Lancer vs Civic Sedan Si
The new SI's are not slow. They just don't have a lot of torque and you really need to know how to drive one to make power. K20's are sick platforms for forced induction. Any boosted (TUNABLE) K20 is going to make crazy power. If honda made them rwd I would buy another one. From a roll, a k20a/a2/z3 with about 15lbs of boost would roast most evos.
Evolving Member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 165
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From: Mobile, Al
Could be tires and suspension. believe it or not a higher hp car with a lower weight per hp ratio but with 400 treadwear tires and stock suspension can get annialated by a lower hp car b/c the lower hp car has 140 treadwear tires and sport tuned springs and shocks. GRIP.
Evolving Member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 165
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From: Mobile, Al
500 treadwear! Arrrrg. Put a set of Kumo Ecta XS's on that car and they will blow your mind with thier cornering ability. Once I went under 200, i swore i would never go higher again. Back on topick though, i think the problems with the newer civics on our track are the weight of the car. Again if they can't get the car to vtec and keep it there, they can't compete with the lancer, mazda3, or the mini cooper on autox tracks. The lancer is not the top dog for its stock class but it is competitive. That being said, the hot ticket in the street prepared category is the 89-92 honda civic si hatch. 1700-2100lbs and with a few add ons they are in the 140hp range.
HAHA!
No kidding!
Its nice to have a 6 spd transmission...
and I will say Mitsu should maybe go around their "rally-inspired 5 spd" and switch to a 6 spd manual like their competitor cars (mazda)....but they wont !!
GTS...5 spd manual or 6 spd auto....
On this car...I will take the manual...sport sedan car...why wreck with an auto!
Of course they do but we're talking about a car that originally came with 120 HP beating a car that was designed for performance that has 197 HP from the factory along with an LSD and a 6-speed transmission. Gearing is likely on the Civic's side as is power.
A Civic SI weighs either 2886 lbs or 2945 lbs depending on whether it's a coupe or a sedan.
A Lancer weighs ~2692 (ES will weigh slightly less).
If we do a bit of math, every 1 HP in a Civic has to move 14.9 lbs. By contrast, every 1 HP in a Lancer has to move 22.4 lbs. That's a 7 lb per HP difference. What weight loss mods have you done? It's going to take a lot of weight loss or power to make up that difference. To match the Civic's power to weight ratio, you would need close to 180 HP. Do you honestly think you gained 60 HP with bolt-ons and a tune?
A Civic SI weighs either 2886 lbs or 2945 lbs depending on whether it's a coupe or a sedan.
A Lancer weighs ~2692 (ES will weigh slightly less).
If we do a bit of math, every 1 HP in a Civic has to move 14.9 lbs. By contrast, every 1 HP in a Lancer has to move 22.4 lbs. That's a 7 lb per HP difference. What weight loss mods have you done? It's going to take a lot of weight loss or power to make up that difference. To match the Civic's power to weight ratio, you would need close to 180 HP. Do you honestly think you gained 60 HP with bolt-ons and a tune?
Perhaps he took out the spare tire and jack for weight reduction?!
Honda Civic SI vs. Lancer is no comparison. The Civic even looks better, and has more accessible bolt on's. Honda's redline has not really been mentioned either. They may not have the torque, but they have the RPM's to wrap every bit of power out of that 4 banger!
Evolved Member
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 580
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From: UT Austin
HAHA!
No kidding!
Its nice to have a 6 spd transmission...
and I will say Mitsu should maybe go around their "rally-inspired 5 spd" and switch to a 6 spd manual like their competitor cars (mazda)....but they wont !!
GTS...5 spd manual or 6 spd auto....
On this car...I will take the manual...sport sedan car...why wreck with an auto!
No kidding!
Its nice to have a 6 spd transmission...
and I will say Mitsu should maybe go around their "rally-inspired 5 spd" and switch to a 6 spd manual like their competitor cars (mazda)....but they wont !!
GTS...5 spd manual or 6 spd auto....
On this car...I will take the manual...sport sedan car...why wreck with an auto!
