Don't use mobil 1, it will ruin your journal turbo
The color of the oil isn't a reliable indicator of anything in particular, however, the 'High Mileage' versions of M1 are better for your application than 'Extended Performance'.
Evolving Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 485
Likes: 1
From: SoCal
Oil posts are always tough. Ok, we have the specs someone posted on Mobil 1 stuff, so why doesn't the Amsoil guy post up Amsoil spec sheets to compare and let the Consumer make his or her own choice?
Additionally, The fact that some cars have been going to shops with "failures" is not a real guague in an "oil" performance. WAY TOO many variables to see why a failure happend. Bearings could have been spun in other factors, not just "oil wasn't good enough"
If you have a "built" motor it seems that builders are going with the old school testimate and use an oil with ALLOT of additives. Mainly because I see it as a CYA for them. But what still gets me is not all "Built" motors run "race" oil and still live long mechanical lives which proves to me its all about how the car is maintained and used. Not just that "the oil wasn't good enough".
Where does the line get drawn? What Mods would justify a "switch" to a higher zinc and phos content? Who draws this line?
So I have Cosworth M3's on my Evo and BC Valve Springs and Retainers. I have had them on my car for almost 3 yrs. I used Mobil 1 EP 10/30 had no problems, but as my Boost was getting near 28psi and was considering a meth kit, I went with RP XPR 10/40 for the fact that it can hold up to Methanol better. Well the meth kit didn't work out, and I kept using the RP XPR. It was costing me $80 just for the oil and I was thinking, why am I paying this since I DD my car and not actually "race" it. (solo 2 only). I also noticed allot of valve train noise with the RP and I switched back just recently (3 oil changes ago) back to Mobil 1 10/30 EP. All I can say is my valve train noise is gone, when cold, and when warm, my MPG's have gone up from an average of 16.7 to 18.3 and the car just feels overall better. Its hard to explain.
So where is the line drawn? My car makes 310/310 on a MD dyno, and 360/355 on a dynojet, it spikes at 27 psi on 91, tapering to 26 at WOT and Im not sure where it drops to at redline since I don't have my graph right in front of me, but I am guessing around 22psi. Its easy for "Oil Companies, and Vendors" to step up and say, "oh buy our shizzle it is the 8th wonder of GOD" but they really don't know that, they "Believe" that, as they should since they are selling it. So why don't all the Vendors of "Oil" on here post up their respective Oil Companies Spec Sheets on all they sell and let the Consumer make the Choice.
Until then, I will consider the Mobil 1 0-40 next oil change since it is more well suited for a DD car. I still think a 50w is just silly in a DD steet car. What constitutes a race car is still up in the air. Is a 450hp DD car a "race car" is a stripped out car with a roll cage running stock "a race car" I mean a bone stock Evo can be considered a "race car" as I have seen many "stock" evo's with the addition of roll cage only enter in SCCA Rally's. So who draws the line? The Oil companies? or mechanics? or the Consumer? mmmmmm Food for thought.
Additionally, The fact that some cars have been going to shops with "failures" is not a real guague in an "oil" performance. WAY TOO many variables to see why a failure happend. Bearings could have been spun in other factors, not just "oil wasn't good enough"
If you have a "built" motor it seems that builders are going with the old school testimate and use an oil with ALLOT of additives. Mainly because I see it as a CYA for them. But what still gets me is not all "Built" motors run "race" oil and still live long mechanical lives which proves to me its all about how the car is maintained and used. Not just that "the oil wasn't good enough".
Where does the line get drawn? What Mods would justify a "switch" to a higher zinc and phos content? Who draws this line?
So I have Cosworth M3's on my Evo and BC Valve Springs and Retainers. I have had them on my car for almost 3 yrs. I used Mobil 1 EP 10/30 had no problems, but as my Boost was getting near 28psi and was considering a meth kit, I went with RP XPR 10/40 for the fact that it can hold up to Methanol better. Well the meth kit didn't work out, and I kept using the RP XPR. It was costing me $80 just for the oil and I was thinking, why am I paying this since I DD my car and not actually "race" it. (solo 2 only). I also noticed allot of valve train noise with the RP and I switched back just recently (3 oil changes ago) back to Mobil 1 10/30 EP. All I can say is my valve train noise is gone, when cold, and when warm, my MPG's have gone up from an average of 16.7 to 18.3 and the car just feels overall better. Its hard to explain.
