My mods:

-TurboXS HP Manual Boost Controller @ 22psi peak
-TurboXS UTEC v1.7 - tuned for 93 octane & 22psi peak
-3" Exhaust Cutout on downpipe w/ 3" piping from turbo outlet
-Buschur Racing Air Filter Kit
-Buschur Racing Air Intake Pipe
-Buschur Racing Mini-Battery Kit
-Buschur Racing Deluxe Upper & Lower I/C Piping
-Buschur Racing Deluxe FMIC
-Crushed 1g DSM BOV w/ no leaks
-HKS 272/272 Camshafts
-ARP Headstuds
-Walbro 255lph Fuel Pump

My dyno charts (AWD DynoJet @ 75degrees w/ SAE Correction 5):

93 octane @ 22psi:
http://students.kennesaw.edu/~crw772...fore&after.jpg
305whp = baseline pull with previous maps
297whp = after 2.5 hours of professional tuning at a shop, only to end up pulling more timing

50/50 mix of 93 octane and VP v16 (116 octane) @ 26psi:
http://students.kennesaw.edu/~crw772...es/345-350.jpg


Most other Evo's out there with similar mods as me are producing 340ish whp @ 93 octane and 370ish whp @ 116 octane mix (I even saw an Evo w/ my same mods & AEM EMS dyno those same #'s the day before I was tuned). Obviously, I am very under-powered and making horrible #'s with the UTEC.

Here's what was explained to me by the tuner... the UTEC is extremely sensitive to knock and it tells the car that it is experiencing knock before it actually does knock, in order to keep the car safe and making it almost impossible to blow up the motor. At abount 3,000rpm to 5,000rpm in any gear past 2nd, the SES light kept flashing and knock would occur. The tuner tried to tune around the knock but was not successful and ended up having to pull several degrees of timing... causing in absolutely horrible #'s in order to stop the knock... but even now, I randomly experience knock while driving in the same rpms. He warned me before the tuning began, that the UTEC was a horrible engine management tool and recommended me to stay away from it. Needless to say, I am in desperate need of help to get the #'s that I should have. I have posted my UTEC up for sale, but have not fully committed to selling it yet. I have even thought of investing in a DynoFlash to reflash the ECU, then use the UTEC to tune on top of that. I am out of ideas and suggestions and look to you EvoM UTEC people for advice and help!

Are there any tricks concerning the UTEC's knock detection and timing that I or the tuner do not know about? Is the car really knocking all the time when the UTEC says it is? Is there anyway to change the sensitivity of the knock signals? Do most UTEC owners experience these same problems and end up pulling timing? Do any UTEC owners advance their timing? If so, how without knocking? What are most of you UTEC owners with similar mods as me making as far as horsepower? On MAP 0, does the UTEC still control the knock sensitivity or is the UTEC completely disabled?

I am desperately seeking help!!! Please feel free to ask me any questions in order to help me better and I will try to reply as soon as possible. I will also try to pull the tuned maps and post them whenever I have access to a laptop and a serial cable. By the way, what type of serial cable do I need?

Thanks to anyone who took the time to read this... hope to hear replies soon.

 

Get a new tuner! I have found that their are tuners that are good with some em's and suck at others and the ones that they suck at they put the product down like it is no good. The dyno flash and utec may not be a bad idea but I can almost guarranty you that if you take it back to the same tuner he will probably have the same problems. Also a tune on the dyno is a good starting point. If you can find an empty road where you are the only car on the road to make small adjustments to your maps to tune out any remanding knock.

 

sorry i have no real help for you but just wanted to state i had the same problem with similar mods at the dyno. with my 264's being the real difference i put down 292whp with 91oct. since then, i have more mods and haven't been back to the dyno.

i hope you can find info to help you our here. justin

 

The key learning here is that not all tuners are created equal.
I am running 306WHP / 297TQ with a UTEC and 92 oct gas. All I have is a TBE, Walbro Fuel pump, and an AVC-R boost controller. I tried some different places for tuning the car and only one person took the time necessary to tune the car properly.

The UTEC sensitivity to knock depends on where you put the knock sensor. I had sensitivity issues when I put the knock sensor on the top of the motor where the engine pull bracket was. I relocated it to underneath the car and on the bottom of the engine closer to the stock knock sensor. Now I dont have the knock sensitivity issues and I have been able to get a better tune. I also used a tuner that would listen to the engine and could tell whether or not the knock was real or phantom noise from another component.

