cam gears for HKS 264/264 cams??
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cam gears for HKS 264/264 cams??
Im thinkin of getting a set of cam gears and i have hks 264 cams in my car
but some say that with 264/264 cam shafts,
you really wont gain much unless its 264/272 272s or 280s
what do you guys think??
but some say that with 264/264 cam shafts,
you really wont gain much unless its 264/272 272s or 280s
what do you guys think??
Cam gears will most likely pick up the MOST power on 264s, because the duration is the shortest. Cam gears shift the open portions to where they need to be. With the 280s, the duration is so long that, the precision of where the duration is placed is not as crucial.
Dustin and I definitely have a difference of opinion here. The problem with retarding the timing with a short duration cam such as an HKS 264 is that in retarding the cams to delay the closing of the intake valve and get more top end, the short duration causes a substantial compromise to be made at the bottom. The result is a bit more top end, but a substantial compromise in low end power and spool characteristics. In short, there just isn't enough 'meat' to play with, so to gain a little of something, you must give up an equal amount of something else.
With longer duration cams, it's possible to gain a substantial amount of something, while giving up virtually nothing.
With longer duration cams, it's possible to gain a substantial amount of something, while giving up virtually nothing.
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In theory yes...in reality no. When using cam gears with small duration cams, the loss of low end is extremely minimal compared to what you pick up on the top end. The reason being is that the loss of VE on the bottom isn't as important to power output, because of the fact that the car is fairly happy in that area of the RPM band anyways. On the top end, VE is extremely important. This is the reason that we use cam gears on the stock cams. A calculation of area under the curve shows that the cam gears will win the shoot out every time. If it didn't, we wouldn't use them.
With that said, I do understand where you are coming from. But the question was are cam gears worth it on 264 cams, NOT what cams offer the most power through the band. And even in that argument, I would say that on pump gas maps, 264s and 280s will be in the same realm of output, anyways. Of course, your car is another animal than the average stage 1+.
With that said, I do understand where you are coming from. But the question was are cam gears worth it on 264 cams, NOT what cams offer the most power through the band. And even in that argument, I would say that on pump gas maps, 264s and 280s will be in the same realm of output, anyways. Of course, your car is another animal than the average stage 1+.
Originally Posted by Ted B
Dustin and I definitely have a difference of opinion here. The problem with retarding the timing with a short duration cam such as an HKS 264 is that in retarding the cams to delay the closing of the intake valve and get more top end, the short duration causes a substantial compromise to be made at the bottom. The result is a bit more top end, but a substantial compromise in low end power and spool characteristics. In short, there just isn't enough 'meat' to play with, so to gain a little of something, you must give up an equal amount of something else.
With longer duration cams, it's possible to gain a substantial amount of something, while giving up virtually nothing.
With longer duration cams, it's possible to gain a substantial amount of something, while giving up virtually nothing.
Originally Posted by Dustin@Vishnu
In theory yes...in reality no. When using cam gears with small duration cams, the loss of low end is extremely minimal compared to what you pick up on the top end. The reason being is that the loss of VE on the bottom isn't as important to power output. . .
I have experimented in a lot of cam timing settings on my 272's, I can tell you that the off bost charecteristics of the motor at -3/-2 versus 0/-2 is tremendous. The increased lag induced by retarding the intake cam is unbearable. It's one setting I'd never chose to use for daily driving...
Edit: this is the best I could find on Vishnu's site.... of course it doesn't say what the gear settings are, but knowing Vishnu, it's probably -2/-2 or -3/-3
Edit: this is the best I could find on Vishnu's site.... of course it doesn't say what the gear settings are, but knowing Vishnu, it's probably -2/-2 or -3/-3
Last edited by SuperHatch; Feb 23, 2006 at 11:05 AM.
