My bad, it was Kemist- so that is still really high boost. Do you seriously believe its ok to run 28.5 psi safely on 91 octane? It seems like you have kind of been missing the point of this thread... I dont want to run higher boost (30+psi) just to make numbers... and with that in mind I wanted to know how the BBK/Red/Tomei performed at around 28psi using crappy 91 octane and meth/water mix....

 

I think more or less what TTP is trying to say is you can get some gains out of water/meth and 91 octane at lower pressures, but eventually you'll reach the point of the spark plug firing before the piston reaches TDC if by some theoretical chance detonation never occurred, but not enough of a power gain to offset the costs of the water/meth kit. Higher pressure levels has the advantage of raising the effective compression ratio of the engine, and in addition to the water/meth's octane and cooling advantage allows much more power to be made with the advanced timing curve. It's a no-brainer that higher effective compression will make more power, but I completely understand where you're coming from as well as I've tossed the idea around as well since I'm still on a stock bottom end too. In the end I really don't see sub-30psi and w/m injection producing a large enough gain to be worth it for me.

 

Depending on the competence of the tuner, coupled with a more efficient turbo as you have which provides cooler charge air at the same boost levels as the stock turbo and yes with suitable ignition timing you could feasibly run those boost levels without methanol injection.

We have run as high as 43.6psi on the red with methanol injection.

 

I suppose thats true about running higher boost, but really its the advantage of running more timing than 91 octane would allow, along with higher boost that makes it worth it. As far as costs go, the power levels my car is making on a meth tune versus a 91 octane tune justify the $400 spent on the kit. Picking up a 5 gal drum for $30-35 and making it last several tanks of gas is easier and more conveinient than driving across town to the one place I heard sells 100 octane (not even 100% sure they do), and then having to do that for every tank of gas would suck. I spent more on my cat-back alone than I did on the meth kit, so the dollar per horsepower gain is worth it without question. E-85 wasnt an option either. All in all I think the setup I chose gives me a strong broad powerband and makes the most of my limited fueling options I have here in Utah. Could I have made more power with a red, well, yeah. How much more power could I have made safely and reliably for years to come, I don't know, but I'm satisfied for now and content with where its at, my car is not a dyno queen. Down the road in a few years I'll see what options are available when I can afford a built block, who knows... Maybe by then there will be HTA 37R variable geometry turbines that spool as fast as stock but make 37R numbers!? Can you imagine how quick people would be to dump their Reds if tha were the case?

 

I'd say based off what you seem to be looking for, go with the BBK. It will cost as much as the red, but at the level of boost you plan on pushing through your motor, the lag with a red isn't worth it IMHO.

I considered this before I bought my BBK. I wasn't planning on moving big air through the motor. Max to be around 28-30psi on e85 or race gas. Right now it is base tuned around 24psi, and it drives damn close to stock, spooling about 300rpms later. With some fine tuning, it will spool near to a stock IX turbo.

 

thanks for your input- actually went BBK w/meth... dont blame you for not reading thru every post to find that out tho, the thread is getting pretty long I dont notice any noticable lag over the stock turbo