I'm not referring to Hackish. It's much talk about nothing from others who have not done the research regarding his work. The results and performance gains from the Hackish reflash have been well documented.

 

Fair point I am assuming something went wrong or there is a difference in the ecu in PR. I am sure he will get to the bottom of it.

 

The PR ECU is the same as the USDM ECU, OBD II California ARB. I've checked this through 5 different ECUs here, and it gives the same info, no matter what year...

 

I would like to compare with anyone who has dyno'ed their reflash to check on differences, anyone who has bought the reflash... If the results are good, then I'm ready to eat my words, but if they're the same as what I already have seen, then there is no other choice for me than to just go public and reveal the numbers I have.

 

From what I hear you've sold your car and that's why you want your money back. Ricardo is supposed to be buying one of our reflashers for doing them so if he moves on it then it should be pretty easy to get your ECU looked at.

So you tested the reflash and is your rev limiter in fact higher? yes. The AFR went from 11.2:1 to 13:1 so that's working as it should. The only question is timing and it's hard to know with PR's fuel. The fact the dyno sheet shows the car is running leaner now but not making any more power points directly at the testing procedure.

If you just plug the ECU in and run it the timing will start out less aggressive than a stock ECU that's been run for a while. Not a surprise that horsepower results were the same. If it was making 0 gains then why would the others who bought the reflash be reporting that their car is much quicker now?

If you send it back of course I can verify it but from what you said you're unwilling to do anything but get your money back and there is no 6 month guarantee or sell your car and don't want it anymore guarantee either. Sorry.

-Michael

 

OK...

First of all, it's not about me having sold the car. It's about trying to sell the reflashed ECU to someone who has heard about it, and not being able because nobody has done some proper dyno testing.

Second... Ricardo has told me that, after seeing the results, he's not going for it, but maybe that's something that should be between you and him and not brought up on this conversation.

Third... Like I've said too many times... If you think it's your mistake, then you should be the one to pay for it, not me. I'm not unwilling, I just think that for $450 you should be able to respond and stand by your product.


If it were for fuel type, then I believe you'd have to create a different tune for every single state or country...

I tried a different approach on these last couple of weeks...

As per Hackish's claims of me not giving a good learning period, I decided to loan the reflashed ECU to a friend. He ran on it for 2 weeks straight, doing some normal daily driving, and the ocassional 2nd gear pull while "road testing" with some friends. He gave me the same reaction everyone else gives: "Oh, this feels great", "Feels quicker", and whatever. This evaluations were only by driving it on the street alone. He then proceeded to test it with some friends, and that's when it got ugly...

He had told me that he would stay on the side of any of his friends all through 4th gear with his RA on the stock ECU. After a couple of days with Hackish's reflashed ECU, he went out with his friends and did some more testing. He then told me that the car felt faster while taking off, but his friends would catch up faster, and even pass him with at least a 1 car lead. Now, this is the main reason why I hate "Butt Dynos". When you change something in car, you'll always "feel" it quicker, when it actually isn't.

Because of this, I decided it was time to do some real testing by taking it to the dyno. Before we even installed the reflash, we did some dyno on his car as it was with the stock ECU. Here are the results:


His mods are as follows:
- Injen CAI
- Stock header, no cat, factory muffler on factory piping
- UDP

Now, this is the car I used to have, tested on that exact same dyno. These were done by september of last year:


My mods:
- Injen CAI
- UDP
- OBX Header, factory piping, factory muffler
- Blox Solid Front Motor Mount
- RIPP's BRAT Box (not Black Box, that's their piggy... do a search if you don't know what it is)

This is my friend's RA on the reflash:


This makes me wonder... Hackish said on a previous post that he had done 5 runs to get the hp he claimed, but every run we did just gave less hp than the previous one.

This following graph is of both ECUs overlapped to compare differences:


Just by looking at the engine speed, you can tell which is which, but just in case: Red one is the reflash (7000rpm limit), and the blue one is the stock ECU (6700rpm limit)

Now, this last graph is the most important. Remember... We're not looking for Maximum HP Values. All you need to see is the difference in gain (or loss, if you may) between the stock ECU and the Hackish Reflashed ECU.

As for the conditions of the dyno testing:
- Stock ECU was tested as it was.
- The reflashed ECU was installed after these tests.
- The reflashed ECU was ran for 2 weeks before the dyno tests.
- Both the reflash and the stock were tested at about 6pm (PR Time).
- On both tests, the evening was a bit humid because of rain during daytime.
- No modifications of any kind were done on the test RA before of after installing the reflashed ECU.
- All graphs shown on this post are from runs on the same dyno to avoid differences in calibration values.
- All runs were done using Shell V-Power 93 octane fuel.

People... Learn from the $450 (+$200 for a spare ECU) I've spent, and surely won't be getting back...

If after all of this, anyone is interested in having my reflashed ECU, I'll be probably listing it at eBay by this weekend, starting a bit low. As of now, all I have is a paper weight. My friend was going to buy it from me, but after those numbers...

Just imagine what he said...

 

Omg!!! That's alot to take in man, I mean just .... I don't know what to say I guess we can see what is said in response

 

And this was the second attempt. My first attempt gave better results (not good though), but I was told that my "testing" wasn't done properly. This is why I wrote such an informative post.

I thought of creating a new thread, but I knew this one would be an easier find...

