I dont doubt there is something to be gained, but im having a very difficult time with their guarantee that it will reduce your lap time by 1-2 seconds. Can you post a link where it shows them claiming that statement?

 

It is hard to believe- but it's true. On a road course, we have seen up to 6 seconds off of a lap (1:40ish lap time). All courses will vary obviously, but there are significant gains to be had. I wouldn't even thing about going through all the trouble of starting a website, testing, getting an LLC, etc if it didn't work. I would not try to sell some bs to anybody. I love racing my evo, I love beating Sti's, I want to see evo's kick **** on every level. I want to prove that this is the next big thing that truly works.

On average, we see 1 sec off every 30 seconds for autox- some might be less, but like I said average. I don't thing that's a bad average either.

Matt

 

I have 0 autox experience, so if you tell me 1-2 seconds is possible on an autox course i might believe it. But, 1-2 sec on an autox course is entirely different than 1-2sec on a road course. I am extremely skeptical that this mod is worth 1-2sec on a road course. So no offense, but if someone told me i could drop 6sec on a road course with this mod i would laugh.

 

I dropped 1.5-3 seconds off my times with the Gruppe-S race version with no rear diff modifications. More so at Homestead due to the hairpin-like turns. However I believe Matt's sounds like the better option starting with the support and customization i've been hearing about (driving style, tire, track etc).

It is best to get both so the system itself is upgraded rather then one part working against the other as others have stated. I'll be doing that later on $.

 

I could certainly see it doing that on an otherwise stockish car, but I'd suspect on a fully developed road race car the gains will be smaller. That said, when you're running a restrictor and are limited on tire size, its always good to explore the other parts of the car that haven't been optimized.

IIRC, folks in gravel events were claiming 1 second per mile improvements going from the stock ACD mapping to MoTeC and Ralliart boxes...but the ACD is likely working harder on slippery conditions, therefore there's more room for improvement.

Dave

 

You guys are correct when it comes to the time dropping- the best results are with less modded cars. There are still results to be had with fully built cars, but they are smaller. To someone with a not so heavily modded car, an acd tune is the best bang for the buck out there.

When we figured out how this system worked and tested on road courses, we were amazed and could not believe the results. We had to do a double take ourselves.

One of our testers got OVER 2 seconds off on a one mile racetrack in England. I saw all the data to support it- he had no motives other than to drive.

Believe it or not, as soon as numbers and reviews come out I will be saying.....

 

I hope you all remember that im being honest and that no one takes offense to what im saying.

Matt, if you dropped 1.5-3sec with the Gruppe-S mod, id say something isnt adding up. Either your suspension/alignment/whatever isnt optimized enough, or you dont have enough seat time to be able to harness more speed out of your setup even if its lacking. IMO, those are the 2 general factors that create misleading results like that.

 

Again, hope you dont take offense to what im saying. Results by themselves can be misleading. For instance, take a look at what i wrote in response to Matts post. Beyond that, id want to know who are the people that are testing your mod. Are they driving that car on the same track regularly all year long? "Pro" drivers vary in skill and so do "Advanced" level drivers. Some people drive every once in a while. Some people drive all the time. Some people race the same car without any changes several times a month. Some advanced drivers can drop 1-3sec on the same track because they dont drive it often. Or maybe theyve made some changes to their car. Because of all those factors, and countless others, results can be misleading by themselves. Im not claiming to be some expert but ive done a little bit of testing myself in the 3yrs ive been racing. And i can say that its a very challenging task to undertake because unless youre driving the tracks youre planning on testing on a regular basis, and youre at a point as a driver that youre dropping time by tenths-hundredths of a sec, your results are going to be difficult to make any noteworthy sense out of. Beyond that, maybe your setup isnt quite optimized enough. And then you take your not so optimized car and add this new acd mod and now youre all of a sudden 2-3-6 seconds faster. So maybe your setup is whats creating those misleading results. Because if your car was setup better to begin with you would have only dropped .5-1sec at best. Or, maybe you dont have enough seat time as a driver to begin with. Given my experience, if someone told me id drop 2sec on the tracks i race on with this mod id say...there is no way. So if you told me i can potentially drop 6sec, im not sure what i would say, but id walk away.

 

That wasn't me that dropped time with the GS flash, but that's either here nor there. I guess what I'm trying to say is that this is a great mod that has results. These results aren't misleading- I have a customer in Australia who won his division using my programming. This mod is no different than adding coilovers, sway bars, etc. All those things make the car handle better- for you to say that something is wrong or poor driving is a bit on the harsh side.

All of the testing I have done across the world has yielded positive results. That's a lot of people that are doing stuff wrong then in your eyes- even Dean who won his division

What this mod does is add a lot more exit speed out of turns... kinda like an aftermarket diff. I'm also not saying that every car will drop 6 seconds- it is the most we have seen. For me to claim that everybody will drop 6 seconds would be stupid and untrue. Do not take my words out of context please.

