335i Vishnu
Does anyone know if Dinnan produces LSD's. I would think that the BMW dealer would be able to order that if they did and install it without voiding your drivetrain warranty. I hear a lot of 335i owners are waiting on the quaife units. They are having serious wheel spin and launch issues at the track and onthe street with the PROcede and whatever other flash upgrades they are using. No LSD sucks.
There are a couple of LSDs in the making as we speak. Quaife is currently building their first special limited edition units for the 335I based on the demand(minimum number required of a group buy).
On the same note the german manufacturer Hartge already has one built and tested but they are still putting more miles on their unit for reliability issues.
The BMW 335IX is about to be released in Europe, it has a full AWD system but it weights 200lbs more than the RWD.
By no means the BMW could compite against the Evo right now however, do not be surprise if the 335IX(AWD) starts tearing down the tracks pretty sooin with their AWD.
I had the chance to drive my 2 Evos from the lot brand new and I test drove a BMW 335I and I have no spare to say that the BMW 335I felt considerably faster bone stock.
I will take my 335I to the track and I will make a fair comparisson, I will compare it with the times I got when my Evos were stock. I would like to put my money on the BMW, I honestly think is faster out of the box.
Carlos
Last edited by fromWRXtoEVO; Mar 26, 2007 at 11:45 AM.
This is where I'm coming from-
I owned another European twin-turbo v6. It was a great car, but the mods were incredibly expensive and to make over 450hp was extremely difficult. I understand that the 335 is different than the B5 S4, but they do share some similarities, including smaller turbos shoved into a tight engine bay.
I think the 335 is a great car, but I don't see the gains as being crazy (especially if you start from the car's actual crank hp instead of BMW's list crank hp). It will be extremely expensive to get anywhere near the power of a medium to heavily modded Evo.
335 vs a stock Evo- Well, it's close, but the 335 is definitely more luxurious. It's also around $15k more.
I owned another European twin-turbo v6. It was a great car, but the mods were incredibly expensive and to make over 450hp was extremely difficult. I understand that the 335 is different than the B5 S4, but they do share some similarities, including smaller turbos shoved into a tight engine bay.
I think the 335 is a great car, but I don't see the gains as being crazy (especially if you start from the car's actual crank hp instead of BMW's list crank hp). It will be extremely expensive to get anywhere near the power of a medium to heavily modded Evo.
335 vs a stock Evo- Well, it's close, but the 335 is definitely more luxurious. It's also around $15k more.
moonroof
HID lights
6 speed transmission
dual zone climatizer
cruise control
on board computer
6 airbargs
13 speaker logic stereo
run flats with sensors
Plus you get 4 years /50000 miles warranty in which includes all the maintenance(belts, fluids,and everything except tires)
etc, etc
The gap on money is not all that
Can't really compare boths cars because they are in two different leagues, the Evos is a more hardcore car while the BMW is more inclined to the comfort and luxury but don't get fooled, it still does 4.8sec 0-60 and it traps 106mph and runs the 1/4 mile in 13.3 so take a pick.
Carlos
Last edited by fromWRXtoEVO; Mar 26, 2007 at 12:29 PM.
The Traction control was the cheaper way to fix the BMW traction issues with the 200hp plus RWD cars. Eventually it took over the LSDs.
Other than that the only LSDs were offered on the Ms and off course you guys already know the price tag that comes along with owning a M car. The firsts LSD offered by BMW were Clutch type and it was costly as hell to replace the inserts.
Having Quaife and Hartge ofering the new style gear LSD (ATB model) for the 335I , it will show what the real performance numbers are all about.
my .2c
Carlos
I am not arguing but where have you found that the 335i does 4.8 0-60 and and a 13.3 1/4, I remember reading it in a megazine but I cant remember those times. Those are pretty much Evo times stock and I am almost positive a heavy RWD car with no more power than the evo is going to run those times with a normal driver. Also I understand the 335i has disadvantages to the M3 but thats the point....you dont take the advans off an evo and say look a WRX handles as good now....thats pointless. I am saying from the factory the M3 will always beat the 335i around the track, you mod the 335i mod the M3. Mod for Mod the 335i will gain more power because of turbos but in the handling department the M3 will always be superior unless you do major weight reduction in the 335i. Also I dont care if the 335xi gets AWD or not because in Europe they are competing with FQ340 and FQ400, fat chance of the BMW catching them.
Last edited by dbsears; Mar 26, 2007 at 02:13 PM.
