Um, you're jumping to conclusions again. I'll post more results of my testing on Monday. Wait until then to rush to any judgements.

 

Talk to me when they go over 400 wheel HP and then I will be impressed - because thats what modified evo's are going to have

 

1) Many of you were wrong about inexpensive modifications for the STi. Dan Godspeed has achieved 301 HP and 312 TQ at 16.8 psi with conservative AFR and zero pinging by installing downpipe, Blitz SUS and the Turbo XS HPBC for only $750.00. How much have you spent so far Big Al? His numbers will improve with an ECU controller just as they have with the EVO. Probably not as much because it was not necesssary for Subaru to enrichen the STi's AFR as much as MMC had to for the EVO to prevent detonation at WOT and max boost.

It's gonna take a turbo to get the STi to the next level where real HP will be developed. I think it'll take the same for an EVO which will continue to be running at the edge with regard to boost and AFR.

2) And many of you will be wrong about getting the STi into the mid 12s. Just wait and see. The additional power will make up for the extra shift.

Just admit that the STi is a good car starting out with more power from stock and it is going to make more power than an EVO with similar mods. It's simple math.

I am not surprised by any of this and I am still glad that I bought an EVO.

 

I know how much power is needed to run decent 1/4 mile times with that 6 speed - - IF I were going to run a WRC rally or off roading it would be my first choice - however for drag racing runs the 6 speed is a big handicap - - I needed BIG power to break into the 11's with my STI 6 speed set up

Interestingly the 5 speed wrx and 5 speed evo seem to be making the same 1/4 mile times for the same HP - at least that is what i have found from my results on my evo compared to my old time slips on my wrx - - - the 1/8th time is a little off on my evo (I think I may be shifting too high in the power band) but b y the end of the 1/4 mile the et and trap is the same as my WRX was at the same dyno hp figure

 

Your error all along has been to make too many assumptions about the STI, which simply aren't panning out. For instance the STI is average .3 sec faster than the EVo in the 1/4 in spite of having to make the extra shift to 5 right before the finish.
Evo has it's maximum theoretical gearing advantage RIGHT NOW. Once you add power that advantage evaporates, as the STI will not have to make any additional shifts.

And it's funny that you mention the WRX 5 speed as being equiv. to the Evo in the quarter, since the necessary 3- 4 shift in the 1/4 is similar to a 3 - 5 shift in the STI in terms of ratio, with the big difference being the 2.5l STI has more mid range torque. Suppose
the STI torque monster skips 4th altogether, what then? Your experience with different ratios and a smaller less torquey engine may not apply.

Lastly Stage 1 WRXs making 300-310 hp are also in the 13 - 13.2 range in the 1/4 no better than STI with 300 hp, and again both on average a bit faster than the stock Evo. Where is the advantage in the 5's?

So you can't count on the 5 speed to save you, I don't think. It's just more wishful thinking.

 

To be fair, if people are going to talk about how much less the STi mods are costing, then you gotta add in the ~$2000 extra that the STi costs in the first place. So $750 is actually more like ~$2750.

 

And a Neon SRT is under $20k. Give me a break. Yet another example of the human mind's infinite capacity to rationlize.

 

my wrx was 12.78 in the 1/4 with 300 wheel hp - and my evo is also 12.74 in the 1/4 mile with 317 wheel hp - with more time to be shaved after I learn how to shift better - - attached is my slip from yesterday

I am sorry BTW but a car you have to shift from 3rd to 5th is retarded

I already played with the 6 spd and STI toys enough to know the deal - - I'm still the 2nd fastest WRX in the US ever - 124 mph in the 1/4 miler on street tires - and 5 shifts - so I think I am qualified to comment - my STI had much more power than any US STI will have for some time to come

 

We are talking about the comparison of two very similar cars. Similar not only in power numbers, but the fact they are the same type of car. You know...like maybe an RSX vs Celica or maybe Miata vs MR Spyder. Price difference does come into play when people decide on cars that are direct competition for one another. Can you your mind rationalize that? Take some time and think about it awhile, maybe you'll get it. And if you can show me an easy AWD mod for the Neon then you can talk.

