Well I think its a amount of abuse with high hp. When Paul was at the 700whp and 9.7@145 with full NHRA safty equpment, heater, Radio and about the only weight out was the seats, AC, PS. He was on E85 and in 1 month he put 2000mi on the car at the full 650-700whp ripping on it every chance he got and burned up the Tilton in that time. His bearings looked about the same as Daves and I was not happy. Then we of course then made our 42R jump and after our 1st event with steal rods I was not happy again with the bearings.

I feel if your car is 650-700+ hp all the time then alum rods are the way to go. If you are 500 or so on your street tune and only crank it up for the track a few times a year then Steal rods are ok.

I am going to try the Alum in my Daily driver to see how they hold up. Would not want to test a cust car who is drive alot because I really don't know how long they will last at full street use. I have been hearing quotes of 50k but I would like to fined out for my self.

Pauls cage is a full 1 3/4 120wall MS so its a good 200lbs I bet the cage weights more then all the weight he every pulled out when he was on his 67.

 

I'm going to have to say that an aluminum rod is by far the best choice for any car making anything over 800whp. I ran Crower rods for years with no problems with the bearings, that was until started making some serious power (above 800whp)

Above 800whp I was pulling the pan off every 3 events and checking the bearings on the crowers, and as suspected I was not impressed, the bearings would come out looking like ***, but at 650whp the bearings were great with the steal rods.

I made the switch to aluminum rods, I use the R&R aluminum rods and have never looked back. I tossed the rods in with a new set of pistons, rings ect. Never even pulled the motor out of the car, just took the head off and did a quick freshin up job on the bottom end with new rings, the R&R rods, and new pistons (time wasn't on our side since we had a race coming up in a hurry).

Ran a full season on the motor without pulling it apart one time. Running low 9's at 159mph all season long on a 3000lb car (estimated 1000whp) and here is how the bearings looked after the whole season using the R&R aluminum rods ruffly 65-70 low 9sec full blown passes at over 40lbs of boost and 100shot to boot and 10,500rpm shifts.









Needless to say I was very happy to see these results. I plan on running the same rods that came out of the motor for this upcoming 2008 season.

 

I have a set of these and I plan on running them in my car I currently drive every day. The car has 55k miles on it and I have put on 30k of that mostly hard driving for the last 2 years. 400-500 launches and close to 100 dyno runs.
The car is getting pretty much a full build: AEM, bottom end (head is done), HTA35r or 67. etc.
I will post progress of these rods as well.

 

OK, ifarted, I'll correct if you are wrong. I'd say you are wrong. My car ran for a long time with a blown head gasket. As a matter of fact I was reminded this morning that when we had it on the Dynojet it pushed some coolant, looking back on it, I'd say it popped then. In the post I made about the car I commented on the bearings being effected from the coolant. That engine was also in the car two full seasons....... Our black car had Crowers in it when it ran 8's the first time, it was perfect when it came apart.

 

I guess if not being spun is Perfect.

I would hope you would not run a car long enough with water and coolant mixing to cause that kinda Bearing damage you posted. On A 4g about the only time I see water mix with coolant is when a fiber gaskets blows, over heat the crap out of it,cracked block or just to something crazy stupid in the tune. On Pauls car we had 2 HG leaks at 700hp level and lifted the head at the 1000hp level and never mixed oil and coolant. maybe using the Steal O-ring in the block is more prone to Coolant mixing then the copper.

I don't think you are doing anything wrong thats what I would think the bearing to look like after the years and abuse you put on it. But for a man who acts like god and the motors are 10x better then every one elses I would not be bragging about those bearings.

The whole point to this post is how much better the alum rods are on bearings. I would like to see bearings that look like ours and Jakes from a steal rod at the 800+whp level. I am asuming thats why you have been using the Grodens in so many motor lately.

I have a BHJ O-ring tool and run a .040 copper ring at .006-.007 protrusion. In the block.

I think Pauls 1# sack rider is Dave Buschur

 

For someone who has built nothing but engines that have failed and had problems for Paul, I'd think you'd be a little more humble. Guess not, just shows your continued stupidity.

So, let's see, when you were still in diapers I was building 4g63 engines and now YOU are going to school me? No, not happening.

BTW, unless you are a thief, they aren't STEAL rods, they are STEEL rods.