Evolving Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 132
Likes: 0
From: Palo Alto
The 15 K is not really 15K. A regular Evo 9 cost around $31000 and a Sedan 335 cost $39000. The Evo comes with Recaros and Brembo brakes but the bimmer comes with:
moonroof
HID lights
6 speed transmission
dual zone climatizer
cruise control
on board computer
6 airbargs
13 speaker logic stereo
run flats with sensors
Plus you get 4 years /50000 miles warranty in which includes all the maintenance(belts, fluids,and everything except tires)
etc, etc
The gap on money is not all that
Can't really compare boths cars because they are in two different leagues, the Evos is a more hardcore car while the BMW is more inclined to the comfort and luxury but don't get fooled, it still does 4.8sec 0-60 and it traps 106mph and runs the 1/4 mile in 13.3 so take a pick.
Carlos
moonroof
HID lights
6 speed transmission
dual zone climatizer
cruise control
on board computer
6 airbargs
13 speaker logic stereo
run flats with sensors
Plus you get 4 years /50000 miles warranty in which includes all the maintenance(belts, fluids,and everything except tires)
etc, etc
The gap on money is not all that
Can't really compare boths cars because they are in two different leagues, the Evos is a more hardcore car while the BMW is more inclined to the comfort and luxury but don't get fooled, it still does 4.8sec 0-60 and it traps 106mph and runs the 1/4 mile in 13.3 so take a pick.
Carlos
I can get a IX SE for under $30k. You won't be able to drive a 335 off the lot for under $40k. A reasonably equipped one will go for $45k and you'd be very, very lucky to find one priced under $43k sitting on a lot. BMW isn't known for spitting out base models of the 330/335.
No one's disputing that it's a nicer car, but it's not the be all end all of automobiles.
I can get a IX SE for under $30k. You won't be able to drive a 335 off the lot for under $40k. A reasonably equipped one will go for $45k and you'd be very, very lucky to find one priced under $43k sitting on a lot. BMW isn't known for spitting out base models of the 330/335.
No one's disputing that it's a nicer car, but it's not the be all end all of automobiles.
No one's disputing that it's a nicer car, but it's not the be all end all of automobiles.
You are comparing me now a Evo 9 SE which not only it has been in the market for a while but is about to not be available at all.
Your SE model is way cheaper because they are about to launch the Evo X and all the Evo 9 prices will drop to the floor just weeks prior to the release of the Evo X. But that is jut not the Evo X but just about any other model car from any other manufacturer that would replace an existing model for the new coming up model.
As per the BMW being $45k with options, well, I actually gave you the price of the sedan MSRP. Drop a few between $1000 and $2000 from trhe difference of Invoice and MSRP and additionall you can get 9% MSRP with the European delivery, that is what I am doing (saving up about $4000).
So once again, the difference between a sedan well equipped 335i and a regular Evo is barely $5000 which all that is justifiable with the equipment and warranty I previously mention.
http://www.mitsubishimotors.com/MMNA...d.do?loc=en-us
http://www.bmwusa.com/vehicles/3/335isedan/default
The Evo 9 SE is listed for $33875 while the sedan 335 i is listed for 38900 that is $5000 difference, minus $4000 for the european delivery that is $1000 difference and you still get:
moonroof
HID lights
6 speed transmission
dual zone climatizer
cruise control
on board computer
6 airbargs
13 speaker logic stereo
run flats with sensors
Plus you get 4 years /50000 miles warranty in which includes all the maintenance(belts, fluids,and everything except tires)
Shall we talk more....
Carlos
Last edited by fromWRXtoEVO; Mar 26, 2007 at 02:28 PM.
Evolving Member
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 151
Likes: 0
From: Boston, China & Taiwan
Yeah, and Big two Mitsubishi dealer from Phoenix was offering the Evo 8 MR for $5000 over the price when it was new. Not only that dealer but many many other dealers were marking up the prices for the Evo in some cases up to $10000.
You are comparing me now a Evo 9 SE which not only it has been in the market for a while but is about to not be available at all.
Your SE model is way cheaper because they are about to launch the Evo X and all the Evo 9 prices will drop to the floor just weeks prior to the release of the Evo X. But that is jut not the Evo X but just about any other model car from any other manufacturer that would replace an existing model for the new coming up model.
As per the BMW being $45k with options, well, I actually gave you the price of the sedan MSRP. Drop a few between $1000 and $2000 from trhe difference of Invoice and MSRP and additionall you can get 9% MSRP with the European delivery, that is what I am doing (saving up about $4000).
