cheap affordable Rally for everyone :)
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Joined: Jan 2007
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From: Park Ridge N.J.
cheap affordable Rally for everyone :)
Now if you have a track car or any race car there is some full tarmac events in the states, which are held on public streets roads... 
Anyway from 2012 there is a new CATEGORY can run rally events.
Check this out !
"
PR: NASA Rally Sport Expands To Include RallySolo - Rally Without Codrivers
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Orlando, Florida, Performance Racing Industry Trade Show (December 2, 2011)
NASA Rally Sport continues its role as the innovation leader and grassroots champion with its introduction of the new RallySolo class for 2012. This program allows drivers to attack the rally stages without the traditionally required navigator. This move, which opens up the events to an entirely new group of racers, is great news for the existing events.
'Organizing rallies is all about getting people to come out and participate.' says Anders Green of NASA Rally Sport. 'The more folks you can get out on the stages, the more excitement and fun there is for everyone, and the more affordable the events can be for all the racers. We want to be inclusive and get as many racers as possible out on the stages. The more the merrier! RallySolo adds to the existing racing, we have no plans to displace the traditional format of a two person team.'
Motorsport is dominated by single-seat cars, with rally being a notable standout by requiring a team of driver and navigator. There is nothing unusual about racing solo on gravel or dirt, however. Desert races like the Baja 1000 have a long history of allowing single seat classes. Hillclimbs around the country also allow the same arrangement. The challenge and excitement of a single driver, pushing themselves in an endurance test against the clock, will appeal to many of the rugged individualists that make up the racing community.
The cost savings of building a rally car without the provisions for a navigator is at least one to two thousand dollars in addition to another thousand dollars or more in safety equipment for the second occupant. The challenge of besting the stages without a navigator will appeal to a new, different group of racers. The existing rally community has a deep passion for the current format of driver and navigator, and while the RallySolo program will seem gimmicky to them, it was not designed for existing competitors.
'A great driver and navigator team will always be faster than a solo driver, there's no question. A couple of our regulars may try RallySolo, but I don't expect any significant count of existing rally drivers will switch to it long term.' say Green. 'We're not trying to take the existing group of rally racers and cut the pie into different shaped slices. This is really about expanding the sport and getting new blood involved. Growing the sport is critical, and that means having open minds and trying out new ideas. If solo drivers can navigate through 1000 miles of open Mexican desert, I'm fully confident they can successfully navigate the closed roads of a rally.'
The program will appeal most to new drivers just getting started in the sport. The reduced complexity in the car build and simpler team requirements mean a lower initial barrier to getting started. In the same way that all racers continually upgrade their race cars, it is believed that RallySolo drivers will race solo for a couple years, and then 'upgrade' to racing with a codriver to further increase their speed.
'Many of us have forgotten how tough it was when we got started in rally.' continued Green. 'Now, to get started as a rally driver, you need to convince your best friend that they should shell out $1400 dollars for safety gear and a rally license just to sit next to you. When you're new and just getting into the sport, that is a serious barrier to entry. In the last decade, participation in rally in the US has been cut in half. For those that love rally, it would be irresponsible not to create ways to increase entries when the sport has faced such continual declines in recent years.'
One of the fundamental aspects of traditional race tracks that make them successful is that they are inherently able to support multiple uses. There might be stock cars one weekend, motorcycles the next, open wheel racing the next, followed by non-timed driving schools. This flexibility of use is what allows these facilities to operate in the black. Until recently, rally events have been extremely limited in the types of vehicles that could run, limited to just one type: two person rally cars. NASA Rally Sport increased the options by introducing RallyMoto to allow motorcycles on rally stages, and continues to expand the opportunities of rallies to attract new racers with the RallySolo program. Producing a rally event is very resource intensive and the temporary 'track' that is created should be fully utilized by a large field of racers.