 

Something must ahve gone wrong or there is a difference in the ecu I have been there to see on a mustang dyno about 10hp gain on average.

I know my car is turbo and its not the same but the flash works look at my car...my only guess is something went worg and needs to be fixed.

 

Cyanide, is it possible the BRAT Box may have been affecting the reflash. I don't know as I've never used it, but I read up on it and it seems to send send it's own A/F type signal to the ECU. I will still dyno very and post my results though.

 

We're talking about the NA reflash, not the turbo reflash. The turbo reflash has been properly documented, and the local dyno owners from my location have seen this and shown it to me.

The dyno owner from my first attempt told me it worked and hp could be gained. The second dyno I went to saw the results on the turbo reflash and told me they were good, but he installed an AEM FIC on the same turbo RA he was testing and told me that he got the exact same results. How did he do it? I didn't ask, so I don't know. He just told me he got it working and the car is running on it as we speak.

I have no doubt that the turbo reflash works, but this is not the case here.

Read the post again... Maybe reading it completely might shed a bit more light into the explanation...

The test RA used for running dyno on the reflash DOES NOT HAVE a BRAT Box. The BRAT was installed in my previous RA, which is the one I sold while waiting for my spare ECU to arrive in Canada to be reflashed. My personal RA never even saw the Hackish reflash.

All the BRAT does is modify the MAP sensor signal. You bypass the MAP to the BRAT and then send the BRAT signal to the ECU. The BRAT will now read MAP sensor voltage. Once that voltage reaches 4.1 volts, the BRAT stops that signal from getting through to the ECU and then leaves the output set at 4.1 volts. The ECU only sees 4.1 volts and thinks that everything is fine so it doesn't change fuel trims based on the MAP sensor voltage. Changes are small, but they are there.

This doesn't give hp... Many people claim it does, but I've done some proper testing on it and it doesn't. Most people also forget that the BRAT needs a constant 5 volt signal. If you don't provide this signal to the BRAT, all you're doing is intercepting the MAP signal with a resistor.

What I did notice while on the BRAT was that I could keep doing runs on the dyno and, after 5-6 runs, the hp values would stay the same, no gain no loss. When trying it without the BRAT, I would loose 1-2 hp after each following run, until a maximum of 7 hp, not more.

In conclusion, the BRAT was not installed in the test RA.

I think I've provided a simple but complete explanation on how the tests were performed.

 

I know you are talking NA reflash I was there to see my buddies car get the flash it gained 10whp so this is why I am saying something is not right. I know Hackish has been out of the shop off an on for a bit but I will be at the shop this weekend and I will talk to him.

 

I'm taking my car to the dyno shop either this weekend or next week. Any one willing to donate an Ecu to this cause? My car is an 04 5spd. Your ECU will be returned of course.

 

Has to be a 04-05 a 06 WILL NOT work.....

 

The reason why I'm posting this is because the only results I've seen on the reflash are from the developers themselves.

You can "tell' me you've seen 10 hp gains, and I should be able to believe you (not saying I don't), but that would be like buying a K&N Air filter because K&N says I'll get "+12 hp gains" just by installing their product. I need to see numbers for myself, by my own testing, because it will be the only way to see real results.

I tested the Injen CAI alone, and this is by far the best mod to start with. I was at 146 hp from factory and went to 154 with that alone. I then added the UDP... No change. Afterwards, the BRAT, and I've explained my results on my previous post. Last ones were the OBX header and the BLOX solid motor mount, and the results were 157. All of this testing was done on the same dyno. I don't care about max values. What really counts is the change on each mod.

If you go RRM's to website, you'll notice that some of their products (similar to what I have described above) have "Dyno proven" hp gains. So, if I were to rely on this alone, and not do testing of my own, I would have purchased every single available mod made for my car and go around saying that my car outputs 215 whp, and that would be totally wrong, and a ridiculous assumption.

Now, analyze this example:

Let's say you (the reader of this post) have an '05 RA. You've read all you could find about the reflash, so you decided to get a spare ECU (as I did) and purchase the service. You get the ECU, you install it, and you "feel" it quicker, much better, and so on.

(Remember, just an example. As of now, I'm trying to sell mine)
Now, you run your ECU, let's say for 2 months, but always on the road, and never even thought about going to the dyno because you "trust" the results you've seen posted, and this is the reason why you purchased the service in the first place. After these 2 months you find a deal on the car you want and decide to give your RA in trade-in. Obviously, the dealer won't add what you paid for the reflash in the trade-in value, so you decide to install your factory ECU back so that you can, at the most, recover some of your investment.

So, you go around offering it, you even try to auction it at eBay, but everyone that's interested asks you the same exact question: What's the hp gain? All you can do at this moment is point them to the results you found prior to purchasing the service. Now they ask: "Did you test it as well to verify this? The results are from the developer, and I would like to see results from the client, not the seller". All you can do now is find someone to put his car as a guinea pig and go to a dyno so that you can provide results of your own, and this takes you about 2 months after you've sold your car.

Guess what? No gains... Now, you go back to who sold you the service asking what happened. He says he might have done something wrong, but you have to pay to get it fixed. You ask for your money back, and he stops answering emails. You try to sell it everywhere else, and because of your results, and because you know any buyer will test it and get the same results, you know you won't be selling it any time soon...

What would you do? How would you "feel"? Not "quicker", and definately not "better".