok.
After putting in the new throw-out bearing, it still makes the same grinding noise!! I called ACT back and spoke with Richard. His response was that he would check the forums of various websites and call me back later today.
That was this morning, and around 3PM my time (1PM ACT time) I called ACT and was greeted with a "Sorry we are closed, you called after hours" message when it says on their website "8:00am - 4:30pm Monday-Friday".
I have owned my Evo for 2 weeks before the stock clutch went out, no big deal as I have heard that the stock clutch is weak from the get-go. It has been sitting in the shop now for 2 weeks and I am very frustrated at this point as I can't even enjoy my new car.
If anyone has any suggestions or feedback, I would greatly appreciate it. I own a computer repair company and the Evo was going to be my repair vehicle (sure beats the guys in the black and white VW's!!!!). I have pics and mods up at Car Domain; was trying to get on Bullrun, no luck there tho.
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2650256
Thanks for the help,
Brian
Last edited by gonzo6150; Jun 19, 2007 at 07:56 PM.
Jun 15, 2007, 02:38 PM
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The act clutch for some reason just like many others is a very noisey clutch. mine has been grinding and rumbling for about ehhh 40k now nearly 50k miles. The clutch just makes a ton of noise for who only knows what reason. But anyway i wouldnt sweat it as nearly every ACT equiped car i have been around does it. If you want a more technical answer search usernames for ACTMAN he is a CEO or somthing for ACT and will help you out. I am almost positive he would like to hear about the poor customer service you recieved as well!
Edit: btw cams only make it worse at idle lol... Makes the car sound like its going to throw a rod
Edit: btw cams only make it worse at idle lol... Makes the car sound like its going to throw a rod
Jun 15, 2007, 03:11 PM
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I bought my car with an aftermarket clutch & the car makes VERY simliar sounds like you describe. When I come to decelerate on the highway, i hear chatter as if a heat shield under the car was rattling... (but if it WAS a heat shield, it would always rattle.) The car is very loud in first gear too when first taking off... and kind of shuddery when taking off in 1st. Engaugement is right up top & engauges practically instantly...
Does yours do the same?
Does yours do the same?
Jun 15, 2007, 06:36 PM
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I just had an ACT street clutch with prolite flywheel placed in my Evo 8. The clutch engagement is much improved over stock, with a bit firmer clutch pedal. My only issue is the "coffee grinder" sound heard when the car is decelerating in gear. Annoying, but a fair trade I guess.
Jun 15, 2007, 09:16 PM
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Brian,
Richard asked that I call you after he got your last message. We actually weren't closed. We have an after lunch safety training (and we celebrate birthdays) once a month with the entire company. but our stupid fancy phone system doesn't make it easy to change the out of office message. It started at 1pm and was over at about 1:40. I called you at about 2:10 but apparently you had already gone home. Judging by the time you were probably on the computer posting this thread, LOL. I left a message at your work (I presume). Sorry I missed you.
Anyway, I was informed of your situation. Richard never told you that the problem was the release bearing so he didn't know where you got that from (it doesn't really matter). A typical release bearing noise doesn't fit the description you give for the noise and of course it didn't help matters.
Aside from the release bearing, here is a breakdown of the other parts and how it affects noise:
Flywheel: It just spins at engine speed and can't make noise unless it is rubbing against something. Of course a lighter flywheel does allow more torsional vibrations to get though to the disc and untimately the transmission which is usually the noise you hear. If the flywheel was not tightened adequately, then there is also a chance to get a noise on or off throttle from the torsional vibrations of the flywheel rattling on the bolts. If that is the case, fix it quick or you will be buying a new crankshaft and flywheel!
Pressure plate: It just spins along with the flywheel. It also functions up and down. There is no noise associated with it either unless it hits something which also would be consistent. If the relase bearing came partially detached, you will get a noise and vibration when you press the clutch pedal. Shifting becomes difficult too.
Clutch Disc: It only spins when the clutch is engaged. The disc doesn't really make noise itself, but it allows the engine's torsional vibrations to transmit to the transmission. Much of these vibrations are dampened out by the springs in the disc's center, but with different spring rates, more vibrations can pass though which means more noise, especially at idle, high gear coast and decel.