The first rally offering the RallySolo program is the Sandblast Rally based in Cheraw, South Carolina. On February 4th, 2012, Sandblast Rally will debut this next evolution of rally racing. Five years ago at the very same event, NASA Rally Sport introduced the RallyMoto program, which allowed motorcycle riders to compete on rally stages. RallyMoto remains the most successful program in modern US rallying at bringing new racers to the rally stages, and NASA Rally Sport hopes that RallySolo will be equally effective at increasing entry fields."
I hope I will see more Evos now in tarmac rally's! This is basically a street time attack. So it is safer to keep the car together then a door to door racing on track
Ps: care ful if you try it you will never want to do anything else... I know from fact LOL
Anyway from 2012 there is a new CATEGORY can run rally events.
Check this out !
"
PR: NASA Rally Sport Expands To Include RallySolo - Rally Without Codrivers
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Orlando, Florida, Performance Racing Industry Trade Show (December 2, 2011)
NASA Rally Sport continues its role as the innovation leader and grassroots champion with its introduction of the new RallySolo class for 2012. This program allows drivers to attack the rally stages without the traditionally required navigator. This move, which opens up the events to an entirely new group of racers, is great news for the existing events.
'Organizing rallies is all about getting people to come out and participate.' says Anders Green of NASA Rally Sport. 'The more folks you can get out on the stages, the more excitement and fun there is for everyone, and the more affordable the events can be for all the racers. We want to be inclusive and get as many racers as possible out on the stages. The more the merrier! RallySolo adds to the existing racing, we have no plans to displace the traditional format of a two person team.'
Motorsport is dominated by single-seat cars, with rally being a notable standout by requiring a team of driver and navigator. There is nothing unusual about racing solo on gravel or dirt, however. Desert races like the Baja 1000 have a long history of allowing single seat classes. Hillclimbs around the country also allow the same arrangement. The challenge and excitement of a single driver, pushing themselves in an endurance test against the clock, will appeal to many of the rugged individualists that make up the racing community.
The cost savings of building a rally car without the provisions for a navigator is at least one to two thousand dollars in addition to another thousand dollars or more in safety equipment for the second occupant. The challenge of besting the stages without a navigator will appeal to a new, different group of racers. The existing rally community has a deep passion for the current format of driver and navigator, and while the RallySolo program will seem gimmicky to them, it was not designed for existing competitors.
'A great driver and navigator team will always be faster than a solo driver, there's no question. A couple of our regulars may try RallySolo, but I don't expect any significant count of existing rally drivers will switch to it long term.' say Green. 'We're not trying to take the existing group of rally racers and cut the pie into different shaped slices. This is really about expanding the sport and getting new blood involved. Growing the sport is critical, and that means having open minds and trying out new ideas. If solo drivers can navigate through 1000 miles of open Mexican desert, I'm fully confident they can successfully navigate the closed roads of a rally.'
The program will appeal most to new drivers just getting started in the sport. The reduced complexity in the car build and simpler team requirements mean a lower initial barrier to getting started. In the same way that all racers continually upgrade their race cars, it is believed that RallySolo drivers will race solo for a couple years, and then 'upgrade' to racing with a codriver to further increase their speed.
'Many of us have forgotten how tough it was when we got started in rally.' continued Green. 'Now, to get started as a rally driver, you need to convince your best friend that they should shell out $1400 dollars for safety gear and a rally license just to sit next to you. When you're new and just getting into the sport, that is a serious barrier to entry. In the last decade, participation in rally in the US has been cut in half. For those that love rally, it would be irresponsible not to create ways to increase entries when the sport has faced such continual declines in recent years.'
One of the fundamental aspects of traditional race tracks that make them successful is that they are inherently able to support multiple uses. There might be stock cars one weekend, motorcycles the next, open wheel racing the next, followed by non-timed driving schools. This flexibility of use is what allows these facilities to operate in the black. Until recently, rally events have been extremely limited in the types of vehicles that could run, limited to just one type: two person rally cars. NASA Rally Sport increased the options by introducing RallyMoto to allow motorcycles on rally stages, and continues to expand the opportunities of rallies to attract new racers with the RallySolo program. Producing a rally event is very resource intensive and the temporary 'track' that is created should be fully utilized by a large field of racers.
