Possible new Evo owner. Lots of questions
Jul 26, 2012, 08:45 PM
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Possible new Evo owner. Lots of questions
*This is probably going to be a long read...please bear with me as I could really use the help*
Hey guys,
I recently sold my 07 Sti to purchase a c6 Z06.
The STI had a stock block with a 20G and all supporting mods putting down 380's on pump. I loved it to death but I wanted to get out of the tuner scene and give a big displacement motor a try. Just liked the idea of 500hp/450tq that came with a warranty and didn't make we wonder "I wonder if anything is going to let go today" every time I tuned the key.
Fast forward 30 days and it looks like I may be moving and taking a job in Baltimore MD. That being said, the vette is no longer on the table due to a list of reasons I won't bother boring you with. The short of it is once again I need to find a car that can pull double duty (daily drive & Auto-x/HPDE) and be driven year around.
So I'm debating between the following:
2011 STI
2011 Evo MR
2011 Evo GSR
2006 Evo MR
(Before I go any further, i'm not looking to turn this thread into a 9 vs 10 pissing match)
I guess I'll kind of just write out whats going through my head and see what you all think...
Evo X MR
What I thought:
Drove it for the first time ever yesterday. Absolutely loved it. Handling was awesome, seats were fantastic, and I fell in love with the SST. Love the idea of putting it in full auto when I'm stuck in stop-N-go traffic on the beltway....
What I don't know:
1) How hard are these cars to work on vs the STI. I know the subaru inside and out but I don't even know where the oil filter is on an Evo
2) How hard is it to make 350whp/350wtq on a completely stock motor? Would it be reliable?
3) How is the overall reliability of an Evo X?
4) What is your thought on a stock SST and a car making 350whp/wtq? Is it possible or is it a ticking time bomb?
2011 Evo GSR
Haven't driven one yet...I assume its pretty much the same as the MR I drove with the exception of the 5spd?
Is the GSR more reliable from a tranny standpoint if I want to hit that 350whp/wtq goal?
Evo 9 MR
Haven't driven this before either, only been a passenger.....
What I have a pre-conceived notion about:
1) Handling is very good. Not as much understeer as an STI.
2) 4g63 is bullet proof
3) 350whp/wtq is very doable with a completely stock block and just bolts on/pro-tune
4) Low mileage Evo9's that haven't been beaten on will be hard to find and cost a premium
5) "6spd tranny out of the MR is a ticking time bomb"
6) "Transfer is case is a ticking time bomb"
7) "Get ready to replace your clutch every 15,000 miles"
8) "Evo9 overall reliability starts to become and issue around 60,000 miles if not sooner"
What I don't know:
1) The truth behind numbers 1 through 8 listed above
2) How hard it is to work on an Evo9 vs an STI.
2011 STI
What I I know:
1) Car will make close to 330whp/330wtq on 93 pump with a stock block, bolts on and good pro-tune.
2) Car will make close to 350whp/380wtq on E85 with a stock block, bolts ons, proper fuel system upgrades and a good pro-tune.
3) Stock tranny and differentials are bullet proof
4) Stock short block is the limiting factor on making big numbers
What I don't know:
1) If I want to do the Subaru thing again
2) If I want to deal with factory paint that's as soft as a crayon again
3) If I want to do the suspension mods required to try to get rid of the understeer
So now that I've written you all a novel; what do you think?
Hey guys,
I recently sold my 07 Sti to purchase a c6 Z06.
The STI had a stock block with a 20G and all supporting mods putting down 380's on pump. I loved it to death but I wanted to get out of the tuner scene and give a big displacement motor a try. Just liked the idea of 500hp/450tq that came with a warranty and didn't make we wonder "I wonder if anything is going to let go today" every time I tuned the key.
Fast forward 30 days and it looks like I may be moving and taking a job in Baltimore MD. That being said, the vette is no longer on the table due to a list of reasons I won't bother boring you with. The short of it is once again I need to find a car that can pull double duty (daily drive & Auto-x/HPDE) and be driven year around.
So I'm debating between the following:
2011 STI
2011 Evo MR
2011 Evo GSR
2006 Evo MR
(Before I go any further, i'm not looking to turn this thread into a 9 vs 10 pissing match)
I guess I'll kind of just write out whats going through my head and see what you all think...
Evo X MR
What I thought:
Drove it for the first time ever yesterday. Absolutely loved it. Handling was awesome, seats were fantastic, and I fell in love with the SST. Love the idea of putting it in full auto when I'm stuck in stop-N-go traffic on the beltway....