So where is the line drawn? My car makes 310/310 on a MD dyno, and 360/355 on a dynojet, it spikes at 27 psi on 91, tapering to 26 at WOT and Im not sure where it drops to at redline since I don't have my graph right in front of me, but I am guessing around 22psi. Its easy for "Oil Companies, and Vendors" to step up and say, "oh buy our shizzle it is the 8th wonder of GOD" but they really don't know that, they "Believe" that, as they should since they are selling it. So why don't all the Vendors of "Oil" on here post up their respective Oil Companies Spec Sheets on all they sell and let the Consumer make the Choice.
Until then, I will consider the Mobil 1 0-40 next oil change since it is more well suited for a DD car. I still think a 50w is just silly in a DD steet car. What constitutes a race car is still up in the air. Is a 450hp DD car a "race car" is a stripped out car with a roll cage running stock "a race car" I mean a bone stock Evo can be considered a "race car" as I have seen many "stock" evo's with the addition of roll cage only enter in SCCA Rally's. So who draws the line? The Oil companies? or mechanics? or the Consumer? mmmmmm Food for thought.
"Mobil-1 Turbo Diesel Truck oil 5w-40"....FTW!!!
I just got off the phone with Mobil Tech division and confirmed that the Mobil-1 Turbo Diesel Truck oil, 5w-40 is the best overall solution for the Evo. The only better solution would be to go to their 15w-50 but would only be needed for the extreme builds. My mind is made up and it's "Mobil-1 Turbo Diesel Truck oil 5w-40" for me
Check out the chart in the link below:
http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...duct_Guide.pdf
Check out the chart in the link below:http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...duct_Guide.pdf
Evolving Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 485
Likes: 1
From: SoCal
I think allot of people don't really know much about oil. I know the vendors on here think they do, but mainly is just general info they learn from product info from the company itself.
If you really want to learn about oil, a good place to start is here.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/cms/
I know the Amsoil guys take allot of this personally and they really shouldn't. No one is saying Amsoil is bad stuff, its not. But saying Mobil 1 paid
to put their name on the oil cap is a little ridicolous. Think of it this way. did indeed research which oil would be best for the Evo, or any car they make for that matter. But, this is where the Amsoil folks get all upset, When people say "best" that can be misunderstood. "best" means many things, and has many factors. Mobil 1 for Mits, as common sense would tell you, 1) Mobil 1 meets the needs of the engine (in question our 4G63). It has the wear properties and the additive package they feel will meet the needs of the engine. 2) The Evo is sold almost world wide, so the oil needs to be available world wide. Mobil 1 can be found anywhere in the world.
Now look at this from perspective. A customer buys an Evo, and has trouble finding a specific synthetic oil. So the owner puts in regular oil. Later the engine has a failure. tries to void the warranty but the customery claim was that the oil you wanted me to use, I could not find, so I used this. Now in court, it would be a toss up. So I think Mobil 1 was chosen for the fact its available damn near everywhere.
All this is up for debate, as this is just a common sense approach. Now allot of people are worried about the ZDDP additives in the oil. Here is quote from "Bob the Oil Guy"
Concern: People are worried about the SM oils not having as much ZDDP as the SL and older oils. The reason ZDDP has been used for years is not because of its superior performance but rather its low cost and dual function as an antioxidant. It also has anticorrosive properties.
There are other additives. Some newer oils do not have any ZDDP, and they are excellent products. Just the same, I prefer oils with ZDP for now. The research shows that 0.03 is all that is needed and has the same function as higher levels. The only reason to have more is because your engine is consuming the ZDDP secondary to borderline lubrication from oil alone.
