the two passenger part is what confused me. i thought you meant the two passengers were 200lb each.

i understand now.

 

That's close to my car... well.. with mine on pump. I need to hurry up and drive this tank of gas off and make myexhaust tips turn white. Nice results!

 

Actually. . The total weight of the passengers is 407. Lol yeah we hungry!

 

Not including the 3 5gallon containers of e85 in the car while logging these pulls.

 

 

I know whose car this is, saw all this stuff getting installed. Car really is a beast (for an X).

 

surprised you don't need to build the short block with 500whp.

 

why ?
i time-attacked my evo @ 600 whp for years on a stock motor

 

Helps bad tuners not blow up motors

 

Are you serious? How much torque? If that's the case, then I might be using your services once I install my ef2.5 this weekend, with id 1000cc injectors. Btw I never launch my cars.

 

400-350 ftlbs alll day

27 psi on dyno

33psi flat on track....

 

said the guy who blew up a few already...just messin with you.

in all seriousness, most tunes i've seen that go for big hp (500+) gets the short block upgraded with religious fervor to avoid throwing a rod or other sorts of similar disasters. those on stock blocks are usually de-tuned to that effect. call it safe tuning, rule of thumb, misinformation, etc. i'd like to believe that the stock block can handle it, but i've seen no wealth of evidence proving that such tunes lasted a long time or for a DD. not saying your experience doesn't count, just making an observation.

what do i know, though. i make no claims on knowing how to tune 3D maps, and cobb socal (de)tuned mine on 91oct @ 24psi, saying flat out that the stock block won't survive E85 on a Black at full spool. i'm sure you're an authority when it comes to talking about tuning and limits...is E85/600/400 @ 30psi possible for a stock block DD and have it last?

 

keeping torque down is the key, and clearly Jon knows how to do that and knows what hes doing. He doesn't dumb down the knock sensor or any of that stuff either. He also doesn't use the same timing values for high oct and low oct to force the car to run the same timing like i seen others do. Hes a smart tuner, and smart tuners can make stock internals stay together longer.

you would be surprised what you can do with a 3 port and proper timing to control the tq curve.

A FP black is safer to do it with then a smaller quicker spooling turbo that creates a lot of low end tq.

Murlos other tuner (not mentioning names) is known for being aggressive when it comes to tq curves. His stock engine would have lasted much longer if different techniques were used.

 

In all fairness when I was pushing the stock block, very very few people if any had pushed it as hard as I did. I was dumb and wanted lots of power and put 33psi through the motor with a quick spool fpred and made over 450wtq. Also, my tuner did what he thought was right, tuned it exactly how he tunes evo 8/9's and his 8/9's have a lot better luck than I ever did. There are literally 100's of things that could've caused all my failures, I think the stock block was pushed too hard (mostly my fault) and the 1st built motor was a culmination of things.

That being said, I would not personally push a stock block very far anymore even with a perfect tune, mainly as I just don't see the purpose as if it pops you are shelling out another 2500 on top of a motor build. I miss my 2500 dollars

Also, the more you push a setup, the less room for error, less room for bad fuel, bad spark plugs, popped off boost lines etc etc. I like having headroom and on something 550whp+ I'm building the motor.

I do think this thread shows a very good tune and something that will last given no mechanical issues plenty of time, I wouldn't push it too much further on the stock block, its in a great spot in my opinion.

 

tuning a stock block 8/9 for 450tq on a red is not something i would do, unless the cars making 600WHP+ & it absolutely needed that tq at high rpm to achieve that peak HP.

I am in full agreement with you on the more power you make, the more risk you take in general. I'm sure your old tuner gave you the option to be conservative, and you chose not to do so it sounds like, so that wouldn't be his fault then.

when you pop an engine it does give you a bad taste in your mouth, even if it is mechanical and not even power related. It is not a fun experience, im sure you'll agree lol

live and learn!