My guess is that it is probably the difference in having a stronger disc, but I am only giving a keyboard diagnosis. I don't presume to know the whole situation. If it happens to be that your flywheel is not tight enough, that is a serious issue that should be dealt with immediately. We get very few complaints about noise with the EVO, especially an 03. Most come from people running our solid race discs but that is understandable and we get some complaints from people who have the EVO 9 or other later models that originally have the really weak springs in the disc center.
Keep in mind that lighter flywheels, hot cams, more boost, aftermarket pulleys, etc all cause increased torsional vibration which means more transmission noises. Obviously I am not there to hear the noise you are encountering so I don't know if it is a normal noise or not. Please feel free to contact me directly for more information.
Richard asked that I call you after he got your last message. We actually weren't closed. We have an after lunch safety training (and we celebrate birthdays) once a month with the entire company. but our stupid fancy phone system doesn't make it easy to change the out of office message. It started at 1pm and was over at about 1:40. I called you at about 2:10 but apparently you had already gone home. Judging by the time you were probably on the computer posting this thread, LOL. I left a message at your work (I presume). Sorry I missed you.
Anyway, I was informed of your situation. Richard never told you that the problem was the release bearing so he didn't know where you got that from (it doesn't really matter). A typical release bearing noise doesn't fit the description you give for the noise and of course it didn't help matters.
Aside from the release bearing, here is a breakdown of the other parts and how it affects noise:
Flywheel: It just spins at engine speed and can't make noise unless it is rubbing against something. Of course a lighter flywheel does allow more torsional vibrations to get though to the disc and untimately the transmission which is usually the noise you hear. If the flywheel was not tightened adequately, then there is also a chance to get a noise on or off throttle from the torsional vibrations of the flywheel rattling on the bolts. If that is the case, fix it quick or you will be buying a new crankshaft and flywheel!
Pressure plate: It just spins along with the flywheel. It also functions up and down. There is no noise associated with it either unless it hits something which also would be consistent. If the relase bearing came partially detached, you will get a noise and vibration when you press the clutch pedal. Shifting becomes difficult too.
Clutch Disc: It only spins when the clutch is engaged. The disc doesn't really make noise itself, but it allows the engine's torsional vibrations to transmit to the transmission. Much of these vibrations are dampened out by the springs in the disc's center, but with different spring rates, more vibrations can pass though which means more noise, especially at idle, high gear coast and decel.
My guess is that it is probably the difference in having a stronger disc, but I am only giving a keyboard diagnosis. I don't presume to know the whole situation. If it happens to be that your flywheel is not tight enough, that is a serious issue that should be dealt with immediately. We get very few complaints about noise with the EVO, especially an 03. Most come from people running our solid race discs but that is understandable and we get some complaints from people who have the EVO 9 or other later models that originally have the really weak springs in the disc center.
Keep in mind that lighter flywheels, hot cams, more boost, aftermarket pulleys, etc all cause increased torsional vibration which means more transmission noises. Obviously I am not there to hear the noise you are encountering so I don't know if it is a normal noise or not. Please feel free to contact me directly for more information.
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Jun 15, 2007, 11:20 PM
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The act clutch for some reason just like many others is a very noisey clutch. mine has been grinding and rumbling for about ehhh 40k now nearly 50k miles. The clutch just makes a ton of noise for who only knows what reason. But anyway i wouldnt sweat it as nearly every ACT equiped car i have been around does it. If you want a more technical answer search usernames for ACTMAN he is a CEO or somthing for ACT and will help you out. I am almost positive he would like to hear about the poor customer service you recieved as well!
Edit: btw cams only make it worse at idle lol... Makes the car sound like its going to throw a rod
Edit: btw cams only make it worse at idle lol... Makes the car sound like its going to throw a rod
If it is in fact the cause of that "coffee grinder" noise is because the flywheel isn't tight enough, wouldn't it be very noticable that the crankshaft and flywheel are shot and have to be replaced? But if BaLListic_EVO has heard the same grinding noise for 50k miles....it's probably nothing to worry about and is just normal right? I'm suprised ACTMAN hasn't heard more complaints about this.