The first rally offering the RallySolo program is the Sandblast Rally based in Cheraw, South Carolina. On February 4th, 2012, Sandblast Rally will debut this next evolution of rally racing. Five years ago at the very same event, NASA Rally Sport introduced the RallyMoto program, which allowed motorcycle riders to compete on rally stages. RallyMoto remains the most successful program in modern US rallying at bringing new racers to the rally stages, and NASA Rally Sport hopes that RallySolo will be equally effective at increasing entry fields."
I hope I will see more Evos now in tarmac rally's! This is basically a street time attack. So it is safer to keep the car together then a door to door racing on track
Ps: care ful if you try it you will never want to do anything else... I know from fact LOL
In my quest to have as much fun in my car as possible, I've really been thinking about this lately. I want to discuss this more later.
Thanks for posting Rob. I've been wanting to post about this but, since there is some opposition to this I figured I'd hold off.
Thanks for posting Rob. I've been wanting to post about this but, since there is some opposition to this I figured I'd hold off.
Last edited by jerdeitzel; Dec 2, 2011 at 05:25 AM.
Besides being an event with a single person in the car; they really don't explain anything else. Are they cording off streets or what?
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,535
Likes: 60
From: Park Ridge N.J.
They might yellow tape it out , as they should from the beginning.... In eu that is a basic rule.
Anyway it should be more logical and easier to follow the roads then an autoX in the parking lot.
Also my understanding is , not all stages will be open for none rally cars. But that can change very fast.
In my country this is not uncommon to have other racers on the road , when rally going on.
But we used to have drifters to going through when the rally cars done or not on the stage yet
I hope this idea will work out for the States as It did for eu. I really can't understand if anyone will or have any opposition for this.
I hope I see you Jeremy at april in the RNY arond and at Monticello rally
Anyway it should be more logical and easier to follow the roads then an autoX in the parking lot.
Also my understanding is , not all stages will be open for none rally cars. But that can change very fast.
In my country this is not uncommon to have other racers on the road , when rally going on.
But we used to have drifters to going through when the rally cars done or not on the stage yet
I hope this idea will work out for the States as It did for eu. I really can't understand if anyone will or have any opposition for this.
I hope I see you Jeremy at april in the RNY arond and at Monticello rally
A few quick points. Rally New York is not a NASA event so this release dose not effect them. With that being said, they are trying to do something along the same lines but i think they might have a better idea going.
FWIW, i believe i'm a poster child for who they are trying to attract. I am a hillclimber/TT'er that has a rally prepared cage in my car. My car is still street legal but, it only has one seat.
So, here are my concerns and thought on this whole thing. I like the idea of trying out a rally by myself. But, this is where i have to question things. From the NASA rules, it looks as if the only real difference is not having a co-driver. That means all the cage rules, extra stuff like triangles, tow ropes, etc are all required. Plus, the restrictor rule is in place for turbo cars also. So, that does save me a bunch of money but, its still not exactly what i'd hope for to make it easy to try. And after reading the rule book. How much of a PIA would it be to be alone on a rally? I'm not worried about the racing parts. Its the being at the next check point without getting lost and on time that i'm worried about.
Now Rally New York is also talking about trying to attract hillclimbers and road racers. From what i understand they are trying to figure out how we can get cars that passed tech at places like Mt washington to be able to run. This means some different cage rules that would allow more RR cars to enter. (this is why i always tell people to build a rally cage that is RR legal and not a RR cage that is not rally legal). Being able to drive solo is proposed also. (like NASA SOLO). Plus the restrictor requirement is being discussed... (which is actually a pretty big deal breaker for some).