So once again, the difference between a sedan well equipped 335i and a regular Evo is barely $5000 which all that is justifiable with the equipment and warranty I previously mention.
http://www.mitsubishimotors.com/MMNA...d.do?loc=en-us
http://www.bmwusa.com/vehicles/3/335isedan/default
The Evo 9 SE is listed for $33875 while the sedan 335 i is listed for 38900 that is $5000 difference, minus $4000 for the european delivery that is $1000 difference and you still get:
moonroof
HID lights
6 speed transmission
dual zone climatizer
cruise control
on board computer
6 airbargs
13 speaker logic stereo
run flats with sensors
Plus you get 4 years /50000 miles warranty in which includes all the maintenance(belts, fluids,and everything except tires)
Shall we talk more....
Carlos
You are comparing me now a Evo 9 SE which not only it has been in the market for a while but is about to not be available at all.
Your SE model is way cheaper because they are about to launch the Evo X and all the Evo 9 prices will drop to the floor just weeks prior to the release of the Evo X. But that is jut not the Evo X but just about any other model car from any other manufacturer that would replace an existing model for the new coming up model.
As per the BMW being $45k with options, well, I actually gave you the price of the sedan MSRP. Drop a few between $1000 and $2000 from trhe difference of Invoice and MSRP and additionall you can get 9% MSRP with the European delivery, that is what I am doing (saving up about $4000).
So once again, the difference between a sedan well equipped 335i and a regular Evo is barely $5000 which all that is justifiable with the equipment and warranty I previously mention.
http://www.mitsubishimotors.com/MMNA...d.do?loc=en-us
http://www.bmwusa.com/vehicles/3/335isedan/default
The Evo 9 SE is listed for $33875 while the sedan 335 i is listed for 38900 that is $5000 difference, minus $4000 for the european delivery that is $1000 difference and you still get:
moonroof
HID lights
6 speed transmission
dual zone climatizer
cruise control
on board computer
6 airbargs
13 speaker logic stereo
run flats with sensors
Plus you get 4 years /50000 miles warranty in which includes all the maintenance(belts, fluids,and everything except tires)
Shall we talk more....
Carlos
I'm just playing, that's not bad for a 335i. The $4000 savings from European delivery ... is that figure inclusive of the money you'll spend on the trip to Europe?
Evolving Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 132
Likes: 0
From: Palo Alto
Dude, quoting MSRP before options for a BMW makes no sense.
The number you quoted doesn't even include paint!
Show me a BMW you can drive off the lot without paint.
Also, BMW's mark down for the 335i is less than you've said. How'd you swing the extra savings?
Either way, I'm looking to take a vacation at the end of the summer and may have just found a reason to get a new car
The number you quoted doesn't even include paint!
Show me a BMW you can drive off the lot without paint.
Also, BMW's mark down for the 335i is less than you've said. How'd you swing the extra savings?
Either way, I'm looking to take a vacation at the end of the summer and may have just found a reason to get a new car
Last edited by doccommando; Mar 26, 2007 at 05:25 PM.
Carlos,
I know you know your ****, there is no question about that. However, I am saying stock weighted evo (minus the spare tire and jack) at the track with minor bolt-ons at the track can run 11's with no need to drop any other pounds like you said the 335i would ( I believe you said 100-150lbs). I mean I think IX's were hitting 11's within a few months of their release (yes it has a 4G63 Engine but to some its a different animal). In addition to that statement, how is a full exhaust, a simple MBC, and a tune technology that needs time to develop. Yes it takes time to establish a solid tune on a new car, but freeing up an exhaust to some extent should be relatively easy in comparison to a tune, and take little time to do so. I thought I read somewhere, Shiv was having probems with traction with a completely stock 335i...and if this is true, and you were to put equal skilled drivers in both cars wouldn't the evo come out on top in the 1/4 mile due to traction. I mean hell, I am sure the 335i would trap higher but the fact that it can't hook and has no LSD isn't a excuse you use at the track. "O man, I would have had you if I could hook"...my response to something like that would be like "then drop 600 on tires"...whereas stock evo's will hook obviously and take off... And I completely agree with just a chip in those Beamers they can stick and barely beat out an Evo 9 from a highway roll there is no denying that, and no where did I say anythign about street racing from a highway roll. I am talking about at the track, for the money, the Evo 9 will put up better numbers . In essence, it takes less mods on a 335i to make the same power as a Evo IX with more mods, however, you pay more for the less amount of mods on a 335i. Once again, you pay to play with those cars, and for the money (pending on your needs and in this case a head to head comparison), call me arrogant, the Evo seems to be a better choice.
And that is just my 2cents...my girlfriend has a 335i and its fast I have driven it, hell I am gonna drive it tonight when we go to dinner but you guys want to know what her daddy paid for it....48 G's (yea that is rite)...hell when she said that I was thinking stroker and a GT35R!!!