The other tough variable here is the dyno. Not all dynos are created equal =( This in itself can be very frustrating. For example, I can go and dyno on my favorite dyno, a dynapack, and get 306WHP/297TQ. If I go to a Mustang 500 dyno that doesnt load the car as much I only get 279WHP/243TQ. The reason its so much lower is because of the load. If you have a higher more realistic load then the car has to "push" against that resistence more and you will get better more realistic numbers. So, the dyno is really only good for giving you a reference as to whether or not the changes you are making are doing anything positive. It is also useful to see how your curves look and, if the dyno is sensitive enough, you can see the peaks and valleys in your tune to see where you need to work on it.

I really feel your pain here because I was in the same position and ready to throw my UTEC out the window. Dont despair though! The UTEC is a very powerful tool that will allow you to make changes when you add new items! I really reccomend calling TurboXS and seeing if they have someone they can reccomend in your area to help you out!!!

Good luck!
Chris

With your CAM

 

Yup just like PDX said. It does take some time to get use to, there is so many things you can do with the UTEC. The first thing I see is that you might want to run just a little richer, but thats me. My tune is right in the area of 11.2-11.4. Then start advancing the timing when you see knock either add fuel or retard the timing. Be careful though. Hopefully MJ has something to say about this.

 

When I'm getting a feel for the timing needed on the engine, I usually run richer.. Then I alter the timing till I get something that works for me.. Then I lean it out until its in a range where I want..

Its not necessary to have a perfectly smooth AFR curve, but only provide the fuel needed to prevent detonation.. timing is where you will make power, but be conservative about how much timing you use (you never want to be on the edge since the quality of gas will affect how fast the mixture burns and a little bit of bad gas, or unexpected issue could cause a bad bout of detonation)

Optimum fuel ratios are only the amount of gas it takes to completely burn all the air in the combustion chamber.. More fuel is used to quench detonation since vaporization of the fuel cools the combustion chamber, it also alters the burn rate of the contents of the combustion chamber.. Running rich doesn't really affect power too much unless its displacing oxygen needed to get a more complete burn..

This is where tuning with the help of an EGT sensor helps, if you have a rich mixture and too little timing, it will continue to burn as it exits into the exhaust, etc.. The trick is to get your AFR's in check, get your timing somewhere tha works for you.. Then do a few runs and watch your EGT while adding/removing fuel and a bit of timing until your in a range where your EGT's are fairly low..

Why you may ask?

a lower EGT is an indicator of a fairly complete burn thats timed right, if its too lean it'll be high, and if its too rich it'll also be high since you'll be having combustion still occuring in the exhaust manifold.

It does take trial and error, you just don't want to make an error that sacrifices your engine, so take small steps and monitor knock, AFR, and EGT closely, you'll find a sweet spot for your EGT based on your AFR and timing, when you get that, you'll get very little if any knock.. then you can "Clean it up" by altering timing or mixture to eliminate the remaining timing.

Also be aware that the type of tune you do, will depend on your driving style and tuning necessity, keeping EGT's low helps keep things from getting too hot on long pulls, if your EGT's are high you can melt parts, but tuning for the drag strip usually results in high sustained EGT's.. so when you tune, keep that in mind...

Sometimes less is more, reliability should be a higher priority.

 

Do any of you adjust your knock sensitivity factor? Is there even one to adjust? If so, how much do you all adjust it? And how do you adjust it?

I do not know much 'bout the knock sensor... and I don't really know what you mean by the placement of the knock sensor... can you explain more? Thanks for the posts so far folks!

 

You can adjust your knock sensitivity in the paramaters section of the UTEC. I have not changed mine since I figure that they are set pretty good as it is.
What I mean about moving the knock sensor only applies if you have the Tuner Pro from TurboXS. Re-reading your post I dont think you have that device so it should not apply. If you dont have the Tuner Pro then you are getting true knock measured from the stock knock sensor.

Looking at your 1/4 mile times though it sure seems like you are running above 300WHP. Especially getting a trap time of 107.36 and in 12.544 second. You may want to try a different dyno shop.

 

Can you post your map and a log up? I'd hate to nit pick on jack, but more fuel just slows down the burn of the mixture. Fuel itself doesn't cool the combustion chamber. The reason it runs cooler is basically because more fuel acts like timing being retarded.

 

Yep, I agree with you, but the vaporization of the additional fuel actually does cool the combustion chamber slightly.. but the additional fuel does slow combustion rate also (I think I had eluded to it, but maybe I forgot to mention it) Okay, I did read back and did mention the rate of combustion being affected.. There are really alot of variables that can contribute to it, but its good to keep in mind that burn rate will be affected by how rich or lean you run too, so timing will have to be altered slightly accordingly..