What I don't know:
1) How hard are these cars to work on vs the STI. I know the subaru inside and out but I don't even know where the oil filter is on an Evo
2) How hard is it to make 350whp/350wtq on a completely stock motor? Would it be reliable?
3) How is the overall reliability of an Evo X?
4) What is your thought on a stock SST and a car making 350whp/wtq? Is it possible or is it a ticking time bomb?
2011 Evo GSR
Haven't driven one yet...I assume its pretty much the same as the MR I drove with the exception of the 5spd?
Is the GSR more reliable from a tranny standpoint if I want to hit that 350whp/wtq goal?
Evo 9 MR
Haven't driven this before either, only been a passenger.....
What I have a pre-conceived notion about:
1) Handling is very good. Not as much understeer as an STI.
2) 4g63 is bullet proof
3) 350whp/wtq is very doable with a completely stock block and just bolts on/pro-tune
4) Low mileage Evo9's that haven't been beaten on will be hard to find and cost a premium
5) "6spd tranny out of the MR is a ticking time bomb"
6) "Transfer is case is a ticking time bomb"
7) "Get ready to replace your clutch every 15,000 miles"
8) "Evo9 overall reliability starts to become and issue around 60,000 miles if not sooner"
What I don't know:
1) The truth behind numbers 1 through 8 listed above
2) How hard it is to work on an Evo9 vs an STI.
2011 STI
What I I know:
1) Car will make close to 330whp/330wtq on 93 pump with a stock block, bolts on and good pro-tune.
2) Car will make close to 350whp/380wtq on E85 with a stock block, bolts ons, proper fuel system upgrades and a good pro-tune.
3) Stock tranny and differentials are bullet proof
4) Stock short block is the limiting factor on making big numbers
What I don't know:
1) If I want to do the Subaru thing again
2) If I want to deal with factory paint that's as soft as a crayon again
3) If I want to do the suspension mods required to try to get rid of the understeer
So now that I've written you all a novel; what do you think?
Jul 26, 2012, 11:31 PM
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Well the mr is nice being that if you are stuck in traffic that it's automatic. However the SST when pushing more power will need better cooling. You can find the aftermarket coolers here on the forums. Forgot the name of the company.
The Gsr's only limiting factor is the block. The 4b11 is known to pop anywhere around 400tq.
These cars have been pumping out good numbers with simple bolt ons and a nice pro tune. If you have a chance check out the tuning section here. Lots of dyno sheets.
As for the sti. You already know the car. So it's kinda your experience with it. My friend has a 2011 wrx and he absolutely loves it. I like it to but he has to spend a lot more money to make it go fast. I know it's no sti but he's got decent parts and it's faster than a stock sti. The Evo will require less to make more power.
I hope any of this helps.
The Gsr's only limiting factor is the block. The 4b11 is known to pop anywhere around 400tq.
These cars have been pumping out good numbers with simple bolt ons and a nice pro tune. If you have a chance check out the tuning section here. Lots of dyno sheets.
As for the sti. You already know the car. So it's kinda your experience with it. My friend has a 2011 wrx and he absolutely loves it. I like it to but he has to spend a lot more money to make it go fast. I know it's no sti but he's got decent parts and it's faster than a stock sti. The Evo will require less to make more power.
I hope any of this helps.
Jul 27, 2012, 12:32 AM
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For DD, I recommend an X. STI's are awesome but for a variety of reasons, I lean towards the X. Drive both though and make the call yourself. Evos are easier to upgrade the power on though.
I owned an VIII for 5 years and the car was amazing but (and I know I'll be labeled a heathen for saying this) DD it just lacked a tad bit of refinement and got to you after a while.
The X fixes all that. Maybe a tad too much, so be happy with the interior, and stiffen up the body roll with a rear bar.
X GSR's are very reliable at +100HP crank over stock (350WHP)
Living in Baltimore, I would dread the idea of driving that much rear wheel HP in the snow, and on those streets, you need more of a rally bred car. Less flashy too so less worry about crime. Get a second set of snow tires and call it a day.
MR's are a great way to go too. Seems like if you are going to do bolt ons for DD at 350WHP it's going to be a very nice solution if you don't feel like dealing with a clutch in traffic. If you do HDPE/Auto-X get an upgraded oil cooler and you're good.
I owned an VIII for 5 years and the car was amazing but (and I know I'll be labeled a heathen for saying this) DD it just lacked a tad bit of refinement and got to you after a while.
The X fixes all that. Maybe a tad too much, so be happy with the interior, and stiffen up the body roll with a rear bar.
X GSR's are very reliable at +100HP crank over stock (350WHP)
Living in Baltimore, I would dread the idea of driving that much rear wheel HP in the snow, and on those streets, you need more of a rally bred car. Less flashy too so less worry about crime. Get a second set of snow tires and call it a day.
