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The Loft / EvoM Car Talk CornerThe landing pad for automotive discussions, news, articles, and opinions. A place for the community to kick back and chat.
I have a buddy willing to sell me his 2014 X MR. Other than a flash from Razorlab, it's completely stock. It's been so well cared for, and has 37k miles on the odometer.
The CTR formula is simple. Good power, great brakes, solid chassis, ample rubber. Put all that in a blender and subtract weight. For the footprint this car has, it's surprisingly light. Mine was 3080 lbs with an almost full tank of fuel. Back to back driving, you can feel that lack of heft in the CTR in all handling actions. The Civic is pretty quick, many have trapped 108mph bone stock. On VIR at Car and Driver's Lightning Lap, the CTR is quicker than the fastest X tested by almost 7 seconds. I would say that if you buy a car and intend to keep it stock, the CTR is dang near perfect at this level. The factory engine tuning is great, ample torque and pulls with authority to the rev limiter. DI fuel economy is good. I'm averaging about 27mpg.
Where the Honda falls down is when you modify it. So many people are tuning these, and due to hardware restrictions, the results aren't good. Valvetrain float starts at a disappointingly low 7300rpm. The stock turbo is pretty small, especially on the hot side, which doesn't matter since the fuel system can't even support a full bolt on car stock turbo with E30 fuel. All that to say, it is crazy cost prohibitive to make good horsepower with the K20C1. There aren't any fast ones in the wild yet, including the prior gen FK2 Type R with the same engine.
Back in the seat of the X, it's like being with an old friend. The place the Evo really shines is that gem of an engine. It revs and revs and then revs some more. They both indicate the same redline, but the K20C1 fuel cuts a full 800rpm before the 4B11. Of course I love the AWD and SAYC. The tunability is legendary. The Recaros are so much better to me than the Type R seats. I can sit in them for hours without lower back pain. Most other cars make me a little uncomfortable after about 45 minutes.
Evo downsides? You can feel the extra 400+ pounds, but the crazy-quick steering rack hides it well. The audio system and controls are pretty dated, but at least the HVAC controls aren't hidden behind stupid touch screen menus like the Civic. With this car being an SST, I respect its performance and lightning-fast shifts, but I prefer the manual in the CTR for driver immersion. I also am uncertain about long term replacement parts and servicing for this transmission. Hopefully Getrag will supply them for years to come.
I had a brief stint with a Mk 7 Golf R, and while a great quality car, it's not dynamically in the league of these two by a long shot.
At the end of the day, I would love to own both of these cars. Perhaps someday.
There is something about an Evo that just sticks with you. I'm not sure what it is, just a familiarity and completeness is the only way i could describe it. This is my 3rd EVO, and while i look at it and wonder what something else new would look like in it's place in the garage, I just can't find it in me to get rid of it. I have a feeling ill be that guy driving an Evo 10yrs from now and people looking at it like "i remember those things."
. I would say that if you buy a car and intend to keep it stock, the CTR is dang near perfect at this level. The factory engine tuning is great, ample torque and pulls with authority to the rev limiter. DI fuel economy is good. I'm averaging about 27mpg.
I've been trying to tell this to our local guys, but they just HAVE to mod for more power. No matter what I think the car works extremely well. Honda put time into making it that way (much like the old CTR and ITR). Anyone I know that has started modding the new CTR ended up making it worse. It's on my very, very short list of cars I'm considering buying. To be on that list, the car has to be enjoyable as-is because I'm kinda tired of modding a car, seeing how I live in Kalifornia. Anyone I know with a CTR absolutely loved it... even after the failed mods LOL
For the EVO MR as long you are good for cashing out 6K to service a transmission with a broken fork. Something that sooner or later might happen. Is the number one reason of SST failure.
If you are good with it then you will love it.
Thinking about the CTR as well but dealers around So Cal are able to get away with robbing people so it's off my list for now. I have a 2010 X MR-T and the SST trans is doing ok so far (69k miles) with its expensive fluid changed roughly every 20k miles. This touring edition is good for daily drive and shift like a robot no mistake, but I still love to shift my own in the VIII more.
There is something about an Evo that just sticks with you. I'm not sure what it is, just a familiarity and completeness is the only way i could describe it. This is my 3rd EVO, and while i look at it and wonder what something else new would look like in it's place in the garage, I just can't find it in me to get rid of it. I have a feeling ill be that guy driving an Evo 10yrs from now and people looking at it like "i remember those things."
The spouse and I have been out of state most of the warm months this year, my 16 year old Evo eating mile after mile. I come home to change oil. I can't praise it enough.
I injured my back early this spring and was almost immobilized and only now am able to get around. The Recaro seats made this travel possible.