I don't like to get into stuff like this as I don't think it has a point- pure banter. No one is making you buy into this- if you don't believe it, that's fine- no matter to me.

Matt

 

If we met id ask you the same questions and pose the same arguments. Problem is that when you do it online it comes across as harsh. I dont doubt that there is something to be gained with your mod, but given my experience, i just dont see how its possible for me to be 2sec, let alone 6sec faster. And honestly, i still wouldnt believe it even if you got a pro whos well known on the forums to stand by it. Plenty of pro drivers like that who most HPDE guys know of...lets use Mike Skeen as an example. Id still challenge you on it and would want to find out for myself because i dont see how this mod would allow me to drop up to 2sec, and possibly up to 6. I invite you to come out here and prove me wrong.

 

Bueller,

One more thing and then I'm done with this conversation. Do you thing motec would spend the time and money developing an aftermarket acd cont unit if it didn't work? Do you think they would sell it for as much money as they do if it didn't work? Why don't you look up the results people have had with the motec and then come say the things you are saying. The stock unit is just as tunable as the motec minus one switchable map and a limp mode feature- other than that, the same gains can be had.

Maybe you should try do do some research on this subject (acd tuning) before you make the comments you do because right now you are talking about something you don't know anything about- and that's ok because there aren't a whole lot of people that do. I am here to educate and show what it possible with this relatively new found technology.

Once again, I'm not saying everybody is taking 6 seconds off their lap time- don't mix my words up. All I said is that we saw a drop of 6 seconds on one course, blah blah blah. The normal time to drop on a road course is 2-4 seconds- believe it or not, I don't care.

And I'm done.

Matt

 

So what youre saying is that as soon as someone with the slightest bit of experience challenges you...you say youre done. I dont understand forums.

 

anyway i think we determined that the mod *may* slip through the cracks in terms of adding points for nasa TT. Any free points that may even add a half second is worth trying given your level of competitiveness.

I really think you should give it a try. I'm sure you can work out an arrangement to at least give it a test drive. If I lived in Cali I'd let you swap in mine. There are tremendous gains to be had in terms of corner exit that actually compliment a rear diff mod. Every single corner you will enter and exit quicker, with higher exit speeds.. You've got at least a second in potential there. No small beans for $350 when your suspension set up is already where you want it to be.

just my $.02

 

The reason for me being done was 'how' you challenged me, saying that it has to be poor driving or poor setup and that's how we got our gains. I'll be honest- that kinda infuriated me

Scenario- you just bought your evo and ran a 1:30 at xtrack. You put coilovers on and ran a 1:27 at same xtrack. You put sway bars on and ran 1:26 at same xtrack. You put an alignment on your car and now you ran 1:24 on same xtrack. This is a very real scenario correct?

According to your first agrument or points you made, that same driver that just dropped time either had his setup wrong or not enough seat time. That's a false statement and that's what I was trying to say. Every mod you make will drop time just a bit correct? What I am trying to say is that this is another mod that will drop time. Yes the gains go down as you build your car more and you try to squeaze out that last little bit.

As far as experience goes- do you think I have never raced before? I have autox(finished 2nd palce over 200 drivers), raced on circuits (maybe not uber competitive), and have tried rally racing. I have been doing this for over 6 years and have somewhat of an idea of what I'm doing. I am no pro- that's for sure, but I do love to race and I do love to find ways to drop time and make my car handle better.

Matt

 

I'm with Bueller on this one - 6 seconds is a total laugh.

And maybe it's because Bueller and I have been tracking our Evo's for a few years. There's no STi in the land that even lines up in my class these days. I can think of a handful out there that put down faster laptimes than me; and those 3 specific ones (LIC, TIC, Element Tuning) all have 200whp+ more than me. So for me; a measuring stick is a modded Vette, 911's, decked out e46's, Boss 302's, Vipers, etc.

I'm not saying that this in theory couldn't help. As a good reference point, when I added the Shep Racing rear diff to my setup along with a wider tire and 50whp, (already on Hoosiers and coilovers) I dropped about 1.5-3 seconds per track. Those are 1.7-2.5 mile courses. Everything works in concert (again; echoing Bueller).

Another good reference point was after having my car setup to rotate how I liked it this year, I ran a session at Road America on my low boost pumpgas tune. Now RPM wise with shift points, I wasn't a whole lot different around the track. But where I could get on the gas and when I could get to 100% throttle changed a ton. With the reduction in power AND torque, the car just didn't rotate as it did before. My lateral G's - especially sustained - dropped a ton. (I've got the traqmate data to prove it if anyone cares). I bet this is one area my Shep Rear Diff - and likewise an ACD reflash could really help gain time. Varies by track; I understand that.