Jun 16, 2007, 09:42 AM
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You are 100% correct. But the only way to tell is to take the flywheel off. Of course it won't be long and the flywheel bolts will break off anyway if that is the source of the noise. It is not a common problem except with certain mods that increase the torsional vibration of the engine. These violent rotational pulses of the engine will cause the flywheel to work loose. I just don't want to tell someone that the noise (which I can't hear in person) is normal and have it really be something much more serious (and dangerous) like a flywheel coming off.
Jun 16, 2007, 07:37 PM
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Thanks for the feedback!!
Actman, I left you a message, thanks for returning my call. The noise only happens with the clutch not engaged, shifting is smooth and fluid.
CrackerJackToy, I do hear the clatter in 4th decelerating, no shudder tho, however almost instant engagement!
Yes it does sound like a coffee grinder. My dealership wants to take the tranny apart to make sure it's not a bad bearing in the tranny, covered under warranty. I said go ahead! After reading all of your reponses, I will make sure the dealership checks the flywheel bolts just to make sure.
Just to clarify, it makes the coffee grinder noise in 2nd and 4th, 1st 3rd and 5th do not make the noise when decelerating.
Mods are: DynoFlash, KN Filter, Magnoflow Turbo-back Exhaust, ACT Clutch and Flywheel. 42,000 miles
Im going to let the dealership go through the tranny, and if makes the coffee grinder noise, I'll guess I'll live with it. I just don't want to damage my car.
Actman, I left you a message, thanks for returning my call. The noise only happens with the clutch not engaged, shifting is smooth and fluid.
CrackerJackToy, I do hear the clatter in 4th decelerating, no shudder tho, however almost instant engagement!
Yes it does sound like a coffee grinder. My dealership wants to take the tranny apart to make sure it's not a bad bearing in the tranny, covered under warranty. I said go ahead! After reading all of your reponses, I will make sure the dealership checks the flywheel bolts just to make sure.
Just to clarify, it makes the coffee grinder noise in 2nd and 4th, 1st 3rd and 5th do not make the noise when decelerating.
Mods are: DynoFlash, KN Filter, Magnoflow Turbo-back Exhaust, ACT Clutch and Flywheel. 42,000 miles
Im going to let the dealership go through the tranny, and if makes the coffee grinder noise, I'll guess I'll live with it. I just don't want to damage my car.
Jun 16, 2007, 10:07 PM
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I want to make sure I understand. You said that the noise only happens with the clutch not engaged? I assume you really mean when your foot is off the pedal. Technically the clutch is engaged at that point. Is my assumption correct?
Usually a transmission bearing noise will not be affected by throttle position (accel or decel) so I don't know if that is going to help. I wish I wasn't clear across the country so I could listen personally.
Usually a transmission bearing noise will not be affected by throttle position (accel or decel) so I don't know if that is going to help. I wish I wasn't clear across the country so I could listen personally.
Jun 16, 2007, 10:19 PM
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I have(HAD, sold the car 2 weeks ago) an ACT MB7 HDSS w/prolight flywheel and it was completely silent on decel,shifting,no high rpm lockout at all. Best after market clutch i have ever used. Everytime i read something bad about this clutch i just dont understand it. Unless it wasnt installed and adjusted wrong. I had just over 2k miles on the clutch when i sold the car and it was smooth as glass at any rpm, in any gear,upshifting and down shifting. I would and have recommended this set up to lots of EVO owners who love it just as much as i did.Silky smooth acceleration and it launched the car like a rocket with no smell at all,(if done correctly of course. The new owner also loves it.
Jun 17, 2007, 08:00 AM
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My ACT has been an absolute dream. I had the decel noises with the stock clutch in though, just a little louder now. I've had my clutch in for about 40K and it has been a dream. I would say that the noises you're hearing are normal. Mine makes a similar sound at idle but once the clutch is engaged it goes away, that happens with most/all clutches. A buddy of mine had a ceramic clutch that was VERY loud in neutral without the clutch in.
Jun 17, 2007, 09:07 AM
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quick question.......is this problem RPM Specific for you? cuase i get that same noise every time i drop to around 2krpms, but only at 2k. is that just a vibration point? idk, help?