If you don't buy the evo I need to check it out. My wife has wanted an evo x mr for a long time and white is the only color we want. What is he asking? I'm just a skip away in Huntsville, AL. Please! lol
EDIT: Her Bday is this weekend. I really want it! Keep the Type R!
If you don't buy the evo I need to check it out. My wife has wanted an evo x mr for a long time and white is the only color we want. What is he asking? I'm just a skip away in Huntsville, AL. Please! lol
EDIT: Her Bday is this weekend. I really want it! Keep the Type R!
~$27k. I haven't ruled it out for sure. Would love to have both, but I'm sure that would cause my wife to hire an assassin. If you'd like, shoot me a PM and I'll put you in touch with him.
Bummer about the seats in the CTR - makes it hard to enjoy driving long if it makes you hurt.
So are you going to buy the X MR?
Man, I want to, but I am selling my house with a 3 car garage and am closing on one with a two car garage in a couple weeks. I think best bet would be to pay the little I owe on our two cars and run car debt free for a few years until my 13 year old inherits my wife's GTI.
I have a buddy willing to sell me his 2014 X MR. Other than a flash from Razorlab, it's completely stock. It's been so well cared for, and has 37k miles on the odometer.
The CTR formula is simple. Good power, great brakes, solid chassis, ample rubber. Put all that in a blender and subtract weight. For the footprint this car has, it's surprisingly light. Mine was 3080 lbs with an almost full tank of fuel. Back to back driving, you can feel that lack of heft in the CTR in all handling actions. The Civic is pretty quick, many have trapped 108mph bone stock. On VIR at Car and Driver's Lightning Lap, the CTR is quicker than the fastest X tested by almost 7 seconds. I would say that if you buy a car and intend to keep it stock, the CTR is dang near perfect at this level. The factory engine tuning is great, ample torque and pulls with authority to the rev limiter. DI fuel economy is good. I'm averaging about 27mpg.
Where the Honda falls down is when you modify it. So many people are tuning these, and due to hardware restrictions, the results aren't good. Valvetrain float starts at a disappointingly low 7300rpm. The stock turbo is pretty small, especially on the hot side, which doesn't matter since the fuel system can't even support a full bolt on car stock turbo with E30 fuel. All that to say, it is crazy cost prohibitive to make good horsepower with the K20C1. There aren't any fast ones in the wild yet, including the prior gen FK2 Type R with the same engine.
Back in the seat of the X, it's like being with an old friend. The place the Evo really shines is that gem of an engine. It revs and revs and then revs some more. They both indicate the same redline, but the K20C1 fuel cuts a full 800rpm before the 4B11. Of course I love the AWD and SAYC. The tunability is legendary. The Recaros are so much better to me than the Type R seats. I can sit in them for hours without lower back pain. Most other cars make me a little uncomfortable after about 45 minutes.
Evo downsides? You can feel the extra 400+ pounds, but the crazy-quick steering rack hides it well. The audio system and controls are pretty dated, but at least the HVAC controls aren't hidden behind stupid touch screen menus like the Civic. With this car being an SST, I respect its performance and lightning-fast shifts, but I prefer the manual in the CTR for driver immersion. I also am uncertain about long term replacement parts and servicing for this transmission. Hopefully Getrag will supply them for years to come.
I had a brief stint with a Mk 7 Golf R, and while a great quality car, it's not dynamically in the league of these two by a long shot.
At the end of the day, I would love to own both of these cars. Perhaps someday.
The Type R is still a neat car and I'm only sharing my opinion. After owning an AWD car for years it really spoils you for around town fun. Point the car, mash the gas and it just moves out.
I haven't driven a Type R but I do own a tuned DSG Mk7 Golf R . It has near instant response and from 0-70 is a Riot around town. I have a hard time believing the Civic will put the power down well all the time with only being FWD. On a drag strip it will with a fine tuned launch. On the street, not as well as AWD in all conditions.
The styling of the Evo X and Golf R appeal more to me personally then the Type R.
The golf rides well enough and gets around 25-30mpg beating on it. Has ample storage and fits tall drivers well.
I'm sure there's lots of people who disagree with this and I don't mean to offend but I think the CTR is absolutely hideous. At least the Evo X has style and doesn't look like it was designed by a committee... If I were to get a Honda, i'd just buy an Si or accord and use the money I save to put towards another Evo hahaha.
Jul 4, 2019, 07:24 PM
I think the car works extremely well. Honda put time into making it that way (much like the old CTR and ITR). Anyone I know that has started modding the new CTR ended up making it worse. It's on my very, very short list of cars I'm considering buying. To be on that list, the car has to be enjoyable as-is because I'm kinda tired of modding a car, seeing how I live in Kalifornia. Anyone I know with a CTR absolutely loved it... even after the failed mods LOL