MR's are a great way to go too. Seems like if you are going to do bolt ons for DD at 350WHP it's going to be a very nice solution if you don't feel like dealing with a clutch in traffic. If you do HDPE/Auto-X get an upgraded oil cooler and you're good.
Jul 27, 2012, 02:32 AM
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I've owned an VIII and it was a great car 339whp easy with boltons but much like any VIII's or IX's it's going to be hard to find one that hasn't been beat on. If you crash it, it folds up like tinfoil.
Additionally I also now own a 2010 GSR and 2008 MR. Easy to do boltons on all three cars. I like the 10 GSR best just because it is the most fun to drive and has some of that X comfort. Mine makes 339whp same as my VIII did on exhaust, crappy AEM intake and a great tune. The 5spd isnt bad in traffic.
The X MR is great for getting around and is marvelous in traffic. Mine is all stock currently. I like the way it shifts and the ease of driving it. The handling is amazing and it's so easy when you don't have to shift. The sport mode is awesome for winding hilly roads and mountain passes. The S-sport mode is ridiculous but fun to have just to mess around.
All are very practical all season cars. Apparently you can take a X down a ski slope...
The way I see it you can't go wrong with an Evo.
Additionally I also now own a 2010 GSR and 2008 MR. Easy to do boltons on all three cars. I like the 10 GSR best just because it is the most fun to drive and has some of that X comfort. Mine makes 339whp same as my VIII did on exhaust, crappy AEM intake and a great tune. The 5spd isnt bad in traffic.
The X MR is great for getting around and is marvelous in traffic. Mine is all stock currently. I like the way it shifts and the ease of driving it. The handling is amazing and it's so easy when you don't have to shift. The sport mode is awesome for winding hilly roads and mountain passes. The S-sport mode is ridiculous but fun to have just to mess around.
All are very practical all season cars. Apparently you can take a X down a ski slope...
The way I see it you can't go wrong with an Evo.
Jul 27, 2012, 03:03 AM
#5
I own a 2010 X and my friend owns a 2011 WRX. I know it's not an sti but as u know, there's only a few differences between the two.
Anyways, I net more power to the very same mods he has. Right now, he's invested way more than I have but I still make more power.
My friend has an evo 9 mr and he actually swapped out the 6speed for a 5speed due to the fact that, and I quote, "the 5speed is tougher than the 6speed". Now I'm not an expert on the evo 9 since my X is my first evo so I will take his word for it...that and he's pumping out more than 600hp on that car.
So it really comes down to preference. Do u want manual (X GSR) or auto (X MR)? Or do u want a 6speed (9)? Or do u want familiarity (sti)?
Anyways, I net more power to the very same mods he has. Right now, he's invested way more than I have but I still make more power.
My friend has an evo 9 mr and he actually swapped out the 6speed for a 5speed due to the fact that, and I quote, "the 5speed is tougher than the 6speed". Now I'm not an expert on the evo 9 since my X is my first evo so I will take his word for it...that and he's pumping out more than 600hp on that car.
So it really comes down to preference. Do u want manual (X GSR) or auto (X MR)? Or do u want a 6speed (9)? Or do u want familiarity (sti)?
Aug 1, 2012, 07:46 AM
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What more do you want to know?
All of the cars you've listed on your short list are great. Figure out if you want used car troubles or not. Figure out if you want stick or automatic. Drive the STi, X and IX Evo, see which one you like the feel of better. Purchase.
Did you have any specific questions about the Evo VIII (the IX being approximately the same, but I never drove one), X or STi?
I've driven all three on the street and Auto-X
All of the cars you've listed on your short list are great. Figure out if you want used car troubles or not. Figure out if you want stick or automatic. Drive the STi, X and IX Evo, see which one you like the feel of better. Purchase.
Did you have any specific questions about the Evo VIII (the IX being approximately the same, but I never drove one), X or STi?
I've driven all three on the street and Auto-X
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Aug 1, 2012, 08:07 AM
#8
I came over to this scene from the domestic V8 scene as well. I may be more strict in my performance evaluation than others but to me only the Evo IX matters.
The 8 I drove was quite laggy even on the stock turbo compared to my 9.
