Project: Evo6 Powered Mirage
initial tuning today at E&H Motors in NZ.
320whp @ 17psi boost, still timing to put in.
I'm very surprised by the power, AFR is at 0.82 lambda.
Making 16psi by 2700rpm, i will hopefully have dyno sheets up tomorrow.
This is all on a stock evo 7 turbo with a 9.8cm2 exhaust housing, and i'm looking at starting a turbo upgrade program up for the NZ market. More info and results to come soon!
Cheers, Mike
320whp @ 17psi boost, still timing to put in.
I'm very surprised by the power, AFR is at 0.82 lambda.
Making 16psi by 2700rpm, i will hopefully have dyno sheets up tomorrow.
This is all on a stock evo 7 turbo with a 9.8cm2 exhaust housing, and i'm looking at starting a turbo upgrade program up for the NZ market. More info and results to come soon!
Cheers, Mike
Here are some initial results from the new engine and stock turbo (evo 7 9.8cm2)
I will put some km's on the engine like this, then we'll turn it up with synthetic oil in a few weeks.
I'm very suprised by the results, there is still a lot left in it.
pre intercooler IAT was 140degC, compared to 190degC that i used to get with the FP Red. But that was flowing much more air.
on the comparison sheet, green is stock turbo (new engine), yellow is FP Red (old engine).
Please note the units used on the left hand scale.
they are 10second runs on a dynapack dyno.
Cheers, Mike
I will put some km's on the engine like this, then we'll turn it up with synthetic oil in a few weeks.
I'm very suprised by the results, there is still a lot left in it.
pre intercooler IAT was 140degC, compared to 190degC that i used to get with the FP Red. But that was flowing much more air.
on the comparison sheet, green is stock turbo (new engine), yellow is FP Red (old engine).
Please note the units used on the left hand scale.
they are 10second runs on a dynapack dyno.
Cheers, Mike
So I've been talking with Bradford about the Virtual dyno software.
He kindly added the relevant information to the program to allow the Link G4 logs to work (once converted) with the software.
Here are a couple of runs to backup my dyno results.
I haven't weighed my car in a while, so once i've done that i'll alter them if needs be.
Last time i weighed it, it was 2600lbs with half a tank of gas. This time i had 3/4 of a tank of gas, and i've just upgraded the front brakes to brembo's.
I'm about 230lbs.
So this is a rough idea
He kindly added the relevant information to the program to allow the Link G4 logs to work (once converted) with the software.
Here are a couple of runs to backup my dyno results.
I haven't weighed my car in a while, so once i've done that i'll alter them if needs be.
Last time i weighed it, it was 2600lbs with half a tank of gas. This time i had 3/4 of a tank of gas, and i've just upgraded the front brakes to brembo's.
I'm about 230lbs.
So this is a rough idea
Last edited by RSMike; Mar 18, 2012 at 01:43 AM.
just swapped on a 10.5cm2 exhaust housing today.
No other changes. (i tried to get the wastegate preload the same)
Looks like the 10.5cm2 picked up a bit of top end power versus the 9.8cm2 housing, this will be confirmed soon on the dyno with proper results.
Cheers, Mike
No other changes. (i tried to get the wastegate preload the same)
Looks like the 10.5cm2 picked up a bit of top end power versus the 9.8cm2 housing, this will be confirmed soon on the dyno with proper results.
Cheers, Mike
I've been researching the hybrid dry sump setup a little bit more.
I'll post it here so i have somewhere to keep my findings
2 stage scavenge pump
http://www.drysump.com/ecotecpump.htm
http://www.drysump.com/subarupump.htm
ideally what i would want it to look like.
Pump, Mount and tensioner on the stock belt
http://www.drysump.com/3020pump.htm
what the setup would look like
http://www.drysump.com/images/are-pl...matic-for-.jpg
oil tank
http://www.drysump.com/Gallon%20Tanks.htm
3 stage scavenge pump if required
http://www.drysump.com/3021pump.htm
The biggest challenge will be "breaking out" the stock oil pump to allow an external oil feed.
I think this is where the 2 piece alloy/steel oil pan found on the turbo Airtrek will work really well.
I really like the idea of running the pump off the stock accessory belt, and run the pump in the Air Conditioning location.
