Hey guys,
I'm in the ring to buy a new used car. I've narrowed it down to an STI and an EVO. I posted over at iwsti.com to which I should buy, and they obviously said the STI..

.. but they also mentioned transmission failures on the GSR and the MR EVO's ? I don't quite understand this.. can someone point me towards a couple of threads that deal with this issue ? Is it just the GSR or MR ? Whats the power limit that can be achieved on the stock transmission ?

The STI's have the ringland failures.. and the EVO's have transmission issues now too ?

Tell me what all the commotion about the tranny's are. I tried searching transmission, but only got threads about the difficult of shifting and grinding and similar issues.

Thanks !

 

the gsr tranny is pretty stout. people complain about the notchiness but it never bothered me. it drives like crap when it isn't warmed up though.

the mr tranny is an automated manual twin clutch thinga-ma-jig that had some minor programming issues initially but (as far as I know) has been corrected. the mr tranny (sst) also has cap on the amount of power it can handle (like 350whp) but i believe there are aftermarket clutch packs that you can get if you wanted added piece of mind running more power. the tranny at first wasn't serviceable but apparently now it is. i am sure someone in the know will have more to say on that.

 

The only thing i have to complain about is the stock clutch i would replace it asap if you buy a used X.

 

Well, The STI does have a very good tranny considering its 6 speed. But the Engine has its limitations in stock form. Mods are going to be more expensive compared to the Evo and working on the car is harder due to its non-conventional design.

The evo on the other hand has a very good 5 speed manual in the GSR form. The gear teeth have been widened and beefed up compared to the older evo's. So anybody that tells you that the new evo has tranny issues, they are either talking out of their asses or they're talking about the MR. As for the engine, the 4B11T is a jewel compared to the STI's. It can just handle a lot more than the STI in stock form. Reference: Ryan Gates.

Having said that, The MR trades that strength for something the STI does not even offer: A DUAL CLUTCH AUTOMATED MANUAL. It basically seems to operate like an automatic transmission from the user's perspective, but on the inside, its nothing like an automatic. Its a very tricky gearbox. Similar automated manual gearboxes are used in the VW GTI, M3, Porsche etc. On the track, it basically gives you rev-matched shifts like you were a pro driver without the delay and bulkiness of an automatic transmission. Gear changes are swift and perfect in super sport mode for the track, ensuring you're always in your powerband. Modifications are available to beef up this tranny from South Side Performance (SSP), but its an expensive affair and the MR is going to be more expensive than an STI to begin with. You gotta pay to play.

mod for mod, the new evo, just like the older evo's, is cheaper and will be easier to establish better results for average and newcomer drivers than the STI. On the turns, it is absolutely a monster compared to the STI, especially with the S-AWC kicking in to save your ***. Both are really good cars, but the evo is just that tad bit better. It is also easier to work on given the conventional inline 4 design and is leagues ahead of the STI in the looks department. Anyone who looked at an Evo in their rear-view-mirror can attest to that.

 

Well said.. I'm also looking to buy either an Evo X or a STI. The hatch look is really growing on me, but the Evo just plain looks mean. lol. Anyhow how much power max can the 4b11t handle in stock form?

 

Depends, if you keep the rev limit stock it can go pretty far. Gates made 566whp on his and it lasted through a ton.

I am guessing it had the only problem we have really seen and that is rods letting go from over reving them at high power levels. 500whp on stock motor is not problem with stock rev limit.

 

^^ what he said, but you gotta remember, Gates was using E85, and the weight was reduced beyond belief.

Some say his co-driver is actually a hologram projected from an alien ship that hovers above his car, just to save weight.

That's how seriously he reduced weight. So if you want to keep things reliable, you might want to stick to a lower power level to reduce strain on the drivetrain by moving around in a heavier car. But either way 500 + to the wheels has been proven on 10500 race driven miles to be possible on the stock motor without too many issues.

Again, you need this measuring stick if you are indeed gonna go that big power-wise and if you are that serious. otherwise, if you are going to stay in the high 300's to low 400's whp/wtq like most do, you'll be just fine with a GSR. With an MR, as long as your WTQ numbers are below 350, you should be reasonably safe.

Hope that helps.

 

Thanks guys.. That helps a ton.. So the mr's sst-tc can't handle more than 350 wtq? One more question, how much power can be achieved by the stock turbo?
Thanks again.

 

probably 350 whp tops on pump gas, maybe 400 on E85. Need others to verify this number though.

 

^ Obviously has never driven a X and STi back to back on windy roads or a track... I would definitely not call it a monster compared to the STi. And granted, throwing mods at a car to make it better completely ruins the argument. But do an alignment or springs or sway bar (anything to fix the understeer on the STi) and you'll have a car that is a dream to drive.

Sure S-AWC is a great set up, sure it'll make any crappy driver better. But does it make a GOOD driver better than the same driver in an STi? No, not even close. I felt more comfortable pushing the two Xs I extensively test drove. But I didn't feel it was any more capable than the STi.

Then again, this is coming from someone who used to drive a race prepped S2000, which could snap around on you any second, and easily out cornered my Evo. Sure it was scary to push anywhere near the speeds the Evo could do, but it could do it, and do it better. Thankfully the STi just understeers like a pig in stock form when you push it too hard. Drive it right with the DCCD set to Auto[-], S# mode, and the TC off and it drives just fine.

Personally, both cars are completely equal, just as they have always been. They both have their ups and downs (Evo can handle more power in stock form and is cheaper to mod/maintain). In the end. I've had bad luck with Mitsu and have always wanted a fast hatchback. Plus the X's turbolag was still too much for me. The choice was obvious.

Finally someone who doesn't praise Ryan Gates (and his car) as God and who fully understands there is more behind his car then just a high hp factory motor that's survived a lot of abuse.

In the end, what you should do is drive both, decide which one you like better based on your own factors. They are both very very amazing cars, and other than the two of them, there's nothing else quite like em.

PS: IWSTI is full of just as many trolls as EvoM, though not as many as NASIOC. Most know as little about the Evo as the Evo guys know about the STi.

 

I think the Evo's greatest strength is its ability to make me, a nerd, who enjoys anime and touching myself to furry ****, feel like a ****ing ninja on a curvy road. My own 2006 STI, and 2002 WRX, never give me the feeling of confidence at the limit. Now, granted, this is because I am a horrible, horrible, horrible drivers, and the AWC is my own personal *****, but I'd bet good money that more people are similar skill to me as opposed, to, say, anything approaching "good".

 

There is certainly no argument to that. From one nerd to another One so nerdy that the only sport I am any good at is automotive racing.

I have never driven a car that has inspired as much confidence as the X. You literally can drive with 1 finger. Hell, you could break that finger while driving, and S-AWC would still save your ***.

 

Exactly. It's retard friendly. It's what I tell everyone who's at all interested in cars; any idiot could drive an Evo X at stupidly fast speeds. It blurs the line between good drivers and hilariously fast bad drivers.

 

Yep, the only thing that would make it better is if it were smaller and a good 500-1000 lbs lighter. Then a 5 year old would have an easier time driving it than a power wheel.

 

truth. anyone who talks a lot about the differences between Xs, STIs, and even the older evos is honestly exaggerating a lot - there are noticeable differences, but overall performance is all within < 1 second of each other.

Only threads I've seen about it are

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...solutions.html

and https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...nder-clip.html

Not directly related to just the transmission and gears, but closely related