The X is just too far away from what I want. I plan to someday convert to a complete track car. The X AYC is weaker, plastic CMC weaker, aluminum block needing sleeves, turbo near the firewall cooking things plus it's harder to get to back there. Less power potential with bolt-on stock frame turbochargers due to smaller hotside, interior that's too roomy for a 165lb 5'10 skinny white guy compared to the IX that fits me perfectly. The 2008's have no color lcd, weaker diff pins, bad relays, bad chain, etc and that's the one I'd buy simply based on price. The 2010+ has a plastic valvecover I definitely don't want along with the higher prices but the newer cars fixed the diffpin issue among other things. However I like the enhanced handling and if I could offset the weight and have peace of mind that the drivetrain is sound (diffpins/ayc) I'd probably enjoy it. I don't want something so new I can't play with it without feeling guilty that I'm trashing a nice car.
At the end of the day it just turns out that an ACD equipped Evo IX fits me perfectly. I like starting at 25mpg highway instead of 23mpg highway. Sure you gain mpg with a tune, I want to gain from 25 not 23. I like a 3200lb car and nothing heavier. The Evo IX doesn't have to be gutted to reach 3200lbs. I don't want to screw with much I just want a mostly stock car until I start building it into a weekend track car. Why ruin a new car when an older one is cheaper and closer to what I'm seeking. Plus the new X stands out even wingless, but a wingless IX gets no attention whatsoever. (I'm not seeking attention, I want to blend in. I'd drive a pink tin can if it's faster)
Please spare the trolling comments or people telling me I'm wrong for my personal opinions. I didn't even want to reply since I know someone with an X will feel wronged somehow, but I think this guy wants more opinions so there's mine.
The X is just as capable sure. But it's more pay to play than the IX is and it doesn't fit my goals.
The 8 I drove was quite laggy even on the stock turbo compared to my 9.
The X is just too far away from what I want. I plan to someday convert to a complete track car. The X AYC is weaker, plastic CMC weaker, aluminum block needing sleeves, turbo near the firewall cooking things plus it's harder to get to back there. Less power potential with bolt-on stock frame turbochargers due to smaller hotside, interior that's too roomy for a 165lb 5'10 skinny white guy compared to the IX that fits me perfectly. The 2008's have no color lcd, weaker diff pins, bad relays, bad chain, etc and that's the one I'd buy simply based on price. The 2010+ has a plastic valvecover I definitely don't want along with the higher prices but the newer cars fixed the diffpin issue among other things. However I like the enhanced handling and if I could offset the weight and have peace of mind that the drivetrain is sound (diffpins/ayc) I'd probably enjoy it. I don't want something so new I can't play with it without feeling guilty that I'm trashing a nice car.
At the end of the day it just turns out that an ACD equipped Evo IX fits me perfectly. I like starting at 25mpg highway instead of 23mpg highway. Sure you gain mpg with a tune, I want to gain from 25 not 23. I like a 3200lb car and nothing heavier. The Evo IX doesn't have to be gutted to reach 3200lbs. I don't want to screw with much I just want a mostly stock car until I start building it into a weekend track car. Why ruin a new car when an older one is cheaper and closer to what I'm seeking. Plus the new X stands out even wingless, but a wingless IX gets no attention whatsoever. (I'm not seeking attention, I want to blend in. I'd drive a pink tin can if it's faster)
Please spare the trolling comments or people telling me I'm wrong for my personal opinions. I didn't even want to reply since I know someone with an X will feel wronged somehow, but I think this guy wants more opinions so there's mine.
The X is just as capable sure. But it's more pay to play than the IX is and it doesn't fit my goals.
Last edited by acidtonic; Aug 1, 2012 at 08:41 AM.
Aug 2, 2012, 12:10 AM
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If it helps you decide....
The GSR's limit is the block, you will have to mod it later if you want over 400 hp/tq.
The MR's limit is the tranny, you will need to upgrade the oil coolers for the tranny fluid if you are going over stock power.
The Sti's limit are the ring lands.
Take this information and consider which is the way you want to go about it be it any of this happens to what ever you choose.
The GSR's limit is the block, you will have to mod it later if you want over 400 hp/tq.
The MR's limit is the tranny, you will need to upgrade the oil coolers for the tranny fluid if you are going over stock power.
The Sti's limit are the ring lands.
Take this information and consider which is the way you want to go about it be it any of this happens to what ever you choose.
Aug 4, 2012, 10:22 AM
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I may be echoing others on this thread but I didn't read through everything. If it's a DD I would go with the MR. I just got a 2010 GSR as my DD and I had a IX before that.. You're going to love having an extra gear when you're cruising. I'm at about 3500 rpm when I'm going 80 on the highway..
Aug 4, 2012, 12:11 PM
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I thought I remember the MR owners saying something similar though. Around 3k at 70 and around 3.5k at 80. That the 6th gear doesn't really make a difference at highway speeds.
Aug 4, 2012, 01:48 PM
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