Flashers/Tuners/Gurus - Pump gas boost opinions
Then what's to say about the fact that a lower octane fuel (93) will naturally preignite (detonate) during the piston compression under a higher oxygen unit per volume of air (23 psi)?
Or what you mean by conservative tune (via EMS) is that there is some way around this fact
Or what you mean by conservative tune (via EMS) is that there is some way around this fact
Originally Posted by Warrtalon
Not sure how it's getting out of hand. I just stated the truth. People come from there and boast about their numbers all the time. You have the numbers in your sig, so people think they can achieve the same thing on a real Mustang Dyno, then get really disappointed when they can't. They complain to that tuner or dyno owner who then ends up recalibrating his dyno to make customers happy and the trend continues. It's a vicious cycle.
Anyway, I don't think I caused damage from "all the knock I was getting," because I saw a little and turned the boost down. I have been driving daily like this for quite a while without knock and with the ability to run mid/low 12s on pump without cams. Sounds pretty decent to me. I have yet to see these 22-25psi tunes perform better, and that's what I keep asking to see. I know the S-AFC is the bottom of the barrel for tuning, so I'd expect to see people do much better with superior tuning devices...
Anyway, I don't think I caused damage from "all the knock I was getting," because I saw a little and turned the boost down. I have been driving daily like this for quite a while without knock and with the ability to run mid/low 12s on pump without cams. Sounds pretty decent to me. I have yet to see these 22-25psi tunes perform better, and that's what I keep asking to see. I know the S-AFC is the bottom of the barrel for tuning, so I'd expect to see people do much better with superior tuning devices...
If you want a good and proper tune I suggest switching to the MAFTpro piggyback. Once calibrated you will never get inconsistent MAF numbers. Hell my car's lower intercooler pipe blew off and it still kept on running fine. Of course I had no boost but since the volume of air is measure at the intake manifold it was unaffected.
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (6)
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 20,790
Likes: 2
From: Long Island, NY
Originally Posted by joeymia
Yes you already stated your opinion on the CFT dyno. If someone wants to know your opinion they can search right?
If you want a good and proper tune I suggest switching to the MAFTpro piggyback. Once calibrated you will never get inconsistent MAF numbers. Hell my car's lower intercooler pipe blew off and it still kept on running fine. Of course I had no boost but since the volume of air is measure at the intake manifold it was unaffected.
If you want a good and proper tune I suggest switching to the MAFTpro piggyback. Once calibrated you will never get inconsistent MAF numbers. Hell my car's lower intercooler pipe blew off and it still kept on running fine. Of course I had no boost but since the volume of air is measure at the intake manifold it was unaffected.
THe MAFT sounds great, but I don't think I'll be paying all that money just to change tunes on a car that already runs very well unless my MAF gets damaged like yours did.
Originally Posted by Warrtalon
I know the S-AFC is the bottom of the barrel for tuning, so I'd expect to see people do much better with superior tuning devices...
Originally Posted by Warrtalon
IT's not an opinion. It's a proven fact. As I said, go ask Scott at TTP (he knows now) or venture over to the Boost Creeps forum.
THe MAFT sounds great, but I don't think I'll be paying all that money just to change tunes on a car that already runs very well unless my MAF gets damaged like yours did.
THe MAFT sounds great, but I don't think I'll be paying all that money just to change tunes on a car that already runs very well unless my MAF gets damaged like yours did.
knock can be from a host of reasons, more actually a combination of many reasons. Noone has mentioned cylinder pressure yet. It's not just spark timing, but cam timing also. Cylinder pressures and knock can be greatly influenced by cam timing. Just a thought.
boost does not operate in a standalone world - fuel trims, timing all play a significant role as well. Some choose to make the power via boost, some via timing. Some prefer to hit 21 psi and hold it, others prefer to spike higher and taper downward, There is no right answer there is no wrong answer, there are just different answers. Every car also reacts differently to changes in timing. The only way to know for sure is to log, log, log, rinse, repeat. Given the nature of the turbo the car comes with, on pump gas, I'd rather make the power and torque from a sensible timing scale and a lower boost than upping the boost more...YMMV
Last edited by Z1 Performance; Nov 2, 2005 at 07:48 PM.
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (6)
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 20,790
Likes: 2
From: Long Island, NY
Originally Posted by 992gnt
That's the answer right there. Without the ability to compensate for the increased timing the SAFC creates, you can't run more boost without knock. All the responses from "tuners" mention custom flashes, ecutek, xede, etc. which of course can manipulate the timing. I have learned quite a bit from this thread and will be heading out shortly to test some new theories based on info from this thread. At any rate, I really think you already know the answer to your question.
Well I just did some tweaking and did 3 3rd gear pulls. Wtalon, you know the trouble I've been having with timing, and all 3 pulls were in the 24-25psi range (haven't checked the logger yet for an accurate psi) and all 3 had timing at or above 20* at redline. I haven't seen timing numbers like that for a long time. More work is needed to see if I'm really on the right track now, but at least it looks encouraging. Time will tell as to the power increase if any.
Originally Posted by Warrtalon
Not really. I already knew the limitations of the S-AFC. I still hadn't heard of people on flashes running around with 23-24psi like it's nothing. I don't know anyone locally who does it, and some of those who used to do it, found out it was hurting them when they got on the dyno. This is the reason for my skepticism. I still haven't seen any track results other than the guy with AEM EMS, cams, FMIC, injectors (on 94 w/high boost) who is no faster than I am at the track.
Maybe they're just not as good as you
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (6)
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 20,790
Likes: 2
From: Long Island, NY
Originally Posted by 992gnt
Well I just did some tweaking and did 3 3rd gear pulls. Wtalon, you know the trouble I've been having with timing, and all 3 pulls were in the 24-25psi range (haven't checked the logger yet for an accurate psi) and all 3 had timing at or above 20* at redline. I haven't seen timing numbers like that for a long time. More work is needed to see if I'm really on the right track now, but at least it looks encouraging. Time will tell as to the power increase if any.
I'm interested in seeing your results of this tune at the track compared to previously...
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (6)
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 20,790
Likes: 2
From: Long Island, NY
Originally Posted by meanmud
Maybe they're just not as good as you
My good friend locally with an MR has all the same mods but also has cams, cam gears, and an LICP. His inexperience with drag racing/launching has gotten him no better than a 12.6 (93oct), which I have done on pump gas with just a cat-back/mbc/SAFC. Be that as it may, he also has run a best mph of 113.9 (still 93oct), so it doesn't matter that I am a better drag racer. His car is making a helluva lot more power than mine on pump gas. His car is also making more power than the Precision-tuned Evo with AEM EMS, cams, injectors, and FMIC...and this is with bad driving (12.6 @ 113.9). So, it doesn't matter if I'm better at driving; it matters how much power they are putting to the ground. Also, this 113.9 was done at 20-21psi with an S-AFC on top of a flash, not 23-24psi with an EcuTek or AEM EMS. This is the type of empirical evidence I'm looking for...
This thread has become completely useless now.
You have done nothing but compare yourself to every other person on this board. Sorry man, but you need to stop while you are ahead.
No more from us in this thread, have fun.
You have done nothing but compare yourself to every other person on this board. Sorry man, but you need to stop while you are ahead.
No more from us in this thread, have fun.