Evo FTMFW
I know you know your ****, there is no question about that. However, I am saying stock weighted evo (minus the spare tire and jack) at the track with minor bolt-ons at the track can run 11's with no need to drop any other pounds like you said the 335i would ( I believe you said 100-150lbs). I mean I think IX's were hitting 11's within a few months of their release (yes it has a 4G63 Engine but to some its a different animal). In addition to that statement, how is a full exhaust, a simple MBC, and a tune technology that needs time to develop. Yes it takes time to establish a solid tune on a new car, but freeing up an exhaust to some extent should be relatively easy in comparison to a tune, and take little time to do so. I thought I read somewhere, Shiv was having probems with traction with a completely stock 335i...and if this is true, and you were to put equal skilled drivers in both cars wouldn't the evo come out on top in the 1/4 mile due to traction. I mean hell, I am sure the 335i would trap higher but the fact that it can't hook and has no LSD isn't a excuse you use at the track. "O man, I would have had you if I could hook"...my response to something like that would be like "then drop 600 on tires"...whereas stock evo's will hook obviously and take off... And I completely agree with just a chip in those Beamers they can stick and barely beat out an Evo 9 from a highway roll there is no denying that, and no where did I say anythign about street racing from a highway roll. I am talking about at the track, for the money, the Evo 9 will put up better numbers . In essence, it takes less mods on a 335i to make the same power as a Evo IX with more mods, however, you pay more for the less amount of mods on a 335i. Once again, you pay to play with those cars, and for the money (pending on your needs and in this case a head to head comparison), call me arrogant, the Evo seems to be a better choice.
And that is just my 2cents...my girlfriend has a 335i and its fast I have driven it, hell I am gonna drive it tonight when we go to dinner but you guys want to know what her daddy paid for it....48 G's (yea that is rite)...hell when she said that I was thinking stroker and a GT35R!!!
Evo FTMFW
Sligdaddy91,
I love your review and I totally concur with everything you said, I was actually very suprised with your last statement about your G/F owning 335I, that purely tells me that you know what time it is.
To reiterate my previous comments, I will concur one more time with you, yes the Evo 9 will be the king of the 1/4 mile track. The BMW weight reduction I was referring to is actually true, just the cat back alone weights 78lbs on a 335I and I mentioned before, the BMW run flat tires full assy weights 17lbs more pertire/rim than a Evo wheel/tire. The leather, the moonroof, the 6 airbags and all the luxury components makes this car that heavy.
I am curious of what model your G/F has(auto/,manual,sedan/coupe)? I still strongly believe that once the LSDs arrive for this car and people start using some D/R then the BMW will be a decent competitive car.
Carlos
I love your review
and I totally concur with everything you said, I was actually very suprised with your last statement about your G/F owning 335I, that purely tells me that you know what time it is.To reiterate my previous comments, I will concur one more time with you, yes the Evo 9 will be the king of the 1/4 mile track. The BMW weight reduction I was referring to is actually true, just the cat back alone weights 78lbs on a 335I and I mentioned before, the BMW run flat tires full assy weights 17lbs more pertire/rim than a Evo wheel/tire. The leather, the moonroof, the 6 airbags and all the luxury components makes this car that heavy.
I am curious of what model your G/F has(auto/,manual,sedan/coupe)? I still strongly believe that once the LSDs arrive for this car and people start using some D/R then the BMW will be a decent competitive car.
Carlos
Dude, quoting MSRP before options for a BMW makes no sense.
The number you quoted doesn't even include paint!
Show me a BMW you can drive off the lot without paint.
Also, BMW's mark down for the 335i is less than you've said. How'd you swing the extra savings?
Either way, I'm looking to take a vacation at the end of the summer and may have just found a reason to get a new car
The number you quoted doesn't even include paint!
Show me a BMW you can drive off the lot without paint.
Also, BMW's mark down for the 335i is less than you've said. How'd you swing the extra savings?
Either way, I'm looking to take a vacation at the end of the summer and may have just found a reason to get a new car
The quotes I gave you can't blame on me for quoting MSRP before options, the same rule would had apply for any other car manufacturer and for any invoive or MSRP situation/application.
As far is the savings, well, I already posted the links, all you have to do is take a moment and read the European delivery customer option. You will save roughly $4000 picking it up from Munich , Germany , that is excatly what I am doing.
I might arguably admit that then you have to spen the moeny to travel to Germany, Yes but I must also mention that it is a vacation justified trip and above all you still save about $3000 even when compare to the USA sales.
