I had a more general question about the handling of the X, in relation to the handling of the IX. This is NOT a X vs IX thread, so please don't make it one. Please read all the questions before responding, and thanks for the intelligent input!

I've been reading a lot and from what I've gathered I can make out that the X has mainly these advantages going for it.. bigger/wider wheels, better brakes, stiffer chassis, better geometry, and s-awc.
However, nearly all of these can be matched with modifications, including the use of an upgraded rear LSD.

Yet lighter, prepped IX's all around are being beaten by lightly prepped X's. I wanted to ask, how can this be explained in terms of suspension? What makes the handling of the X still so much better?

The only factor I could really come up with is that the X's s-awc provides a very favorable feel for the car that allows the driver to be faster not just by merit of the car being faster but because the drivers are more comfortable with it. Otherwise I'm confused on why a fully prepped X would be significantly faster than a fully prepped IX.

The same question really goes for any car, in that I would ask: Does each car have a maximum potential/ability in terms of handling, and does that differ significantly from every other car?
Other than more inherent differences such as weight or drivetrain, and not looking at race cars, I would have thought any one car prepped very well would be able to handle just as quickly as any one other car.
I.e., any prepped wrx tuned to its maximum capability in terms of suspension, or.. some other fully prepped 4wd car would be as fast through the corners as any other fully prepped 4wd car/evo, given that they were near similar weights and had suspension set up to it's maximum potential.

Yet I guess now people seem to say that a race prepped IX will never handle as well as a race prepped X? Is this true? I always just assumed the X was much better set up out of the box, but if this is the case shouldn't anyone interested in road racing and autocross dump the ct9a and switch to a X?

Also, if one factor of a car is already very good, i.e., the suspension geometry of the X, does it not stand to gain less by upgrading it as opposed to upgrading the geometry of the IX, which has some inherent problems that should be fixed, or do both cars improve/gain by an equal amount, and the X still will stand with a greater suspension geometry?

I don't want any useless comments about one car being better chimed in, just asking a sincere question on handling/suspension theory: If those factors that make one car handle better than another are matched by any other car, does it not make both cars handle equally?

 

Ayc

 

An upgraded rear lsd in the 9 isnt going to match the performance of the AYC system in the 10.

AYC is a VERY useful track weapon that the 9 just cant match.

Track prepped x over a track prepped 9 anyday.

 

Don't know much about the technical side.. the inside line I saw on edmunds gave the X 2 full seconds over the IX on the track they tested, but i'm not sure where it was... maybe with a different driver it might be different... however you can almost always count on the fact that a computer can do it better than a human, so the AYC and such would be the best guess of the advantage.

 

I had a 1.5 second faster lap time @ VIR in my X with only an Ecutek flash everything else was bone stock compared to my IX with Tein Flex and about 100 whp/ wtq more so i would have to say that the S-AYC is

 

Well BlackTrack is ripping out the AYC in his X for NASA TT this year... so I dunno?

Maybe the wider = better philosophy applies and the wider track makes the car more stable?

Also the brakes... they are bigger in the X (with more weight to stop granted) so you will be able to dive deeper before turning.

 

the X is wider, and have a AYC. Besides the bigger and wider rims and tires.

So to the added weight it still hadles better. Surprise? For most of us is not.
If you take out the unnecessary weight. Like the JDM -EU or AU cars , which are not comes with spear tires tools etc. Instead the tire inflating thing... etc.

The X drops weight easy. So you can make it even better , with no money spending .
Also the breaks fades later compere to the old stock set up.And you still not modified the car.

 

is it me or is it easier to love my X more and more everyday

 

Has he had reliability problems? My understanding was that with the previous evos, that was the main reason racers did not use AYC (or their class did not allow it)

He can swap it onto my IX if he is wants to.

 

I don't know for sure, but I think it might be a weight thing. He's moving from TT-B to TT-X so he's fully gutting the car if I remember right.

 

Correction, we already took it out. I'm running a Cusco 1.5way rear LSD. We did this before the Super Lap Battle Finale in Nov.
No reliability issue. We did it because it wasn't as effective after 350whp. The car became prone to throttle-on corner exit understeer. With the Cusco LSD, the car is now neutral and will oversteer if you need it to on corner exit, much better. I'll post a little update on some other diff changes in another thread soon.

Wrong, I ran TT-A last year, and am moving to TT-U. I'm not fully gutting the car at all, just removing more weight in some other places soon. I'll post up some progress soon though.

 

And to answer the OP's question. There are soooo many factors as to why it handles better: weight distribution, chassis stiffness, wider, chassis stiffness, S-AWC, chassis stiffness, etc, etc, etc. The combo of a completely different car/chassis/design/engine/etc with much newer technology all comes together to make a faster car.

 

Mea culpa. I've been running the numbers and staying in TT-B is very hard! TT-A allows me a lot more flexibilty...

 

Hmm I see. But didn't you say the AYC becomes less effective after 350whp? And my question was for two track prepped cars, so does it basically come down to that the X has a wider, stiffer chassis?

 

From what I've understood, AYC is not used by most track evo's used professionally, and a mechanical rear lsd tends to work better. And the Tre rear diff has seemed to work quite well comparably, though not just as well.