AMS Dual Exhaust?
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
people need to stop complaining. if they want 2 complain just get something else there are hundreds of other people who are willing to wait. you really think that 350$ exhaust will sound the same or give you the performance? lol yeah no. AMS should not have to be defending themselfs when they did nothing wrong the rest of you need a chill pill
$350 would hardly cover the cost of 3" piping for a catback much less the cost of the downpipe and mid pipe on that turbo back you said your friend bought... R&D takes time but in the end the product will speak for itself I'm sure. I guarantee you that $350 turbo back won't make nearly the same hp figures as a well designed and built turbo back that might cost $1,000 for the dp/test pipe/catback
Many people share your opinion but the problem is that until you know what goes in to not just producing but designing a system it's hard to understand that you can't make a system that cheap. With Engineering and production costs along with the cost of material our cost on a system would not even be close to that.
Sure you could find a system that works, copy it and mass produce it overseas but now you have a system of lesser quality and you are cutting the legs out from the company that engineered it. As you hurt their sales they now cannot make other products....soon you have nothing to copy.
If it was a simple as "bent tubes" there would be thousands of systems on the market, obviously that is not the case.
I have said it a thousand times on EVO M... You get what you pay for.
Eric
Sure you could find a system that works, copy it and mass produce it overseas but now you have a system of lesser quality and you are cutting the legs out from the company that engineered it. As you hurt their sales they now cannot make other products....soon you have nothing to copy.
If it was a simple as "bent tubes" there would be thousands of systems on the market, obviously that is not the case.
I have said it a thousand times on EVO M... You get what you pay for.
Eric
thats just my .02 cents
people need to stop complaining. if they want 2 complain just get something else there are hundreds of other people who are willing to wait. you really think that 350$ exhaust will sound the same or give you the performance? lol yeah no. AMS should not have to be defending themselfs when they did nothing wrong the rest of you need a chill pill
Ya i understand that, but lets see, how much are you planning to charge for these, "highly Engineered" exhausts , either way if you were to charge let say 1200 for these youll have a few customers and have large profits, but if you were to lower the profits and charge something a lil bit more reasonable you will have alot more customers resulting into more profit in the long run, but either way , i guess you guys have done this for years, but i would just recommend, not looking at what everybody else is charging and pricing it accordingly, you guys should charge wat it cost you to make it + a lil bit of profit .
thats just my .02 cents
thats just my .02 cents
no secrets here
Eric
Its metal , damm just because it says AMS performance on the side now all of a sudden its gives you 20 hp , no wth, if i was to get there exhaust take it to a local body shop to recreate it EXACTLY and sell it with the name "ANS performance" and put a lower price people like you would still go for ams just because of the name, i just got my exhaust done at a local body shop for 100.00 i know if i would have take it to AMS and asked them to do the exact thing they would have charged me like 400 $ or w.e and take alot longer, mine took 2 hours and it sounded amazing, look at the thread i opened and listen to the audio , plus i can feel an incredible hp gain .
Eric
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
with most shops using crap metal and also its not dyno tuned look at people who produce exhaust what does a normal dyno run cost x how many runs they do it to perfect it it may be there own dyno but noone works for free. and i am sure they dont have a lack of customers. you guys need to stop complaining
Evolving Member
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 273
Likes: 0
From: Glastonbury, CT / Boston, MA
Its metal , damm just because it says AMS performance on the side now all of a sudden its gives you 20 hp , no wth, if i was to get there exhaust take it to a local body shop to recreate it EXACTLY and sell it with the name "ANS performance" and put a lower price people like you would still go for ams just because of the name, i just got my exhaust done at a local body shop for 100.00 i know if i would have take it to AMS and asked them to do the exact thing they would have charged me like 400 $ or w.e and take alot longer, mine took 2 hours and it sounded amazing, look at the thread i opened and listen to the audio , plus i can feel an incredible hp gain .
Newbie
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 74
Likes: 0
From: Ohio
People should want their favorite brands to charge a reasonable price where they make money, which gives them incentives to continue to serve that market. I cant imagine these guys can make much with what under 2K EVO Xs in the US total. If they were to assume they could get 5-10 % of the overall market, and thats probably a long shot (since 1/2 probably dont mod) , and they made 100% profit per system, they still wouldn't be making that much money. These EVO exhaust systems are fairly cheap (except JDM) anyway vs what say a BMW owner would pay Dinan (or whatever). Hell, with what EVO's cost in other markets even ignoring VAT (Russia, GB, Eurozone, Asia) I just hope Mitsui doesnt pull out of the US market.
Former Sponsor
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 984
Likes: 0
From: Chicagoland
I would like to take this time to thank those customers that are being patient and waiting for our twin tip exhaust.
While I am here, I would like to go into a bit more detail on what it takes to bring a quality exhaust to market. I was involved in the design and production of the original twin tip that built and tested.
