Damn clutch master cylinder broke today
It sounds like competition to me. That's what the industry is based on. That's what every product in the country is based on actually. No monopolies means better products for the general public at lower prices. Each company works to make a better part at a competitive price. If it wasn't for this one company one make one thing and jack the price up and you would have to pay that ridiculous price for a so so part because they are the only one who offers it. 
LOL elementary economics.
Not hijacking this thread, but i've been having some issues with my Magnus. Here's my thread if you have any input, but seems to be failing at only 3k miles
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...mes-ideas.html
LOL elementary economics. Not hijacking this thread, but i've been having some issues with my Magnus. Here's my thread if you have any input, but seems to be failing at only 3k miles
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...mes-ideas.html
I can see why you might be under the impression that we merely copied his design but there are always two sides to the story and facts not known by the public. It is human tendency to assume the worst. Let me explain what is not publicly known about the subject.
The problem of the EVO X clutch master cylinders failing is nothing new. We were fighting these issues and had retrofit other master cylinders both on our Time Attack car and Ryan Gates in the 2009 season. As the public started installing aftermarket clutches more and more failures were occurring. After some time Magnus came out with his solution to the growing problem.
The Magnus unit does work and we did indeed sell a few over the past year with success. Marco’s unit was actually brought to us by a customer and we installed it for him. At the time we decided it was a good solution but the technicians noted it was difficult and time consuming to install due to placement of the bolts and some improvement could be made. This was brought to the attention of our engineers.
Upon inspection our engineers noted the face of the adapter does not accept the steel lip of the firewall and can sit unevenly upon it depending on the bolt tensions and tightening order. This could cause a misalignment and we noticed several of the clutch master cylinders wearing out prematurely due to this over time. They also saw how difficult it is to install any master cylinder due to the tight quarters where it is mounted. This raised concerns that if the adapter is not aligned properly it would cause problems down the road. If the adapter is difficult to install, this furthers the chance of cylinder misalignment and failure. Due to their observations they decided to pursue the project of making our own solution.
Our product is not a copy and the insinuation that we simply took Marco's unit and reverse engineered it is not correct. We started from scratch and made this piece in a manner that we felt was best. Using our CMM we measured the factory EVO X master cylinder and the firewall itself in order to machine a mounting plate that fits flush and is easier to install due to a different mounting configuration. Because it sits flush there is no chance of misalignment and this will eliminate the chance of master cylinder failures. The engineers also felt the use of a steel ball cup would be best for longevity.
The only real similarity between ours and the Magnus adapter is the use of the EVO VIII/IX clutch master cylinder. This was an obvious choice for us due to the nearly identical clutch characteristics between the EVO X and the VIII/IX. When we set out to design our part we did not feel that this would be viewed as a proprietary part of the Magnus kit.
Comparing Chinese copies of our products is apples to oranges as they were copying our design using inferior parts and creating a product that performed far worse than ours. When we openly talked for two years about our F1-I intake manifold for the EVO 7-9 showing CAD drawings and pictures etc. we were not upset when Marco's manifold was released mere days apart from ours. That's the business.
Here is an example of a similar situation. A lot of companies use 4.6/5.0 Mustang and Q45 throttle bodies with their EVO VIII/IX intake manifolds. I don't recall who first discovered that they work well but everyone else followed suit. I don't recall anyone being upset about that at the time.
This industry evolves. Just about any part made right now can be traced as an evolution from another. From exhausts to turbo kits to intake manifolds etc… It's how parts keep getting better and better every year. Once our kit is released the differences will be obvious. With out actually seeing both units I feel it is a little premature to pass such judgement.
Our product is going to be a more expensive piece as it a little more complex to produce than the one Magnus sells. I'm sure there is room in the market for both. We consider Marco and everyone at Magnus a good friend. I personally have a lot of really fond memories with Marco and I hope to have even more in the future.
This is not going to be a high volume part or a huge money maker for us. We simply saw a need for a solution to support our many other products for the EVO X. We surely did not intend to offend anyone or damage our relationship with Marco or this.