From what i have heard they are thinking of letting "hillclimb" cars enter 1 day with a super special stage on Montecello race track and then the option of entering 2 road stages. I don't think anything is fully ironed out yet but to me its kinda exciting to see tarmac rally's reach out to us fellow racers, so they can give us a hit of the pipe.
FWIW, i believe i'm a poster child for who they are trying to attract. I am a hillclimber/TT'er that has a rally prepared cage in my car. My car is still street legal but, it only has one seat.
So, here are my concerns and thought on this whole thing. I like the idea of trying out a rally by myself. But, this is where i have to question things. From the NASA rules, it looks as if the only real difference is not having a co-driver. That means all the cage rules, extra stuff like triangles, tow ropes, etc are all required. Plus, the restrictor rule is in place for turbo cars also. So, that does save me a bunch of money but, its still not exactly what i'd hope for to make it easy to try. And after reading the rule book. How much of a PIA would it be to be alone on a rally? I'm not worried about the racing parts. Its the being at the next check point without getting lost and on time that i'm worried about.
Now Rally New York is also talking about trying to attract hillclimbers and road racers. From what i understand they are trying to figure out how we can get cars that passed tech at places like Mt washington to be able to run. This means some different cage rules that would allow more RR cars to enter. (this is why i always tell people to build a rally cage that is RR legal and not a RR cage that is not rally legal). Being able to drive solo is proposed also. (like NASA SOLO). Plus the restrictor requirement is being discussed... (which is actually a pretty big deal breaker for some).
From what i have heard they are thinking of letting "hillclimb" cars enter 1 day with a super special stage on Montecello race track and then the option of entering 2 road stages. I don't think anything is fully ironed out yet but to me its kinda exciting to see tarmac rally's reach out to us fellow racers, so they can give us a hit of the pipe.
Last edited by jerdeitzel; Dec 2, 2011 at 10:45 AM.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,535
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From: Park Ridge N.J.
I didn't read you post trhough jeremy I am working now. But rally new your will let from 2012 hill climb and other cars run as a rally solo kinda thing . Maybe under different name but basically a same thing. And they will have 2 great tarmac events...
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Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,535
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From: Park Ridge N.J.
Also I do not think they will requier the rally restrictor since then many guys can't rune it. Re tune etc,,, besides they are not running as a rally cars anyway
I like the idea of attracting more potential competitors...god knows rallies need more entries in the US. However, IMO rally is a team sport and that's what separates it from many other forms of motorsports.
Dave
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,535
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From: Park Ridge N.J.
Dave, on tarmac rally car awd has not much advantage. Vs the good fwd car. Remember in France (if I am right) the Citroen fwd kit cars were faster the a WRC cars... So the fwd car basically has no hp restriction vs the awd car from the begin with
Anyway, without co driver , most likely they will be not faster anyway, so the hp is really will be not a problem. Good hill-climbers will have no issue on stage to find they way. Only difference is they will not strictly going up hill.
Between stages , they would have a problem, but I think the group transit with a marshal car guidance will solve that.
There is 0 issue I can see in this idea. Usually no one person car, threatens rally cars on stage regardless on hp/weight.
Only things I think they should do, not let anyone run with a awd turbo and limit a hp/ weight ratio for rookies.
The experienced hill climbers - road racers should have no problem to drive through on the stages.
Its been tried in Eu and works just fine. I don't know what is a big fuss about it... Specially since the bikes running rally stages a long time now, and they also do not have a co-driver...
Its like discredit a car drivers are reckless and dummies... Bikes are pretty dangerous also ...
Press on Rob
ps edit because i tried to make it more understandable.
Anyway, without co driver , most likely they will be not faster anyway, so the hp is really will be not a problem. Good hill-climbers will have no issue on stage to find they way. Only difference is they will not strictly going up hill.
Between stages , they would have a problem, but I think the group transit with a marshal car guidance will solve that.
