Help! Did my cam install go terribly wrong?!
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Evolved Member
iTrader: (115)
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,295
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From: Albuquerque, NM
UPDATE: See below for the solution to this issue
ISSUE (8-3-2010)
So being my daring, adventurous self, I decided to perform all the 60,000 mile service myself (timing belt, timing belt tensioner adjuster, water pump, balance belt and tensioner) and while I was going to have the car torn apart, why not install some Cosworth 272 M2 cams, a Fidanza adjustable cam gear (for the exhaust cam) and a Megan Racing O2 housing!?
I spent the weeks up to this past weekend reading every thread and How-To on these installs to ensure I was ready. I was confident I could do it given enough time and the right tools.
That said, I successfully installed everything and started the car... now on the not-so-fun part. First of all, the car did start right away. I quadruple checked the timing marks on both cam gears, the crank pulley, oil sprocket and balance shaft sprocket and everything was dead on, so it was no big surprise that the car started okay. Idle was good, considering I've got massive cams in there now. However, as soon as I put the car in gear to back it out of my garage, it wouldn't go anywhere. I would push the gas pedal all the way down and the car would just sit there, hovering around 400 - 500 RPMs. When I take it out of gear and rev it, it revs up fine to redline. Finally I found that by barely applying pressure to the gas pedal, the engine would begin to rev up and allow me to move. Then all of sudden it starts building boost like crazy (~20 PSI at 2500 RPMs) and I have to let off the gas to avoid massive boost spikes. So playing this game, I've managed to hobble around town (this is my daily driver) but obviously something is terribly wrong. When I got home from work yesterday, the hot side of my stock turbo was glowing red hot - as if I have been track racing for hours!
Engine Codes
I've thrown the following codes so far...
P0300
P0500
P0011
I've reset them and they've stayed away.... so far.
Here is what I've checked so far...
1) Cam Gears
Cam gears are both flush with each other - this is the check to ensure that I didn't miss a dowel pin when I installed the gears on the new cams. Both were torqued to spec.
2) Camshaft Position Sensors
Camshaft position sensors are both torqued to spec - here is someplace I wondered about. The P0011 DTC is the MIVEC cam is too advanced. Some people on here have suggested that the position sensor may be 180* out of phase. However, when I checked mine with the car at TDC, the little white mark on the sensor ring is also pointing up (at 12 o'clock). That makes me think that it's not installed upside down. The exhaust sensor doesn't have a mark and therefore it makes me think it doesn't matter. I did notice however that the exhaust cam sensor cover wasn't tightened, which actually explained why there was oil all over the inside of the engine bay.
3) Timing Belt - Timing Marks
The timing belt is properly taught and all the timing marks are aligned. The belt has not jumped a tooth.
4) Spark Plugs
I pulled the plugs to check them out and they appeared fine - used and ready to be replaced, but normal. I went ahead and installed some new, 1 step colder plugs.
5) ECUFlash Tune
Per Merlin's tuning guide for camshaft tuning, I made some adjustments to improve idle by adjusting my timing maps for low loads (0 - 1500 RPMs, 0 - 50 Load) by increasing timing up to 9* and added steps on the idle stepper map. I also modified my MIVEC map per his guide.
6) MISC Checks
MAF cable is connected
Vacuum leaks - couldn't find any (vacuum reading at idle is high - about -8)
O2 sensor is connected
At this point I am at a loss as to what else I should check/try. It is so frustrating to have spent almost 16 hours working on this car over three days, have it start and then not be able to drive it.
I now turn to you, evom! What words of wisdom could you provide?! I have almost convinced myself that any knowledgable tuner would drive/hear/see my car and know exactly what was wrong - too bad I'm not smart enough to figure it out.
Here are my power mods currently installed:
- Megan Racing turbo manifold
- 3" TBE w/ straight pipe
- 3" downpipe
- Megan racing O2 housing
- Injen intake
- Amsoil Dry air filter
- Muse LICP
- APM intercooler
- AMS Short route UICP
- Mini battery and tray
- Cosworth M2 intake and exhaust cams
- Fidanza Adjustable Exhaust cam gear
- Omni power 4-bar map sensor
Before I tore the car down, it ran fine with no DTCs.
Any and all help would be greatly appreciated! Please help me not have to drive my 1986 GMC Sierra 1500 to work anymore!
********* UPDATE: SOLUTION *********
EUREKA! I FOUND IT! THE CAR LIVES AGAIN! (8-14-2010)
I've been waiting for that Eureka! moment for two weeks and I finally got it today. I finally figured out what the problem was! As I mentioned this morning, I approached the car today as if I was replacing the timing belt for the first time, so the first thing I did this morning was take off the timing belt (to put it back on). As soon as I took off the lower timing cover - BAM! I found my problem - and it wasn't "timing" per say! Here is what I found:

Do you see it? As soon as I saw this, I immediately saw that I had installed the crank sensor pane flipped! I never noticed the little "V" cut into the 11 o'clock position marking TDC, and I figured it was symmetric (never-mind the belt marks on the pane indicating the correct orientation. So when I assembled everything back, I had inadvertently installed that pane thing, which tells the car where the crank is, wrong. This explains the massive retardation of the timing - the ECU, per the crank sensor, thought the crank was later that it really was and was firing the spark plug according, which ended up being too late.
Here is how I had it installed:

And it should be like this:

As soon as I saw this, I knew what I had done and what exactly I needed to do to fix it. And of course, I realized that I also spent the entire day yesterday re-installing all my stock parts. So I decided since I had the timing belt off, I might as well re-install the Cosworth cams - so I did. Took two hours and let me tell you. Having done 3 installs of cams now, it is so much easier with the timing belt off!
And I spend most of my time scraping off old RTV then actually replacing the cams.
I decided to reinstall my Megan exhaust parts later as I didn't feel like spending another 4 - 5 hours removing the entire turbo system.
So I put the whole car back together, flashed it for the larger cams, and viola! It runs again, rather amazingly now I might add! It spools much quicker and pulls much harder. I can certainly fell the difference of the cams and Fidanza cam gear. In a month or so I'll add the manifold and O2 housing. Now I just need to tweak my tune to eliminate my knock at high RPMs.
I now extend my sincerest gratitude to the EvoM community. I greatly appreciated all the comments, advice, suggestions, thoughts and encouragement. Thank you! However my ultimate gratitude is to my wife and family who supported me 100% through this whole ordeal. My wife never once complained or expressed any resentment or frustration at this self-inflicted crisis and fully supported all my countless hours in the garage and online searching the forums and web for information. I've been like a ghost to my family for 2 weeks and I know they are, as I am, excited for me to get back to living!
Thank you all again and remember...
WHEN YOU REINSTALL THE CRANKSHAFT SENSOR PANE, MAKE SURE YOU INSTALL IT WITH THE "V" CUT IN THE 11 O'CLOCK POSITION!!!
ISSUE (8-3-2010)
So being my daring, adventurous self, I decided to perform all the 60,000 mile service myself (timing belt, timing belt tensioner adjuster, water pump, balance belt and tensioner) and while I was going to have the car torn apart, why not install some Cosworth 272 M2 cams, a Fidanza adjustable cam gear (for the exhaust cam) and a Megan Racing O2 housing!?
I spent the weeks up to this past weekend reading every thread and How-To on these installs to ensure I was ready. I was confident I could do it given enough time and the right tools.
That said, I successfully installed everything and started the car... now on the not-so-fun part. First of all, the car did start right away. I quadruple checked the timing marks on both cam gears, the crank pulley, oil sprocket and balance shaft sprocket and everything was dead on, so it was no big surprise that the car started okay. Idle was good, considering I've got massive cams in there now. However, as soon as I put the car in gear to back it out of my garage, it wouldn't go anywhere. I would push the gas pedal all the way down and the car would just sit there, hovering around 400 - 500 RPMs. When I take it out of gear and rev it, it revs up fine to redline. Finally I found that by barely applying pressure to the gas pedal, the engine would begin to rev up and allow me to move. Then all of sudden it starts building boost like crazy (~20 PSI at 2500 RPMs) and I have to let off the gas to avoid massive boost spikes. So playing this game, I've managed to hobble around town (this is my daily driver) but obviously something is terribly wrong. When I got home from work yesterday, the hot side of my stock turbo was glowing red hot - as if I have been track racing for hours!
Engine Codes
I've thrown the following codes so far...
P0300
P0500
P0011
I've reset them and they've stayed away.... so far.
Here is what I've checked so far...
1) Cam Gears
Cam gears are both flush with each other - this is the check to ensure that I didn't miss a dowel pin when I installed the gears on the new cams. Both were torqued to spec.
2) Camshaft Position Sensors
Camshaft position sensors are both torqued to spec - here is someplace I wondered about. The P0011 DTC is the MIVEC cam is too advanced. Some people on here have suggested that the position sensor may be 180* out of phase. However, when I checked mine with the car at TDC, the little white mark on the sensor ring is also pointing up (at 12 o'clock). That makes me think that it's not installed upside down. The exhaust sensor doesn't have a mark and therefore it makes me think it doesn't matter. I did notice however that the exhaust cam sensor cover wasn't tightened, which actually explained why there was oil all over the inside of the engine bay.
3) Timing Belt - Timing Marks
The timing belt is properly taught and all the timing marks are aligned. The belt has not jumped a tooth.
4) Spark Plugs
I pulled the plugs to check them out and they appeared fine - used and ready to be replaced, but normal. I went ahead and installed some new, 1 step colder plugs.
5) ECUFlash Tune
Per Merlin's tuning guide for camshaft tuning, I made some adjustments to improve idle by adjusting my timing maps for low loads (0 - 1500 RPMs, 0 - 50 Load) by increasing timing up to 9* and added steps on the idle stepper map. I also modified my MIVEC map per his guide.
6) MISC Checks
MAF cable is connected
Vacuum leaks - couldn't find any (vacuum reading at idle is high - about -8)
O2 sensor is connected
At this point I am at a loss as to what else I should check/try. It is so frustrating to have spent almost 16 hours working on this car over three days, have it start and then not be able to drive it.
I now turn to you, evom! What words of wisdom could you provide?! I have almost convinced myself that any knowledgable tuner would drive/hear/see my car and know exactly what was wrong - too bad I'm not smart enough to figure it out.
Here are my power mods currently installed:
- Megan Racing turbo manifold
- 3" TBE w/ straight pipe
- 3" downpipe
- Megan racing O2 housing
- Injen intake
- Amsoil Dry air filter
- Muse LICP
- APM intercooler
- AMS Short route UICP
- Mini battery and tray
- Cosworth M2 intake and exhaust cams
- Fidanza Adjustable Exhaust cam gear
- Omni power 4-bar map sensor
Before I tore the car down, it ran fine with no DTCs.
Any and all help would be greatly appreciated! Please help me not have to drive my 1986 GMC Sierra 1500 to work anymore!
********* UPDATE: SOLUTION *********
EUREKA! I FOUND IT! THE CAR LIVES AGAIN! (8-14-2010)
I've been waiting for that Eureka! moment for two weeks and I finally got it today. I finally figured out what the problem was! As I mentioned this morning, I approached the car today as if I was replacing the timing belt for the first time, so the first thing I did this morning was take off the timing belt (to put it back on). As soon as I took off the lower timing cover - BAM! I found my problem - and it wasn't "timing" per say! Here is what I found:

Do you see it? As soon as I saw this, I immediately saw that I had installed the crank sensor pane flipped! I never noticed the little "V" cut into the 11 o'clock position marking TDC, and I figured it was symmetric (never-mind the belt marks on the pane indicating the correct orientation. So when I assembled everything back, I had inadvertently installed that pane thing, which tells the car where the crank is, wrong. This explains the massive retardation of the timing - the ECU, per the crank sensor, thought the crank was later that it really was and was firing the spark plug according, which ended up being too late.
Here is how I had it installed:

And it should be like this:

As soon as I saw this, I knew what I had done and what exactly I needed to do to fix it. And of course, I realized that I also spent the entire day yesterday re-installing all my stock parts. So I decided since I had the timing belt off, I might as well re-install the Cosworth cams - so I did. Took two hours and let me tell you. Having done 3 installs of cams now, it is so much easier with the timing belt off!
And I spend most of my time scraping off old RTV then actually replacing the cams. I decided to reinstall my Megan exhaust parts later as I didn't feel like spending another 4 - 5 hours removing the entire turbo system.
So I put the whole car back together, flashed it for the larger cams, and viola! It runs again, rather amazingly now I might add! It spools much quicker and pulls much harder. I can certainly fell the difference of the cams and Fidanza cam gear. In a month or so I'll add the manifold and O2 housing. Now I just need to tweak my tune to eliminate my knock at high RPMs.
I now extend my sincerest gratitude to the EvoM community. I greatly appreciated all the comments, advice, suggestions, thoughts and encouragement. Thank you! However my ultimate gratitude is to my wife and family who supported me 100% through this whole ordeal. My wife never once complained or expressed any resentment or frustration at this self-inflicted crisis and fully supported all my countless hours in the garage and online searching the forums and web for information. I've been like a ghost to my family for 2 weeks and I know they are, as I am, excited for me to get back to living!
Thank you all again and remember...
WHEN YOU REINSTALL THE CRANKSHAFT SENSOR PANE, MAKE SURE YOU INSTALL IT WITH THE "V" CUT IN THE 11 O'CLOCK POSITION!!!
Last edited by Z_Lancer_Man; Aug 14, 2010 at 11:16 PM. Reason: PROBLEM FIXED!
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (115)
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,295
Likes: 4
From: Albuquerque, NM
A good suggestion! Now I made the assumption that the white mark on the intake cam angle sensor was indicative of TDC, but perhaps it's not. Is there any real harm possible by just flipping it 180* and trying it out?
You can flip it, it wont cause any issues it sounds similar to the issue i had when my car trigger had actually come off my exhaust cam
My car wouldnt drive but if i tried to start it it sounds like it was on antilag popping and carrying on and would try build boost, the reason is because the car doesnt know where the cam was to fire correctly, im not saying its ur issue but worth a try, turn ur cam trigger around or make sure its done up!!
My car wouldnt drive but if i tried to start it it sounds like it was on antilag popping and carrying on and would try build boost, the reason is because the car doesnt know where the cam was to fire correctly, im not saying its ur issue but worth a try, turn ur cam trigger around or make sure its done up!!
Both cam sensors make a diff. and need to be indexed correctly, I'll take a pic of a diagram I have from the shop manual and post if for you, it's hard to explain. If that doesn't work don't just clear the codes, check them and see what the car is telling you. I'll try to get the pic up for you soon so you can make sure it is correct.
Here is a pic I took before I looked at the shop manual. The sensor ring in this pic is 180* off. The smaller of the two "teeth" on the sensor ring should be about 45* counter clockwise from the cam dowel pin when at TDC from this view. I'll get the intake cam pic up in a few. If those check out triple check your work, the car ran before so it has to be something you did or overlooked. Hope this helps, good luck man, we don't want you drivin a GMC


Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (115)
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,295
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From: Albuquerque, NM
Here is a pic I took before I looked at the shop manual. The sensor ring in this pic is 180* off. The smaller of the two "teeth" on the sensor ring should be about 45* counter clockwise from the cam dowel pin when at TDC from this view. I'll get the intake cam pic up in a few. If those check out triple check your work, the car ran before so it has to be something you did or overlooked. Hope this helps, good luck man, we don't want you drivin a GMC




Thanks again for taking the time to help me get out of my beater truck!
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Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (115)
Joined: Dec 2003
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From: Albuquerque, NM
Here are the three codes I've seen so far:
P0300
Basically this means that the the car's computer has detected that not all of the engine's cylinders are firing properly.
A P0300 diagnostic code indicates a random or multiple misfire. If the last digit is a number other than zero, it corresponds to the cylinder number that is misfiring. A P0302 code, for example, would tell you cylinder number two is misfiring. Unfortunately, a P0300 doesn't tell you specifically which cylinder(s) is/are mis-firing, nor why.
A P0300 diagnostic code indicates a random or multiple misfire. If the last digit is a number other than zero, it corresponds to the cylinder number that is misfiring. A P0302 code, for example, would tell you cylinder number two is misfiring. Unfortunately, a P0300 doesn't tell you specifically which cylinder(s) is/are mis-firing, nor why.
P0500
A code P0500 may mean that one or more of the following has happened:
The Vehicle Speed Sensor (VSS) is not reading (functioning) properly
There is a broken/frayed wire leading to the vehicle speed sensor
The vehicle's PCM is not correctly configured for the actual tire size on the vehicle
The Vehicle Speed Sensor (VSS) is not reading (functioning) properly
There is a broken/frayed wire leading to the vehicle speed sensor
The vehicle's PCM is not correctly configured for the actual tire size on the vehicle
P0011
A code P0011 refers to the VVT (variable valve timing) or VCT (variable camshaft timing) components and the car's PCM (powertrain control module, also called an ECM). That consists of a few different components but the P0011 DTC specifically refers to the camshaft (cam) timing. In this case, if the cam timing is above a set limit (over-advanced), the engine light will be illluminated and the code will be set. The "A" camshaft is either the intake, left, or front camshaft.
A P0011 DTC trouble code may be caused by one or more of the following:
Incorrect camshaft timing
Wiring problems (harness/wiring) in intake timing control valve control solenoid system
Continuous oil flow to VCT piston chamber
Failed timing valve control solenoid (stuck open)
A P0011 DTC trouble code may be caused by one or more of the following:
Incorrect camshaft timing
Wiring problems (harness/wiring) in intake timing control valve control solenoid system
Continuous oil flow to VCT piston chamber
Failed timing valve control solenoid (stuck open)
Thanks again for the information and I'll be sure to come back here and let all know how I ended up fixing the problems (talk about positive thinking!)
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (115)
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From: Albuquerque, NM
Quick question after looking closely at that diagram - on the intake sensor, what is the reference used to ensure you have it installed correctly? On the exhaust sensor, the small tab is what you reference. However, the intake sensor has 4 symmetric tabs... is it the white mark I see on the end of my sensor tab?
No problem, glad I could help! Sounds to me like its the intake cam sensor ring especially if the other codes are not coming back. Let us know what happens, hopefully we found the problem.
Quick question after looking closely at that diagram - on the intake sensor, what is the reference used to ensure you have it installed correctly? On the exhaust sensor, the small tab is what you reference. However, the intake sensor has 4 symmetric tabs... is it the white mark I see on the end of my sensor tab?
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
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From: Albuquerque, NM
Actually I haven't had a chance to work on it as I've been out of state attending my brother's wedding. However I get back tomorrow night, so I hope to spend some time in it then. I really miss driving the Evo and can't stand my beater! I'll keep you all updated!