And lastly, too much can be corrosive itself and has shown in some tests to actually increase wear.
There is also a big debate over which "Viscosity" to use as well. Again, please read up on this before answering so we dont bicker back and forth over things.
As for brand? its all a toss up. It all depends on your personal preference. I personally have used so many brands of oils, just to try them out, that after a while, ordering them online, waiting for the UPS truck, then "oops, I forget to order 1 more quart" then back online, re order, its just a pain in the ***. I like being able to go to the Store, get my oil when I need it, buy it when I want it, and save money on the cost. Most stores get better buys because they sell in bulk, additionally you don't have to pay for shipping either.
So just go with what you like, if you like your $15 a qt racing oil all power to ya, if you like your $23 for 5 qt jug of Mobil 1 all power to ya, in the end, as long as you change the oil often (the additives wear out, not the oil) and just keep your car up on maintenance, no matter which synthetic you choose you will be fine weather you race, DD or just have a garage queen.
If you really want to learn about oil, a good place to start is here.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/cms/
I know the Amsoil guys take allot of this personally and they really shouldn't. No one is saying Amsoil is bad stuff, its not. But saying Mobil 1 paid
to put their name on the oil cap is a little ridicolous. Think of it this way. did indeed research which oil would be best for the Evo, or any car they make for that matter. But, this is where the Amsoil folks get all upset, When people say "best" that can be misunderstood. "best" means many things, and has many factors. Mobil 1 for Mits, as common sense would tell you, 1) Mobil 1 meets the needs of the engine (in question our 4G63). It has the wear properties and the additive package they feel will meet the needs of the engine. 2) The Evo is sold almost world wide, so the oil needs to be available world wide. Mobil 1 can be found anywhere in the world. Now look at this from
perspective. A customer buys an Evo, and has trouble finding a specific synthetic oil. So the owner puts in regular oil. Later the engine has a failure. tries to void the warranty but the customery claim was that the oil you wanted me to use, I could not find, so I used this. Now in court, it would be a toss up. So I think Mobil 1 was chosen for the fact its available damn near everywhere. All this is up for debate, as this is just a common sense approach. Now allot of people are worried about the ZDDP additives in the oil. Here is quote from "Bob the Oil Guy"
Concern: People are worried about the SM oils not having as much ZDDP as the SL and older oils. The reason ZDDP has been used for years is not because of its superior performance but rather its low cost and dual function as an antioxidant. It also has anticorrosive properties.
There are other additives. Some newer oils do not have any ZDDP, and they are excellent products. Just the same, I prefer oils with ZDP for now. The research shows that 0.03 is all that is needed and has the same function as higher levels. The only reason to have more is because your engine is consuming the ZDDP secondary to borderline lubrication from oil alone.
And lastly, too much can be corrosive itself and has shown in some tests to actually increase wear.
There is also a big debate over which "Viscosity" to use as well. Again, please read up on this before answering so we dont bicker back and forth over things.
As for brand? its all a toss up. It all depends on your personal preference. I personally have used so many brands of oils, just to try them out, that after a while, ordering them online, waiting for the UPS truck, then "oops, I forget to order 1 more quart" then back online, re order, its just a pain in the ***. I like being able to go to the Store, get my oil when I need it, buy it when I want it, and save money on the cost. Most stores get better buys because they sell in bulk, additionally you don't have to pay for shipping either.
So just go with what you like, if you like your $15 a qt racing oil all power to ya, if you like your $23 for 5 qt jug of Mobil 1 all power to ya, in the end, as long as you change the oil often (the additives wear out, not the oil) and just keep your car up on maintenance, no matter which synthetic you choose you will be fine weather you race, DD or just have a garage queen.
I think allot of people don't really know much about oil. I know the vendors on here think they do, but mainly is just general info they learn from product info from the company itself.