The point is that if one car is much cheaper to mod than the other one, it doesn't really come cheaper if you have to pay more in the first place. And we won't get into the suspension/handling or the steering rack that someone may want on an STi to equate the Evo's. Talk about the mind's ability to rationalize....a perfect example is all the STi folks that read the reviews and said 'Well... I wanted a softer everyday ride anyway and I didn't want the car to move if I sneezed". Oh please....30hp advantage and is still in second place. And you're talking about people rationalizing?

I don't even own either car. I don't even know if I want either car yet. I follow both sets of forums and this is what I see. It's your fanboyism blinding you.

 

Sorry

 

Anyway - didn't like EVERY professional magazine that compared them rate the evo #1 over the sti ??? They did that even with the 30 hp sti advantage

BTW - if I wanted a stroker - a stroked evo would do the same thing as a stroked suby - - personally I rather have more rpms and more boost

 

First of all this thread speaks to 1/4 mile performance and associated modifications. It does not begin to discuss the performance merits both these cars offer as far as AWD, handling, and everyday real-world driviability. So save that for an appropriate thread.

Within that context, considering your comments about the additional $2k cost of the STi, my Neon SRT reply is indeed relevant. If you are going to focus on 1/4 mile performance capabilities, related expenses, and essentially bang-for-the-buck value, which this thread does, then a $20k SRT should be both included and allowed $12K worth of modifications to equal the same total cost layout. In the absence of other guidance or restrictions, this would seem reasonable following your rationale to include the additional cost associated with the STi. I further assert that said SRT, with total $32k value, will smoke either an EVO or an STi in 1/4 mile performance.

I believe that both the EVO and STi are spectacular performance cars whose potential extends far beyond 1320' of asphalt. I DO own one of these cars, an EVO, which I am completely satisfied with. I am sure that I would be equally satisfied, for different reasons, had I purchased an STi.

As far as your "fanboyism" comment goes, seems to me the real "fanboy" here is the one who follows both forums, asserts theoretical rhetoric to feel like he is included, and then dreams of owning either one when he grows up.

 

You ever heard of following both forums so that one can be informed about both cars when trying to decide between the two competitors. And "dreams of buying one when grown up"? And so how old are you? I bet I am older than you. Maybe there are some of us who are reading up on these 4dr sportscars because they may need to give up a 2dr sportscar due to having children and needing a 4dr car but not wanting to give up too much driving fun.

And if you reread the first post, this thread did not start out talking about 1/4 mile times for any car. It started out talking about how either the Evo or STi was cheaper to mod to get to 300 hp and certain times. So if talking about the two cars, you have to consider the total price it took to get there.

Listen.... truce time. I didn't mean to sound like I was attacking you or the Neon SRT. I apologize. I have been looking at differences btwn the STi and Evo since I am still very undecided. Considering that they are supposed to be very close competitors, I was pointing out the price difference that I don't see mentioned much on either set of forums. And I just took your post to be one of those 'Why buy that $30k car, I could buy a used Civic for $5000 and use the extra $25k and smoke it".

 

I saw a couple of those turbo neons at the track this week and they were not in the same leauge - nice car for $20,000 but they have limitations - (unless you want to run drag slicks)

 

Nice bit of attitude Al, but of course that doesn't answer the question does it? Again if the 3-5 shift in the STI is similar in ratio to the 3-4 shift in the WRX, then where is the advantage in having only 5 gears?

You need to remember that 3rd 4th 5th are just numbers attached to the gear ratios. It's the gear ratios themselves that matter.

In theory a car might have a ten speed, you might use 1 3 5 and 7 at the 1/4 mile. You might use 2,3,4,5 and 6 at an autox. You might Use 2 4 7 and 10 on the road. The 10 speed would just give you options not available on the 6 or 5 speeds.

Of course I'm being faciteous, but the point is....you have not demonstrated any disadvantage in performance inherent in a 6 speed. Heck, I don't even think you can buy a 5 speed Evo anymore, anywhere outside of the US. I think the US Evo has a 5 speed for the sole purpose of saving money for Mitsubishi. There is no performance advantage in the Evo having only 5 gears.

Ultimately you have gone from the fantasy that the STI cannot be easily modded for power, to the even more amusing fantasy that the STI will be hindered because it has a six speed. Your rationalisations are getting a bit desparate.