With the stock oil pump being used, the front cover, oil filter assembly, oil cooler and oil filter can be retained unmodified (apart from the oil pickup modification).
any thoughts?
I'll post it here so i have somewhere to keep my findings
2 stage scavenge pump
http://www.drysump.com/ecotecpump.htm
http://www.drysump.com/subarupump.htm
ideally what i would want it to look like.
Pump, Mount and tensioner on the stock belt
http://www.drysump.com/3020pump.htm
what the setup would look like
http://www.drysump.com/images/are-pl...matic-for-.jpg
oil tank
http://www.drysump.com/Gallon%20Tanks.htm
3 stage scavenge pump if required
http://www.drysump.com/3021pump.htm
The biggest challenge will be "breaking out" the stock oil pump to allow an external oil feed.
I think this is where the 2 piece alloy/steel oil pan found on the turbo Airtrek will work really well.
I really like the idea of running the pump off the stock accessory belt, and run the pump in the Air Conditioning location.
With the stock oil pump being used, the front cover, oil filter assembly, oil cooler and oil filter can be retained unmodified (apart from the oil pickup modification).
any thoughts?
Got pictures of the 2-piece oil pan?
I was thinking something like a machined flange to adapt over to some AN fittings and do an O-ringed bulkhead through the oil pan. It would take some careful planning though to avoid running fittings and hoses into the rotating assembly. The other worry is you have no way to inspect the fittings once assembled to verify they are tight and leak free.
I was also thinking machining a new oil filter housing piece so it retained the oil pressure regulator but got rid of the filter and cooler thermostat would be worth looking at. Put the cooler/thermostat and filter in the scavenge return line before the tank. This way you could get a larger volume filter in the system for better cleaning capacity and reduce the pressure loss on the high side to the filter and cooler at high RPM.
I don't know how it would work in that system, but I'd also probably plan on one scavenge in the pan for oil and then a second scavenge in the head or crank case simply for pulling a vacuum in the motor.
A buddy used this pump on his STI and even at the 800HP level, it pulled so much vacuum we had to make controlled leaks to keep vacuum in the crank case to the 5-10" HG range.
http://www.petersonfluidsys.com/pump_wetvac.html
If I recall correctly, it actually still dropped oil pressure at high RPM, but volume and pressure are two different things when you mix RPM in there. As RPM increases, your flow rate through the bearing also increases so the same flow rate will show much lower pressures. Anyway, a full season of 10 second low boost passes and the bearings looked perfect. It was a complete ***** to work out the kinks at first though and actually cost him a motor upfront. The vacuum scavenge managed to pull a strong vacuum on a tube that wasn't obvious that it was going very low in the motor. Without acceleration, it was fine, but under heavy acceleration, the vacuum stage emptied the oil pan in a matter of seconds leaving nothing for the pressure side to pull from. Bye bye rod bearings.
It is amazing how much volume you actually get on these pumps.
I was thinking something like a machined flange to adapt over to some AN fittings and do an O-ringed bulkhead through the oil pan. It would take some careful planning though to avoid running fittings and hoses into the rotating assembly. The other worry is you have no way to inspect the fittings once assembled to verify they are tight and leak free.
I was also thinking machining a new oil filter housing piece so it retained the oil pressure regulator but got rid of the filter and cooler thermostat would be worth looking at. Put the cooler/thermostat and filter in the scavenge return line before the tank. This way you could get a larger volume filter in the system for better cleaning capacity and reduce the pressure loss on the high side to the filter and cooler at high RPM.
I don't know how it would work in that system, but I'd also probably plan on one scavenge in the pan for oil and then a second scavenge in the head or crank case simply for pulling a vacuum in the motor.
A buddy used this pump on his STI and even at the 800HP level, it pulled so much vacuum we had to make controlled leaks to keep vacuum in the crank case to the 5-10" HG range.
http://www.petersonfluidsys.com/pump_wetvac.html
If I recall correctly, it actually still dropped oil pressure at high RPM, but volume and pressure are two different things when you mix RPM in there. As RPM increases, your flow rate through the bearing also increases so the same flow rate will show much lower pressures. Anyway, a full season of 10 second low boost passes and the bearings looked perfect. It was a complete ***** to work out the kinks at first though and actually cost him a motor upfront. The vacuum scavenge managed to pull a strong vacuum on a tube that wasn't obvious that it was going very low in the motor. Without acceleration, it was fine, but under heavy acceleration, the vacuum stage emptied the oil pan in a matter of seconds leaving nothing for the pressure side to pull from. Bye bye rod bearings.