If you really want to learn about oil, a good place to start is here.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/cms/
I know the Amsoil guys take allot of this personally and they really shouldn't. No one is saying Amsoil is bad stuff, its not. But saying Mobil 1 paid to put their name on the oil cap is a little ridicolous. Think of it this way. did indeed research which oil would be best for the Evo, or any car they make for that matter. But, this is where the Amsoil folks get all upset, When people say "best" that can be misunderstood. "best" means many things, and has many factors. Mobil 1 for Mits, as common sense would tell you, 1) Mobil 1 meets the needs of the engine (in question our 4G63). It has the wear properties and the additive package they feel will meet the needs of the engine. 2) The Evo is sold almost world wide, so the oil needs to be available world wide. Mobil 1 can be found anywhere in the world.
Now look at this from perspective. A customer buys an Evo, and has trouble finding a specific synthetic oil. So the owner puts in regular oil. Later the engine has a failure. tries to void the warranty but the customery claim was that the oil you wanted me to use, I could not find, so I used this. Now in court, it would be a toss up. So I think Mobil 1 was chosen for the fact its available damn near everywhere.
All this is up for debate, as this is just a common sense approach. Now allot of people are worried about the ZDDP additives in the oil. Here is quote from "Bob the Oil Guy"
Concern: People are worried about the SM oils not having as much ZDDP as the SL and older oils. The reason ZDDP has been used for years is not because of its superior performance but rather its low cost and dual function as an antioxidant. It also has anticorrosive properties.
There are other additives. Some newer oils do not have any ZDDP, and they are excellent products. Just the same, I prefer oils with ZDP for now. The research shows that 0.03 is all that is needed and has the same function as higher levels. The only reason to have more is because your engine is consuming the ZDDP secondary to borderline lubrication from oil alone.
And lastly, too much can be corrosive itself and has shown in some tests to actually increase wear.
There is also a big debate over which "Viscosity" to use as well. Again, please read up on this before answering so we dont bicker back and forth over things.
As for brand? its all a toss up. It all depends on your personal preference. I personally have used so many brands of oils, just to try them out, that after a while, ordering them online, waiting for the UPS truck, then "oops, I forget to order 1 more quart" then back online, re order, its just a pain in the ***. I like being able to go to the Store, get my oil when I need it, buy it when I want it, and save money on the cost. Most stores get better buys because they sell in bulk, additionally you don't have to pay for shipping either.
So just go with what you like, if you like your $15 a qt racing oil all power to ya, if you like your $23 for 5 qt jug of Mobil 1 all power to ya, in the end, as long as you change the oil often (the additives wear out, not the oil) and just keep your car up on maintenance, no matter which synthetic you choose you will be fine weather you race, DD or just have a garage queen.
If you really want to learn about oil, a good place to start is here.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/cms/
I know the Amsoil guys take allot of this personally and they really shouldn't. No one is saying Amsoil is bad stuff, its not. But saying Mobil 1 paid
to put their name on the oil cap is a little ridicolous. Think of it this way. did indeed research which oil would be best for the Evo, or any car they make for that matter. But, this is where the Amsoil folks get all upset, When people say "best" that can be misunderstood. "best" means many things, and has many factors. Mobil 1 for Mits, as common sense would tell you, 1) Mobil 1 meets the needs of the engine (in question our 4G63). It has the wear properties and the additive package they feel will meet the needs of the engine. 2) The Evo is sold almost world wide, so the oil needs to be available world wide. Mobil 1 can be found anywhere in the world. Now look at this from
perspective. A customer buys an Evo, and has trouble finding a specific synthetic oil. So the owner puts in regular oil. Later the engine has a failure. tries to void the warranty but the customery claim was that the oil you wanted me to use, I could not find, so I used this. Now in court, it would be a toss up. So I think Mobil 1 was chosen for the fact its available damn near everywhere. All this is up for debate, as this is just a common sense approach. Now allot of people are worried about the ZDDP additives in the oil. Here is quote from "Bob the Oil Guy"
Concern: People are worried about the SM oils not having as much ZDDP as the SL and older oils. The reason ZDDP has been used for years is not because of its superior performance but rather its low cost and dual function as an antioxidant. It also has anticorrosive properties.