I believe paddle shifters are more of a "luxury" then a gimmick. They are for the driver that likes to drive aggressive in short spurts, but not for the true rally car experience. This can only really be done with a manual tranny. Just like the CVT, it is not made for a true driving experience, but rather for drivers that are located in high traffic locations, but then all complain about the poor power and performance. I have always thought of Automatic/ paddle shifters/ CVT as the lazy man's tranny to get easy performance. Then the manual tranny is more for the true driving enthusiast that likes to drive "spirited" and be able to use the gears for powering around corners or to pass people on the freeway, and flip them the middle finger as you fly by them! LOL
Newbie
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 67
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From: Warminster, PA
Short of a turbo, the Lancer would lose in all performance catorgories to an Si, with every possible modification to engine and suspension/wheels/tires.
I would probably buy a non-Si Civic over a Lancer GTS. I am currently looking into buying a 2009 Si, with the Honda clearance sale going on now, they are going for relatively cheap.
I would probably buy a non-Si Civic over a Lancer GTS. I am currently looking into buying a 2009 Si, with the Honda clearance sale going on now, they are going for relatively cheap.
Newbie
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 34
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From: The sand
Same debate over and over. I notice two types on this forum. Those who dream of Evo fame but can only land a lancer and so feel the lower and in turn make fools of themselves by either bashing their own ride or riding in shame once they feel they can never reach their goal without the actual equipment. And those that are more humble to face that fact that it is what it is and remain enthusiastic to the fact that it can be tuned and so they will. The second is most likely where the first real tuners and real car guys were birthed. The first..well probably kids or thin skinned. Everyone has the car for their own reasons. Do what you want. If you’re new to all of this then maybe a Lancer isn’t a bad start. Its entry level stock, parts are easy to work with which is great for learning and you don’t have to break your wallet and less likely to foul out a more serious piece of hardware until you learn enough. It’s still a nice car no matter how you look at. If you get an Evo(or whatever kind of car) just to satisfy outside opinions or ego guess what, you are that much easier to break and make a fool out off when you come across something that can beat you.
Evolving Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 136
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From: baton rouge, la
same debate over and over. I notice two types on this forum. Those who dream of evo fame but can only land a lancer and so feel the lower and in turn make fools of themselves by either bashing their own ride or riding in shame once they feel they can never reach their goal without the actual equipment. And those that are more humble to face that fact that it is what it is and remain enthusiastic to the fact that it can be tuned and so they will. The second is most likely where the first real tuners and real car guys were birthed. The first..well probably kids or thin skinned. Everyone has the car for their own reasons. Do what you want. If you’re new to all of this then maybe a lancer isn’t a bad start. Its entry level stock, parts are easy to work with which is great for learning and you don’t have to break your wallet and less likely to foul out a more serious piece of hardware until you learn enough. It’s still a nice car no matter how you look at. If you get an evo(or whatever kind of car) just to satisfy outside opinions or ego guess what, you are that much easier to break and make a fool out off when you come across something that can beat you.
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 520
Likes: 1
From: NC
well guys I haven't check on this form in quiet a while and somewhere in here we started talking about other ****. Heck I thought this thread was over.
Well I think if I was going to get one I would have gotten a Lancer, based on mainly the looks.
But I came real close to cashin in on the Cash for Cluckers rebate deal and trade in my 85 C10. But I decided not to. If I was going to buy another car it would have to be something that I like, and the lancer would have not been able to do it for me. I have already own and 03 evo 8 and drove it for three years before my little girl came into this world. and I just can't see my self buying anything else that could even compare to it.
So I am just going to fix up my old truck. repaint and finish the LS-1 conversion that I planned on doing in the first place,
Thanks guys for all of your opinions and comments.
James
Well I think if I was going to get one I would have gotten a Lancer, based on mainly the looks.
But I came real close to cashin in on the Cash for Cluckers rebate deal and trade in my 85 C10. But I decided not to. If I was going to buy another car it would have to be something that I like, and the lancer would have not been able to do it for me. I have already own and 03 evo 8 and drove it for three years before my little girl came into this world. and I just can't see my self buying anything else that could even compare to it.
So I am just going to fix up my old truck. repaint and finish the LS-1 conversion that I planned on doing in the first place,
Thanks guys for all of your opinions and comments.
James
