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help car started rolling in gear

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Old Oct 26, 2007 | 04:42 PM
  #16  
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From: South Dakota
Originally Posted by rcjustin
it probobly wasnt actually fully in gear yet. it has happened to me too
i know it was caused i tried 1-3rd an did it in each gear
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Old Oct 26, 2007 | 07:01 PM
  #17  
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Wow

I'm really amused and amazed by some of the responses. You really have to disseminate the information you receive on these sites. At least you're asking why and trying to figure out the reason why.

Without using your emergency brake the main thing that's keeping a manual transmission car from moving (while in gear, clutch pedal not pressed) is the resistance created by the internal parts of the engine. If you were strong enough or had enough help you could physically move your car on level ground while it was in gear regardless of what gear it's in. You could actually figure out the force required to overcome that internal resistance by using a simple physics equation F=m*a.

Also, I don't think compression has anything to do with the amount of resistance it takes to move a car that's turned off and in gear. With the car turned off, you have no compression. I would think the intake and exhaust valves would be open when the engine is off, thus no compression. Not sure about this though.
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Old Oct 26, 2007 | 10:53 PM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by mithrandir7533

You really have to disseminate the information you receive on these sites. At least you're asking why and trying to figure out the reason why.

Also, I don't think compression has anything to do with the amount of resistance it takes to move a car that's turned off and in gear. With the car turned off, you have no compression. I would think the intake and exhaust valves would be open when the engine is off, thus no compression. Not sure about this though.
Mith, you obviously have no idea how an internal compression engine works. The valves are mechanically operated by the camshaft, the camshaft is rotated by the timing belt that is turned by the crankshaft, the crankshaft is connected to the flywheel, clutch, input shaft, output shaft, differentials, driveshafts/halfshafts, wheels. Thus anytime the wheels are turned, and the clutch is engaged (pedal out), the valves opperate

By turning the wheels in gear you turn all of these, when the cranshaft rotates by the wheels it's the same as if it's being turned by a starter (that's why you can push-start a car with a bad starter). The higher compression the engine, the more force is required to overcome the compression of the engine to rotate the engine. This is often why when you increase the compression of the engine, you have to change to a stronger/gear reduction starter.

As for your "simple" equation of force, once you calculate the friction of all of the rotating parts, you will find that this friction is far less than the force required to overcome the compression of the engine.

You did state one thing correctly in your post "You really have to disseminate the information you receive on these sites."
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Old Oct 26, 2007 | 11:01 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by filter
ok my friend has a steep driveway that i have parked in before.

Use the parking brake. That's where it gets its name from.
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Old Oct 26, 2007 | 11:12 PM
  #20  
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From: Danbury,CT
Originally Posted by kaiten2
put the car in reverse when you park on a hill
+1
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Old Oct 26, 2007 | 11:20 PM
  #21  
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Amazing explaination. Couldn't have said it better.
Originally Posted by TempeRacerGuy
Mith, you obviously have no idea how an internal compression engine works. The valves are mechanically operated by the camshaft, the camshaft is rotated by the timing belt that is turned by the crankshaft, the crankshaft is connected to the flywheel, clutch, input shaft, output shaft, differentials, driveshafts/halfshafts, wheels. Thus anytime the wheels are turned, and the clutch is engaged (pedal out), the valves opperate

By turning the wheels in gear you turn all of these, when the cranshaft rotates by the wheels it's the same as if it's being turned by a starter (that's why you can push-start a car with a bad starter). The higher compression the engine, the more force is required to overcome the compression of the engine to rotate the engine. This is often why when you increase the compression of the engine, you have to change to a stronger/gear reduction starter.

As for your "simple" equation of force, once you calculate the friction of all of the rotating parts, you will find that this friction is far less than the force required to overcome the compression of the engine.

You did state one thing correctly in your post "You really have to disseminate the information you receive on these sites."
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Old Oct 26, 2007 | 11:36 PM
  #22  
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From: victorville, ca
i forget if reverse is your shortest or longest gear, but i remember learning that because of it being the longest( or shortest) it is best to have it in reverse when on a hill cuz its less likely to roll.
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Old Oct 27, 2007 | 01:34 AM
  #23  
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From: Danbury,CT
^^ yup also because the car will try to go foward (well down because of the hill) which is contrary to the reverse gear which will want to go backwards.
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Old Oct 29, 2007 | 08:22 AM
  #24  
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From: Chicago, IL
I stand corrected

No, I do understand how an internal combustion engine works. Yes, the higher the compression the more power(force) it takes to overcome that. That's why higher octane fuel is used in engines with higher compressions (diesel, VTEC, etc.) What I didn't know and stated so is how the engine operates when it's off. I stand corrected. I did some research and found out that you still have compression with the engine off. Thus, if you take the spark plugs out and push the car it will be easier to push.

Originally Posted by TempeRacerGuy
Mith, you obviously have no idea how an internal compression engine works. The valves are mechanically operated by the camshaft, the camshaft is rotated by the timing belt that is turned by the crankshaft, the crankshaft is connected to the flywheel, clutch, input shaft, output shaft, differentials, driveshafts/halfshafts, wheels. Thus anytime the wheels are turned, and the clutch is engaged (pedal out), the valves opperate

By turning the wheels in gear you turn all of these, when the cranshaft rotates by the wheels it's the same as if it's being turned by a starter (that's why you can push-start a car with a bad starter). The higher compression the engine, the more force is required to overcome the compression of the engine to rotate the engine. This is often why when you increase the compression of the engine, you have to change to a stronger/gear reduction starter.

As for your "simple" equation of force, once you calculate the friction of all of the rotating parts, you will find that this friction is far less than the force required to overcome the compression of the engine.

You did state one thing correctly in your post "You really have to disseminate the information you receive on these sites."
Reply
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