Notices
Evo Engine / Turbo / Drivetrain Everything from engine management to the best clutch and flywheel.

Question about power with s3 cams?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Apr 20, 2013 | 02:01 PM
  #1  
ctfpevoVIII's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,006
Likes: 66
From: connecticut
Question about power with s3 cams?

Well I have finally got my gsc s3 cams installed with a ported IM and ported tb. In the the process of tuning it was noted that my afr's were 11.8 and my tuner added more fuel to only find out that my afr's were not getting richer and my idc was hitting 95%. So my tuner suggested we retire my walbro 255 and step up to a walbro 400, I'm waiting for the pump patiently . Well anyways we did see about 468 WHP and 410ish for torque taking the car up to 7000 rpm and about 27#'s of boost. So so far I'm kind of disappointed about the #'s so far. You can see my #'s in my sig of my previous setup, the better #'s were made at 30 degree temps with 30# boost. So my question is how much of an improvement do you think I can see once my fuel issue is fixed and running about 30-32 # of boost? Maybe a fair comparison would be to wait till it got cold again so the conditions are the same. Anyways as soon as I have results I will post them on my dyno result thread .
Reply
Old Apr 20, 2013 | 02:12 PM
  #2  
joseph143's Avatar
Evolved Member
iTrader: (8)
 
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,124
Likes: 4
From: El Paso, Tx
If you plan to run e85 make sure you get the 415/450 e85 compatible pump...

Also the jump from 35* to current temps is huge... Or at least here it is... So i wouldnt expect more... Just more up top versus low end... And you hp/tq shouldnt taper off unless you run out of breathe on the turbo
Reply
Old Apr 20, 2013 | 02:16 PM
  #3  
ctfpevoVIII's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,006
Likes: 66
From: connecticut
Originally Posted by joseph143
If you plan to run e85 make sure you get the 415/450 e85 compatible pump...

Also the jump from 35* to current temps is huge... Or at least here it is... So i wouldnt expect more... Just more up top versus low end... And you hp/tq shouldnt taper off unless you run out of breathe on the turbo
No e85 up near me so 93/ 100% meth. The temps up around me are between 50-60 so not real bad yet, I bet those Texas are a little higher. I would think there some power to still be had I mean were comparing s3's to hks 272.
Reply
Old Apr 20, 2013 | 02:29 PM
  #4  
JohnBradley's Avatar
Evolved Member
Shutterbug
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
iTrader: (30)
 
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 11,406
Likes: 78
From: Northwest
You could be compressor limited more than anything but the higher intake temps arent helping. I havent seen good more than that until you are well over 30psi and in some cases less power if you dont have adequate exhaust flow out. An O2 dump and big exhaust go a long way to keeping it balanced, if you let more in you have to let more out.

We had a stock style O2 housing car lose power going from S2s to S3s on a 2.4 until we put an O2 dump on it. The car went from 600s at 35psi to 575 at 35psi in the change, added the O2 dump and then it made 670@32psi.
Reply
Old Apr 20, 2013 | 02:40 PM
  #5  
ctfpevoVIII's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,006
Likes: 66
From: connecticut
Originally Posted by JohnBradley
You could be compressor limited more than anything but the higher intake temps arent helping. I havent seen good more than that until you are well over 30psi and in some cases less power if you dont have adequate exhaust flow out. An O2 dump and big exhaust go a long way to keeping it balanced, if you let more in you have to let more out.

We had a stock style O2 housing car lose power going from S2s to S3s on a 2.4 until we put an O2 dump on it. The car went from 600s at 35psi to 575 at 35psi in the change, added the O2 dump and then it made 670@32psi.
I don't run an O2 dump, but I'm running a bigger ported O2 housing with a 3" exhaust /test pipe all the way back.
Reply
Old Apr 20, 2013 | 03:05 PM
  #6  
JohnBradley's Avatar
Evolved Member
Shutterbug
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
iTrader: (30)
 
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 11,406
Likes: 78
From: Northwest
That is what the car I mentioned was doing.

A big recirc'd O2 housing is not enough on small housing turbos. Remember we are running backpressure ratios in excess of 1.5:1 in some cases, so the more you let in the worse the ratio gets. Mychailo logged his BBK at 470whp and 33psi, I believe it was 47psi of backpressure...he has the data on that as he was tuning and logging I was only driving the car on the dyno. He is only running the HKS 274/278 so not even larger cams.