There is 0 issue I can see in this idea. Usually no one person car, threatens rally cars on stage regardless on hp/weight.
Only things I think they should do, not let anyone run with a awd turbo and limit a hp/ weight ratio for rookies.
The experienced hill climbers - road racers should have no problem to drive through on the stages.
Its been tried in Eu and works just fine. I don't know what is a big fuss about it... Specially since the bikes running rally stages a long time now, and they also do not have a co-driver...
Its like discredit a car drivers are reckless and dummies... Bikes are pretty dangerous also ...
Press on Rob
ps edit because i tried to make it more understandable.
Last edited by Robevo RS; Dec 2, 2011 at 03:14 PM.
Rob - the only true rally I've ever done was Rally Idaho the first year, which was a tarmac event. 2wd turbo cars romped on everyone else because they didn't have to run restrictors. They were hitting 135mph on some of the straights where my restricted GTX was topping out at 110mph.
Restrictors in AWD rally cars are a fact of life when you want to stage rally in the US (and the rest of the world?). Just because people will be allowed to rally without a co-driver isn't likely to change that fact.
FWIW, I think running solo is a perfect idea for rally sprints to get a road racer interested, but I do rather like the team aspect of rallying.
Dave
Restrictors in AWD rally cars are a fact of life when you want to stage rally in the US (and the rest of the world?). Just because people will be allowed to rally without a co-driver isn't likely to change that fact.
FWIW, I think running solo is a perfect idea for rally sprints to get a road racer interested, but I do rather like the team aspect of rallying.
Dave
From a sanctioning and insurance point. I'd lay a bet that they could allow cars to run without restrictors. Pikes peak does not require them. Neither do any of the NE or SCCA hillclimbs. In fac,t the SCCA is pretty well known for their top notch insurance and they let 1000hp cars hillclimb with only a roll bar. 
Now does that mean that the actual Rally classes would follow suit. I doubt it since the requirement for them was for a good reason.
But, maybe they should just rename whatever they are trying to do and call it tarmac attack or something to differentiate it from Rally. The point is to get more cars on the road at these events. I don't think because you allow a 500hp EVO to run that it means there are going to be tons of accidents. But anyways, i don't see the restrictor thing even being considered for NASA at the moment. I do kno that Rally NY is talking about this tho.
FWIW, that Robin hood rally is in its second season. I was contacted this year about doing it. I already knew about it, so i respectfully passed. lol
Now does that mean that the actual Rally classes would follow suit. I doubt it since the requirement for them was for a good reason.
But, maybe they should just rename whatever they are trying to do and call it tarmac attack or something to differentiate it from Rally. The point is to get more cars on the road at these events. I don't think because you allow a 500hp EVO to run that it means there are going to be tons of accidents. But anyways, i don't see the restrictor thing even being considered for NASA at the moment. I do kno that Rally NY is talking about this tho. FWIW, that Robin hood rally is in its second season. I was contacted this year about doing it. I already knew about it, so i respectfully passed. lol
Last edited by jerdeitzel; Dec 2, 2011 at 03:00 PM.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,535
Likes: 60
From: Park Ridge N.J.
Rob - the only true rally I've ever done was Rally Idaho the first year, which was a tarmac event. 2wd turbo cars romped on everyone else because they didn't have to run restrictors. They were hitting 135mph on some of the straights where my restricted GTX was topping out at 110mph.
Restrictors in AWD rally cars are a fact of life when you want to stage rally in the US (and the rest of the world?). Just because people will be allowed to rally without a co-driver isn't likely to change that fact.
FWIW, I think running solo is a perfect idea for rally sprints to get a road racer interested, but I do rather like the team aspect of rallying.
Dave
Restrictors in AWD rally cars are a fact of life when you want to stage rally in the US (and the rest of the world?). Just because people will be allowed to rally without a co-driver isn't likely to change that fact.