Eric
The problem of the EVO X clutch master cylinders failing is nothing new. We were fighting these issues and had retrofit other master cylinders both on our Time Attack car and Ryan Gates in the 2009 season. As the public started installing aftermarket clutches more and more failures were occurring. After some time Magnus came out with his solution to the growing problem.
The Magnus unit does work and we did indeed sell a few over the past year with success. Marco’s unit was actually brought to us by a customer and we installed it for him. At the time we decided it was a good solution but the technicians noted it was difficult and time consuming to install due to placement of the bolts and some improvement could be made. This was brought to the attention of our engineers.
Upon inspection our engineers noted the face of the adapter does not accept the steel lip of the firewall and can sit unevenly upon it depending on the bolt tensions and tightening order. This could cause a misalignment and we noticed several of the clutch master cylinders wearing out prematurely due to this over time. They also saw how difficult it is to install any master cylinder due to the tight quarters where it is mounted. This raised concerns that if the adapter is not aligned properly it would cause problems down the road. If the adapter is difficult to install, this furthers the chance of cylinder misalignment and failure. Due to their observations they decided to pursue the project of making our own solution.
Our product is not a copy and the insinuation that we simply took Marco's unit and reverse engineered it is not correct. We started from scratch and made this piece in a manner that we felt was best. Using our CMM we measured the factory EVO X master cylinder and the firewall itself in order to machine a mounting plate that fits flush and is easier to install due to a different mounting configuration. Because it sits flush there is no chance of misalignment and this will eliminate the chance of master cylinder failures. The engineers also felt the use of a steel ball cup would be best for longevity.
The only real similarity between ours and the Magnus adapter is the use of the EVO VIII/IX clutch master cylinder. This was an obvious choice for us due to the nearly identical clutch characteristics between the EVO X and the VIII/IX. When we set out to design our part we did not feel that this would be viewed as a proprietary part of the Magnus kit.
Comparing Chinese copies of our products is apples to oranges as they were copying our design using inferior parts and creating a product that performed far worse than ours. When we openly talked for two years about our F1-I intake manifold for the EVO 7-9 showing CAD drawings and pictures etc. we were not upset when Marco's manifold was released mere days apart from ours. That's the business.
Here is an example of a similar situation. A lot of companies use 4.6/5.0 Mustang and Q45 throttle bodies with their EVO VIII/IX intake manifolds. I don't recall who first discovered that they work well but everyone else followed suit. I don't recall anyone being upset about that at the time.
This industry evolves. Just about any part made right now can be traced as an evolution from another. From exhausts to turbo kits to intake manifolds etc… It's how parts keep getting better and better every year. Once our kit is released the differences will be obvious. With out actually seeing both units I feel it is a little premature to pass such judgement.
Our product is going to be a more expensive piece as it a little more complex to produce than the one Magnus sells. I'm sure there is room in the market for both. We consider Marco and everyone at Magnus a good friend. I personally have a lot of really fond memories with Marco and I hope to have even more in the future.
This is not going to be a high volume part or a huge money maker for us. We simply saw a need for a solution to support our many other products for the EVO X. We surely did not intend to offend anyone or damage our relationship with Marco or this.
Eric
We are at the end of the testing faze and everything looks good so far. We are going to have the kits ready to ship in hopefully 3-4 weeks depending on how the holiday season affects things.
Can I use yours even though I have previously installed the magnus?
It looks like i'm going to go with you guys on this one. My magnus is failing less than 3k miles after install. I don't care how much a CMC costs; I just want one that works.
It looks like i'm going to go with you guys on this one. My magnus is failing less than 3k miles after install. I don't care how much a CMC costs; I just want one that works.
Real Evo CMC or is it a Chinese one?
We have not tried or had to install our unit on a car that already had the Magnus piece but I would image that it would work fine.
Evolving Member
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 250
Likes: 1
From: Pittsburg
I am so tired of swithing CMC's. I cant wait to buy one.
Unfortunately these will not be released before Christmas and we will be closed from the 26th until January 2nd. We are waiting on more parts to arrive so when it is released we will be able to ship out all orders right away. We are hoping to have these released the first or second week in January. It all depends on how the Holidays effect the parts getting here.