There are other additives. Some newer oils do not have any ZDDP, and they are excellent products. Just the same, I prefer oils with ZDP for now. The research shows that 0.03 is all that is needed and has the same function as higher levels. The only reason to have more is because your engine is consuming the ZDDP secondary to borderline lubrication from oil alone.
And lastly, too much can be corrosive itself and has shown in some tests to actually increase wear.
There is also a big debate over which "Viscosity" to use as well. Again, please read up on this before answering so we dont bicker back and forth over things.
As for brand? its all a toss up. It all depends on your personal preference. I personally have used so many brands of oils, just to try them out, that after a while, ordering them online, waiting for the UPS truck, then "oops, I forget to order 1 more quart" then back online, re order, its just a pain in the ***. I like being able to go to the Store, get my oil when I need it, buy it when I want it, and save money on the cost. Most stores get better buys because they sell in bulk, additionally you don't have to pay for shipping either.
So just go with what you like, if you like your $15 a qt racing oil all power to ya, if you like your $23 for 5 qt jug of Mobil 1 all power to ya, in the end, as long as you change the oil often (the additives wear out, not the oil) and just keep your car up on maintenance, no matter which synthetic you choose you will be fine weather you race, DD or just have a garage queen.
I actually read the info in your link and basically threw out everything I thought i knew about oil......
My new choice of oil is Mobil 1 0w-40 which has slightly less zinc and phosphorus, but all of the other specs are better as well as better lubrication at start-up.
The oils you posted are great oils and its nice to see the zinc levels on each. Good filter list too. Thanks for all the info and your time on this!
Another good read on Europe and American oils and how they differ:
http://www.upmpg.com/tech_articles/oil_bottle.htm
I know I brought up the European specs. Do you think an oil has to be a higher standard to pass the Porsche A40 spec? I know Mobil1 0w-40 is. Just curious.
http://www.lglubricantes.com.ar/prod...erJuly2009.pdf
The factory fill for at least some (if not all) Porsche gasoline engines in the USA is apparently M1 0w-40, and it apparently fits all the VW requirements, Nissan "GTR", and various others, so this provides some guidance.
http://www.mobil.com/usa-english/lub...il_1_0w-40.asp
good to know, I understand the color has nothing to do with it, but its just good to see it not turn black right away. But out of curiosity you do think the high mileage M1 is better?
what about weights, being that im almost stock and winter coming up i would think 10w-30, but seeing lots of different weights on here?
what about weights, being that im almost stock and winter coming up i would think 10w-30, but seeing lots of different weights on here?
The High Mileage version is better for your purposes, because you're more interested in something formulated with a focus on extreme pressure additives than something formulated for those trying to go 15k miles between oil changes. If your engine has more than 80-100k miles, I would consider moving from 30 to 40 weight.
sounds good and im over 85k so will be giving that a try next time around
The High Mileage version is better for your purposes, because you're more interested in something formulated with a focus on extreme pressure additives than something formulated for those trying to go 15k miles between oil changes. If your engine has more than 80-100k miles, I would consider moving from 30 to 40 weight.
Evolving Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 485
Likes: 1
From: SoCal
Before you DO ANYTHING on an oil purchase, PLEASE Educate yourself by going to this site.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/cms/
Then make your own choice. I can't empasize this enough. Im not going to argue with people, or debate a subject that people need to read up on first. Then lets talk.
IMO Bone Stock Evo or even slightly modified 0-30 synthetic from who ever you want.
READ THE SITE I PUT UP>>>>>IT WILL HELP YOU DECIDE
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/cms/
Then make your own choice. I can't empasize this enough. Im not going to argue with people, or debate a subject that people need to read up on first. Then lets talk.
IMO Bone Stock Evo or even slightly modified 0-30 synthetic from who ever you want.
READ THE SITE I PUT UP>>>>>IT WILL HELP YOU DECIDE
Last edited by Jeffs2006EVOIX; Oct 6, 2010 at 05:10 PM.