You're original problem is fuel pressure dropping off or a bad WB and fuel is being added but the sensor isnt showing it. At less boost is the AFR richer? 1000s by themselves and a good 255 will support 600whp. 1000s with meth will support 650whp. How new is the intank filter?

Last edited by JohnBradley; Apr 20, 2013 at 03:08 PM.
Reply
Old Apr 20, 2013 | 03:16 PM
  #7  
ctfpevoVIII's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,006
Likes: 66
From: connecticut
Originally Posted by JohnBradley
That is what the car I mentioned was doing.

A big recirc'd O2 housing is not enough on small housing turbos. Remember we are running backpressure ratios in excess of 1.5:1 in some cases, so the more you let in the worse the ratio gets. Mychailo logged his BBK at 470whp and 33psi, I believe it was 47psi of backpressure...he has the data on that as he was tuning and logging I was only driving the car on the dyno. He is only running the HKS 274/278 so not even larger cams.

You're original problem is fuel pressure dropping off or a bad WB and fuel is being added but the sensor isnt showing it. At less boost is the AFR richer? 1000s by themselves and a good 255 will support 600whp. 1000s with meth will support 650whp. How new is the intank filter?
We installed a new in tank filter with no improvement with my 255 pump.The afr's are a little richer with less boost, but not much. As far as the wide band I run a AEM wb in the car and he is also logging with his wb and there with in .1-.2 of each other. Thanks for the the insight , I don't mind hearing responses maybe my tuner is over looking something. I guess I will see once we install a new pump?

Last edited by ctfpevoVIII; Apr 20, 2013 at 03:20 PM.
Reply
Old Apr 20, 2013 | 04:47 PM
  #8  
17pstockcar's Avatar
Evolving Member
 
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 327
Likes: 0
From: New Zealand
Originally Posted by JohnBradley
We had a stock style O2 housing car lose power going from S2s to S3s on a 2.4 until we put an O2 dump on it. The car went from 600s at 35psi to 575 at 35psi in the change, added the O2 dump and then it made 670@32psi.

Shows just how impotant combinations are in making great power
Reply
Old Apr 22, 2013 | 03:05 PM
  #9  
ctfpevoVIII's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,006
Likes: 66
From: connecticut
Well my tuner just called me about 10 min. ago and gave me some good news, new fuel pump in and the car just made 500 WHP/ 450 WTRQ @ 30 #'s of boost. I'm kind of concerned about the torque though seeing its a stock block. My afr's are 11.3-11.4 across the board, don't know about my idc though. I will be picking up the car tomorrow and will post the details along with a graph.
Reply
Old Apr 22, 2013 | 05:18 PM
  #10  
CurseDSM's Avatar
EvoM Guru
15 Year Member
Photogenic
Photoriffic
Shutterbug
iTrader: (3)
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,590
Likes: 301
From: Pinckney, Michigan
Post up the dyno results when you get them I am curious to see what they look like.
Reply
Old Apr 23, 2013 | 06:29 PM
  #11  
ctfpevoVIII's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,006
Likes: 66
From: connecticut
Originally Posted by cursedsm
Post up the dyno results when you get them I am curious to see what they look like.
Here you go. I'm also going to post in in the tuning forum.
Attached Thumbnails Question about power with s3 cams?-photo-2-copy.jpg  
Reply
Old Apr 23, 2013 | 08:09 PM
  #12  
CurseDSM's Avatar
EvoM Guru
15 Year Member
Photogenic
Photoriffic
Shutterbug
iTrader: (3)
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,590
Likes: 301
From: Pinckney, Michigan
Looks good congrats on the #s
Reply
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
kaj
Evo Engine / Turbo / Drivetrain
286
Nov 27, 2025 06:54 PM
Abacus
Evo Dyno Tuning / Results
63
Feb 10, 2016 10:59 AM
03redtype-s
Evo X General
1
Nov 25, 2015 07:33 AM
Moore Auto
Evo X Dyno Results
19
Sep 4, 2015 01:53 AM
payway87
Evo Engine / Turbo / Drivetrain
43
Sep 9, 2014 03:50 PM




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:49 PM.