I tried finding those settings for him in that other thread but I couldn't remember where exactly we were talking about it,lol.

 

I talked to Zeitronix about this since I have a friend who had the P0133 issue and they said the problem is usually caused by the distance between the WB sensor and the engine. If you use the rear O2 sensor bung for your WB, the ECU see's that the O2 sensor feedback is happening too long after it makes the fuel changes to try and keep it at the target AFR. He is going to have an O2 sensor bung welded to the downpipe just below the oilpan and we'll see if that gives it a faster response.

 

Thanks guys! After reading a bit on this, it seems it would be a lot easier and safer to use the simulated reading to lean it out during cruising instead of forcing open/closed loop. I will be using the rear O2 bung on my DC Sports (cat-less) dp, I hope that it works. Are we sure that the p0133 isn't caused by the warmup process? (ie clear the codes with scantech during operation after p0133 appears and continue to operate to see if it appears again?)

 

According to Zeitronix, no. Especially since the ECU is in open loop for at least the first 15-30 seconds by default anyhow. He also mentioned that it depends a lot on the exhaust system components. Some setups may just squeek by without a CEL. I guess we'll wait and see who used the rear location, then moved it up to around 18" past the turbo outlet. If they cured the P0133 issue, Zeitronix was dead right.

 

Got the narrowband simulator all hooked up with the settings provided by t-bubble and it we took a trip to Lakeland today. Only a 20 mile trip, and everything seemed to be working fine. Just visually watching the gauge during the trip, at a consistant cruising speed and rpm it would bounce anywhere from 15.3 to 16.5 so it is averaging around 15.9 which I am confortable with, but is 16.5 gonna be too lean? Also, I noticed, that the car felt like it was slightly surging, while crusing, it is very slight though, my wife said she didn't feel it, but she doesn't drive the car much. It was also really windy so it might have just been that. I am going to try advancing the timing a couple degrees in the cruising areas. I did some logging during cruising, some cruising to part throttle acceleration, and cruising to WOT, and it didn't knock once. I was suprised, usually it has a couple counts when going from cruising to WOT. Thanks for all the help. Does mitsulogger log the LC-1 yet? I also did not register p0133 at all, and the bung is located near the end of the pipe, which is about 6" away from the flange connecting it to the exhaust.

 

I think the surging is from the distance from the engine still. If you hook the stock O2 up again you'll notice that it only fluctuates from around 14.2-15.0 at its worst. I had the simulator hooked up on my 2G Talon with the WB 18" from the turbo outlet and when I was cruising it'd stay almost rock solid at 15.5AFR so I think the distance is definitely affecting the response time a little. My rear O2 bung is beyond the test pipe which is rather far away IMO.

Also, it will take more than 20 miles to trigger the P0133, usually takes around 40 miles or 1-2 hours of driving for some people.

 

You could try adjusting the response time in the LM Programmer to make up for that distance .. it'll average the readings over time so it might help. I didn't see much of a difference on mine, but you could give it a shot.

 

Mine was surging as well when I bypassed the stock O2 sensor and used the LM-1 O2 sensor to simulate the narrowband. The car hunts back and forth, it is very annoying. I hated it, so I disconnected the simulator and went back to stock narrowband.

My O2 sensor is 18" from the turbo as well and I still get the surging.

TB: How do you adjust the response tim with the LM-1 programmer?

 

It's in the advanced area ... click the button below the graph.

 

T-bubble, just out of curiousity, it looks like you have tried all the methods, which one are you sticking with to achieve economy? I am going to try adding timing, tightening up the range a little on the LM programmer, and fool with the response time. I am just afraid that it is going a little too lean.

 

I'm currently running off of the LC-1 at around 15.6:1 and I've added about 3* in the cruise area. I plan to mess with the VVT maps as well. I haven't seen any notable MPG gains though since my first tank with the LC-1 for closed loop also had about 10 WOT pulls and a full day of auto-x ... I got about 16.5 MPG on that tank. I'm half through my 2nd full tank with the LC-1 and all stop and go traffic ... I'll make some decisions based on those results.

 

I figured this one out. Mitsulogger logs the O2 sensor via the ECU, well, the LC1 is feeding the ECU. So I just used Excel with a formula to take what Mitsulogger picked up and calculated that out to AFR. I feel so proud of myself!

I did these three things, none of them helped too much. I advanced the timing 3 degrees in the cruising areas and it helped a little, the surging is hardly noticeable now, but still there. Does the surging mean I am running too lean? Do I need to move the sensor, advance the timing even more or richen it up? What do you guys think? I think I might need to get an EGT guage for fathers day!

 

Where is your sensor located? Mine is at the front end of the test pipe. I get audible feedback where the engine is searching for the AFR, but I don't get surging at cruise. I did when I first started testing, but not any more.

I slowed the response time yesterday and it helped a little ... 1/6" give me from 15.5 to 16.1 instead of the 15.2 to 16.2 I was getting.

Oh, I had also increased my injector scaling up by one increment to keep the fuel trims in check when I first set up the LC-1 for closed loop.

 

I have the DC Sports downpipe which eliminates the factory downpipe and cat in one peice. The bung is about 6" from the catback flange.

 

i have mine where the hangers for the downpipe are located, this is the recommened 36" from the turbo outlet and i have no surging issues, i also adjusted injector scaling though..., i wish i had VVT, im sure there could be gains had there