In my personal case, since I am a man in the service I can fly to and from Germany for free and also take my entire family for free. As per the place to stay, well, I already have that taking care of.
I am not bragging at all, I am saying this European option is there not just for military people but for civilian as well.
Carlos
Last edited by fromWRXtoEVO; Mar 26, 2007 at 06:27 PM.
Evolving Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 132
Likes: 0
From: Palo Alto
Carlos,
I think we might differ on a few math points (and you're right about the non-metallic paint), but you've convinced me that the 335i with European pick up might make sense as a real option for me. I can't fly free, but I was going to travel to Europe in the fall anyway and Lufthansa does a 2 tickets for the price of 1 deal that's an added incentive.
As far as the price to own the car-
The 335 gets better gas mileage
Has free maintenence
Is it cheaper to insure? My Evo is only a few dollars more than my WRX, but they're both expensive to insure, so maybe it is.
Anyway, I should go do some test drives
Also, were you able to get a deal or did you have to pay MSRP?
I think we might differ on a few math points (and you're right about the non-metallic paint), but you've convinced me that the 335i with European pick up might make sense as a real option for me. I can't fly free, but I was going to travel to Europe in the fall anyway and Lufthansa does a 2 tickets for the price of 1 deal that's an added incentive.
As far as the price to own the car-
The 335 gets better gas mileage
Has free maintenence
Is it cheaper to insure? My Evo is only a few dollars more than my WRX, but they're both expensive to insure, so maybe it is.
Anyway, I should go do some test drives
Also, were you able to get a deal or did you have to pay MSRP?
Last edited by doccommando; Mar 26, 2007 at 07:41 PM.
Carlos,
I think we might differ on a few math points (and you're right about the non-metallic paint), but you've convinced me that the 335i with European pick up might make sense as a real option for me. I can't fly free, but I was going to travel to Europe in the fall anyway and Lufthansa does a 2 tickets for the price of 1 deal that's an added incentive.
As far as the price to own the car-
The 335 gets better gas mileage
Has free maintenence
Is it cheaper to insure? My Evo is only a few dollars more than my WRX, but they're both expensive to insure, so maybe it is.
Anyway, I should go do some test drives
Also, were you able to get a deal or did you have to pay MSRP?
I think we might differ on a few math points (and you're right about the non-metallic paint), but you've convinced me that the 335i with European pick up might make sense as a real option for me. I can't fly free, but I was going to travel to Europe in the fall anyway and Lufthansa does a 2 tickets for the price of 1 deal that's an added incentive.
As far as the price to own the car-
The 335 gets better gas mileage
Has free maintenence
Is it cheaper to insure? My Evo is only a few dollars more than my WRX, but they're both expensive to insure, so maybe it is.
Anyway, I should go do some test drives
Also, were you able to get a deal or did you have to pay MSRP?
The source of information which I had access on the invoice price has misteriously dissapeared, it was www.edmunds.com.
Anyway, the sedan Invoice was $35000 and some change, and you still get the MSRP deal cut so it basiclly equals to the invoice.
Yes indeed Lufthansa is offering a buy one ticket get the second one free and the offer goes all year around. The shipping cost of shipping it back from Europe is included on the price so that is a smoking deal.
In top of that remember that the BMW is significantly cheaper to insure than a Evo or a WRX (I had boths cars).
Even if you buy the sedan 335i the performance is simply astonishing, this 3600lbs pig is almost tie with the Evo 9 on braking, and is neck to neck in 0-60 and 1/4 mile acceleration and trap speed without breaking a sweat. Either configuration you might choose(sedan, coupe, manual,auto) the car feels fast and is fast.
This car is a valuable option for those that get tire of the hardcore driving style of the Evo and want something almost as quick but without refusing the comfort and better gas mileage.
The maintenance is completely free for 4 years, everything is covered except tires, even the clutches and off course the labor.
It is something to start thinking about it. I went for a test drive on a C6 Z06 and it was lacking on some aspects however the sedan auto that I drove was simply a blast, it felt faster than my Evo 8 and 9 when I bought them new from the box.
I highly encourage you to at least go for test drive. I originally want it a test drive on a manual but then I test drove an auto and I was hooked.
The answer to your last question, it depends on the dealer, I did not get much less of the MSRP, there is only one dealer in Tucson so they are cocky as hell but I know of other dealers which offer the same car for less than MSRP. The fact that the car is very new and desirable makes a big impact on the sale price.
Carlos
Last edited by fromWRXtoEVO; Mar 26, 2007 at 09:16 PM.