Had I kept our bearings around for 2 years since we ran the 8.95 with the Crowers I'd be happy to show you how they looked. It's not that I am using Groden's in so many motors lately as you said. I've been using them for YEARS, you are the one just getting started.

Let's see, of the 50 engines I've built in the last 6 months I've used Groden's in 4 EVO engines and 2 DSM engines. I'd say that isn't a very high ratio. Given the cost of Crowers compared to Grodens, if I truly thought they were superior I'd use them in every engine I build.

The fact is I don't see any problems with a GOOD steel rod. I don't use any steel rod other than the Crower. Maybe you should have tried those rather than the cheapest junk you could get your hand on.

One more thing DB. Normally I wouldn't run the car long after a head gasket went. Unfortunately for me I didn't catch it. So it ended up on the Dynojet for a half dozen pulls, then ran the 9.6's at 151 mph on it, then went back on our dyno for exhaust testing, wheel testing. The very last pull is when it thought it blew, obviously not as anyone with any engine building experience will tell you that the bearings show signs of coolant contamination. Don't worry, sooner or later you'll learn some of this. Hell if you are lucky you might even figure out how to build an engine with STEEL rods in it that last.

I really do not like you at all, so we are clear.

 

Do you ever get tired of being exceedingly rude? Why anyone would do business with a vendor who is as openly conceded and rude as you, i have no idea

 

He speaks what on his mind and the truth, what more could you ask for?

DB for president 08

I was not going to post in here but cause Dave built my engine and its waiting, and now I have been thinking of aluminum rods. I have been watching this thread.

 

You really remind me of the high school bully who has to pick on everyone to make himself feel better about his insecurity.

Well I have never had a normal cust motor fail. I feel Pauls motors are no different than the last 2 motors you have toasted along with Als, USP cracked block or sheps last failure.

Really does not matter what Dave says since he is here to sell motors. We really cant believe anything you post due to this. Hell you may grab some bearing out of a stock motor and post them up tomorrow and say they are our of your drag car.

I am not here to sell anything. Paul has came to me and I am learning on his car and we have learned alot. I have never said my motors are better or have tried to push them.

 

Inneedof, I can answer your question. Because we want the best, simple and to the point. When your on top of the heap, the ones down below are always trying to knock the king from the mountain. I've used more tuners/builders on more cars than most of the posters on this forum. Everyone can promise a perfect job, but few deliver. Buschur Racing and David Buschur specifically met every goal I gave them. After that, I've been able to attain every goal we went after. We'll continue to set higher goals and attain them because of the Buschur Racing 'attitude' and experience. How can you argue with success? I guess you can, but it only brings out the true attitudes and not the facts.

 

last time i checked ams was at the top of the heap , when did buschur beat there et?

 

Well I would assume the Grodens are for the track only or 800+whp cars that are allways going to be at that level. I have a few motors that are at about 550whp on pump meth with steal rods and they are fine. I doubt out of the 50 motors you built 5% are going to be over 600hp on a daily basis.

This post about the rods is for the guys stepping up to the 700+ whp on a daily level and want to know there options.

 

When I speak of top of the heap, (although Buschur DOES hold the mph, which as most poster believes is an idication of whp), I speak of the multitudes of car owners who successfully race their cars on a daily basis and are very satisfied with their results. Owners are the best indication of how well the engine builder/tuner did his job. I'm amazed at how quickly the newcomers are willing to attack success and try to find fault. Yeah, David is a little cocky, ok, a LOT cocky, but you know, HE'S EARNED it the OLD FASHIONED WAY. Hard work, LOTS of developement, which I can assure you lead to some of the products being sold by his competitors, and years of success. You might attack an attitude, but your train runs off the tracks when you try to attack his parts and engine building ability. That only shows desparation.

 

Did i made a wrong choice of rods now? I'm running eagles and aiming for 700whp(I gez just Dynojet ) with my BR HTA35R...

Anyway,GL Paul!!!

 

Dave is the one who follows Paul around trying to make him and I look stupid. I know Dave is the 4G63 man and never have said he was not. I have learned alot for my trial and error and help from others. I feel by sharing what we have learned it will help us and others in the end.

Yes Paul and I have hurt some parts but we have ran some good ## and made some good hp. For Pauls 1st year ever really racing we have done well. Remember Paul had two motors fail before he ever met me.