First, a note on our single tip system. Some things you might notice about that system is the care that was taken to route the exhaust in a way that kept ground clearance to as close to factory as possible. Where some exhaust systems on the market compromised on ground clearance and ran straight pipes, we took the times to put the bends in the exhaust to clear obstructions properly. This adds complexity and cost to the system. Our single tip exhaust is 100% stainless steel. Our hangers are designed to use factory rubber isolators properly (not flat stock bent up with a bolt running through it. We also use solid stock (not hollow) for our hangers to ensure that your exhaust stays connected to your car for years and years. We use bolt together flanges at connections just like a factory exhaust.... not leaky slip joints or muffler clamps to hold the exhaust together. Again, this increases the complexity and cost of mass producing the system as everything needs to be exact.
We could have gone about it the easy way and just cheated bends by welding on flanges at angles or going off tangent on bends but we took the time to do it right. We want people to be happy with their purchase down the road... not for just the first 6 months. AMS is proud of our quality and we keep high standards when it comes to producing parts.
On to the twin tip. This is the most complicated production exhaust we have ever made. From the CAT to the rear axle we hold the same quality fabrication as our single tip exhaust. Keeping that in mind, this exhaust has a very complicated transition from a single pipe to two pipes. Making this transition to AMS quality and doing it on a production level is not an easy task. This critical transition is what makes this exhaust so unique and allows the "tuning" of the sound of the system. While it would have been simple to do a twin tip exhaust like every other system out there, we wanted the ground clearance you can only get from running a single pipe under the rear cross member in the factory position. This limits the space that you can make the transition from a single pipe to two pipes to a very small area in the rear of the car. This also puts this transition in a bend. We also need to incorporate the flanges for the tuning disks in this area further limiting the space. Getting all of this perfect and keeping it simple enough to mass produce is a challenge. In addition to everything else, we are also currently trying to make it viable to offer different tip options on the exhaust.... possibly even user changeable tips to change the style of your exhaust in addition to the sound of the system.
In the end, This exhaust should be lighter than any other twin tip (except for that crazy Ti system) as we are not running two pipes all the way back. It should also offer the greatest power potential of any exhaust as you can run it wide open and basically bypass the muffler. Of course, it will be one of the finest exhaust systems you can buy for your Evo X and will have all the quality ams engineering and fabrication that we put into everything we produce.
We are disappointed that it is taking this long to get it on the market but as Eric mentioned, We will not compromise the quality of any AMS product to get it out quicker.
Thanks again to those that are waiting. It will be worth the wait.
While I am here, I would like to go into a bit more detail on what it takes to bring a quality exhaust to market. I was involved in the design and production of the original twin tip that built and tested.
First, a note on our single tip system. Some things you might notice about that system is the care that was taken to route the exhaust in a way that kept ground clearance to as close to factory as possible. Where some exhaust systems on the market compromised on ground clearance and ran straight pipes, we took the times to put the bends in the exhaust to clear obstructions properly. This adds complexity and cost to the system. Our single tip exhaust is 100% stainless steel. Our hangers are designed to use factory rubber isolators properly (not flat stock bent up with a bolt running through it. We also use solid stock (not hollow) for our hangers to ensure that your exhaust stays connected to your car for years and years. We use bolt together flanges at connections just like a factory exhaust.... not leaky slip joints or muffler clamps to hold the exhaust together. Again, this increases the complexity and cost of mass producing the system as everything needs to be exact.
We could have gone about it the easy way and just cheated bends by welding on flanges at angles or going off tangent on bends but we took the time to do it right. We want people to be happy with their purchase down the road... not for just the first 6 months. AMS is proud of our quality and we keep high standards when it comes to producing parts.
On to the twin tip. This is the most complicated production exhaust we have ever made. From the CAT to the rear axle we hold the same quality fabrication as our single tip exhaust. Keeping that in mind, this exhaust has a very complicated transition from a single pipe to two pipes. Making this transition to AMS quality and doing it on a production level is not an easy task. This critical transition is what makes this exhaust so unique and allows the "tuning" of the sound of the system. While it would have been simple to do a twin tip exhaust like every other system out there, we wanted the ground clearance you can only get from running a single pipe under the rear cross member in the factory position. This limits the space that you can make the transition from a single pipe to two pipes to a very small area in the rear of the car. This also puts this transition in a bend. We also need to incorporate the flanges for the tuning disks in this area further limiting the space. Getting all of this perfect and keeping it simple enough to mass produce is a challenge. In addition to everything else, we are also currently trying to make it viable to offer different tip options on the exhaust.... possibly even user changeable tips to change the style of your exhaust in addition to the sound of the system.
In the end, This exhaust should be lighter than any other twin tip (except for that crazy Ti system) as we are not running two pipes all the way back. It should also offer the greatest power potential of any exhaust as you can run it wide open and basically bypass the muffler. Of course, it will be one of the finest exhaust systems you can buy for your Evo X and will have all the quality ams engineering and fabrication that we put into everything we produce.
We are disappointed that it is taking this long to get it on the market but as Eric mentioned, We will not compromise the quality of any AMS product to get it out quicker.
Thanks again to those that are waiting. It will be worth the wait.