FWIW, I think running solo is a perfect idea for rally sprints to get a road racer interested, but I do rather like the team aspect of rallying.
Dave
I like more that idea more people can try it, so they actually know what a head of them.
But a little evil
inside me like it too, since here is where the BS stops. If you think you are that good, and rally guys they are what they are, then here is the opportunity to "put your money where your mouth is ", not just talk . AAANd i am sure you know what i am talking about. 
Hillclimb is not rally. In hillclimbs the drivers get to preview the roads and get multiple shots to go fast. In rally with cumulative scoring, you only get one shot at each stage time so the pressure is there to knock it out of the park.
Our our local all dirt hillclimb series doesn't require them either. The reason that is allowed in the CHCA series is that due to the elevation and steep grades, the speeds reached in unrestricted rally cars is still lower than speeds seen at rally events.
I thought MWHC required restrictors? I looked at running the event, but the restrictor rule and the date conflict with PP kept me here in Colorado.
NASA and SCCA seem to be more flexible, possibly stemming from their expertise in "closed circuit racing." I don't see Rally America lifting the restrictor ban any time soon. It really comes down to what the insurance companies will allow, and getting them to sign off on something that flies in the face of worldwide precedence doesn't seem likely.
Dave
Our our local all dirt hillclimb series doesn't require them either. The reason that is allowed in the CHCA series is that due to the elevation and steep grades, the speeds reached in unrestricted rally cars is still lower than speeds seen at rally events.
I thought MWHC required restrictors? I looked at running the event, but the restrictor rule and the date conflict with PP kept me here in Colorado.
NASA and SCCA seem to be more flexible, possibly stemming from their expertise in "closed circuit racing." I don't see Rally America lifting the restrictor ban any time soon. It really comes down to what the insurance companies will allow, and getting them to sign off on something that flies in the face of worldwide precedence doesn't seem likely.
Dave
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,535
Likes: 60
From: Park Ridge N.J.
From a sanctioning and insurance point. I'd lay a bet that they could allow cars to run without restrictors. Pikes peak does not require them. Neither do any of the NE or SCCA hillclimbs. In fac,t the SCCA is pretty well known for their top notch insurance and they let 1000hp cars hillclimb with only a roll bar.
Now does that mean that the actual Rally classes would follow suit. I doubt it since the requirement for them was for a good reason. But, maybe they should just rename whatever they are trying to do and call it tarmac attack or something to differentiate it from Rally. The point is to get more cars on the road at these events. I don't think because you allow a 500hp EVO to run that it means there are going to be tons of accidents. But anyways, i don't see the restrictor thing even being considered for NASA at the moment. I do kno that Rally NY is talking about this tho.
FWIW, that Robin hood rally is in its second season. I was contacted this year about doing it. I already knew about it, so i respectfully passed. lol
Now does that mean that the actual Rally classes would follow suit. I doubt it since the requirement for them was for a good reason.
But, maybe they should just rename whatever they are trying to do and call it tarmac attack or something to differentiate it from Rally. The point is to get more cars on the road at these events. I don't think because you allow a 500hp EVO to run that it means there are going to be tons of accidents. But anyways, i don't see the restrictor thing even being considered for NASA at the moment. I do kno that Rally NY is talking about this tho. FWIW, that Robin hood rally is in its second season. I was contacted this year about doing it. I already knew about it, so i respectfully passed. lol
robin hood rally is a joke, and should not been called rally.
Other hand i suggested to Walter , to have a kind of EU "GT class" in the rally. Which means no hp restrictions with a single person car. Of course only experienced with a proven history drivers would be allowed to run it. And here doesn't count your HPDE or local even national autox experience.
I am talking about high speed documented race< like Circuit or hillclimb etc.
Even if they will do run faster then ANY rally car is still doesn't matter since they run they "own "event , just like the bikes. + big hp cars usually put down better show for a spectators since they will spin tires easy.
This way or other the rally would be much more entertaining for the by standers and so on.