It is amazing how much volume you actually get on these pumps.
^ woops!
I think the 2 piece pan would allow you to run an AN bulkhead fitting through the side of the pan and to the reservoir. that way you could use the OEM pump, but route the pickup externally of the block to your reservoir.
I too have been thinking about the same thing... dry sump while using the OEM pump... I too found ARE's site and I too came to the same idea you did.
I've got a Subaru that I'm doing a Peterson dry sump on... may not end up using it in the end. owner wants A/C too bad!
I think the 2 piece pan would allow you to run an AN bulkhead fitting through the side of the pan and to the reservoir. that way you could use the OEM pump, but route the pickup externally of the block to your reservoir.
I too have been thinking about the same thing... dry sump while using the OEM pump... I too found ARE's site and I too came to the same idea you did.
I've got a Subaru that I'm doing a Peterson dry sump on... may not end up using it in the end. owner wants A/C too bad!
03whitegsr, i've been told you need to pull 10" vacuum just to make your power back from the dry sump pump system. You ideally want to run between 12" to 15" of vacuum for power increase.
I would definitely pull oil out of the oil pan only.
With a "controlled vacuum leak" in the head, this will pull oil down into the sump because of the airflow.
One on each side of the sump, to allow oil flow back to the tank on both right and left hand corners.
4wd turbo Airtrek 2 piece oil pan:
non turbo airtrek sump in the foreground, no turbo oil return and wider sump (which will get in the way of oil lines)
I would definitely pull oil out of the oil pan only.
With a "controlled vacuum leak" in the head, this will pull oil down into the sump because of the airflow.
One on each side of the sump, to allow oil flow back to the tank on both right and left hand corners.
4wd turbo Airtrek 2 piece oil pan:
non turbo airtrek sump in the foreground, no turbo oil return and wider sump (which will get in the way of oil lines)
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Joined: Sep 2006
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From: Newcastle, Australia.
Nice work on the comparison of the 10.5 rear Mike.
I'm making ~360 on the 9.8 on E85 and ~24psi, stock cams, stock motor so its pretty well tapped out.
Not sure whether its worth swapping just the housing out without upping the turbo.
I'm making ~360 on the 9.8 on E85 and ~24psi, stock cams, stock motor so its pretty well tapped out.
Not sure whether its worth swapping just the housing out without upping the turbo.
What an awesome little car, definitely a good read and a beast in the making. Good luck.
I think there might be a pretty easy solution using that pan.
As for vacuum levels to pull, I've heard 7"-8" is about optimial and much more then 10" can cause seal damage. I'm sure it is something you could test though on the dyno. We never got around to testing different levels, we had more fun just trying to keep it from sucking the pan dry and avoiding 20" at low loads.
There is going to be some trial and error in developing something like this and worse cause, a dead motor is very possible. You'll have to balance the flow curves between the scavenge pump and the stock pump. I'm not sure the difference between a scavenge pump design and something meant for wet sump operation, but the pump I posted above wasn't really self priming.
Also, you'll have to deal with oil draining out of the tank and back into the pan when it's shut down. 2 gallons of oil int he pan would be trouble if it all drained back.
As for vacuum levels to pull, I've heard 7"-8" is about optimial and much more then 10" can cause seal damage. I'm sure it is something you could test though on the dyno. We never got around to testing different levels, we had more fun just trying to keep it from sucking the pan dry and avoiding 20" at low loads.
There is going to be some trial and error in developing something like this and worse cause, a dead motor is very possible. You'll have to balance the flow curves between the scavenge pump and the stock pump. I'm not sure the difference between a scavenge pump design and something meant for wet sump operation, but the pump I posted above wasn't really self priming.
Also, you'll have to deal with oil draining out of the tank and back into the pan when it's shut down. 2 gallons of oil int he pan would be trouble if it all drained back.