View Poll Results: Was YO Parts unjustly expelled from EvoM?
Yes, YO Parts deserves to be here just like any other company.
8
80.00%
No, YO Parts and their business model threatened the integrity of our community.
2
20.00%
Voters: 10. You may not vote on this poll
YO Parts Fiasco
Evolved Member
iTrader: (37)
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,146
Likes: 2
From: Spec-Ops Motorsports, Fayetteville, NC
lol... your first comments were my basis of thought as well.... if im not mistaken, they did, after being told to leave, do some things they werent suppose to, but only then.
Just understand as well, they are not on this site anymore, they are not out of business......
Just understand as well, they are not on this site anymore, they are not out of business......
I think what really needs to be respected is the time and effort shops like AMS, BR, and many others put in...
people dont understand the upfront cost that goes into product development etc... meanwhile, there is no return on it.. you have your cost out of pocket, your time, your use of credit, etc....
therefor you have to have the margins to cover that... and of course, we all want to be profitable... or we would be doing something else...
ive only read lightly, but to see a company like AMS having to get defensive, bothers me, to say the least.
cb
people dont understand the upfront cost that goes into product development etc... meanwhile, there is no return on it.. you have your cost out of pocket, your time, your use of credit, etc....
therefor you have to have the margins to cover that... and of course, we all want to be profitable... or we would be doing something else...
ive only read lightly, but to see a company like AMS having to get defensive, bothers me, to say the least.
cb
yeah it might be good for the buyer, but then ultimatly it kind of kills off the smaller shops who can't survive on the smaller margins. It also sets the buyers price expecation low enough so that even companies like AMS or buschur can't survive...
As a buyer think about it.. now you have been exposed to a hypothetical pricing structure that keeps the small shops in business.
I have been thinking of starting a small shop of my own for years now, yo-parts may have successfully killed my potential business plan because I can't survive the startup time to profitability with lower margins.. Adding a service bay may not even be enough.
All this crap reminds me of what happened to the domestic aftermarket marketplace in the mid-70's with eddlebrock and summit (and other large volume distrubuters) who basically undercut the competition. Look what it did to the industry as a whole...
What attracted me to the import market was the manufacutures policing of the wholesale and vendor market to prevent actions that exposed the wholesale pricing structure to your average buyer. typically depending on the manufacturer, they may or may not take aggressive action to prevent shops from undercutting the prices to keep the small shops competitive. It will be interesting to see how the industry responds to this new subscription based marketing website.
It's an interesting business concept, I wish I had thought of it earlier.
Newbie
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
From: NY
I completely agree with Eric @AMS. Most if not all small shops (I also work for one) depend on sales to keep the place going, labor cannot always get it done. We barely make any money on parts due to all the cheeseball, guy in his mom's basement sellers. Wise decision to drop them, definitely not going to benefit the community.
Bad enough having chinese knockoffs of every part, now guys come in and sell stuff at cost. Its not competition when the doors get closed.
Bad enough having chinese knockoffs of every part, now guys come in and sell stuff at cost. Its not competition when the doors get closed.
I am still trying to understand, how is banning them for this site going to keep evo owners from going to the site and shop? Please explain? This may even get them more business. Its like a double edge sword! To each is own!
Maybe AMS etc.... may have to re-think marketing strategy. There will always be someone smarter and cheaper no matter what! VIVE LA
Evolved Member
iTrader: (37)
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,146
Likes: 2
From: Spec-Ops Motorsports, Fayetteville, NC
I am still trying to understand, how is banning them for this site going to keep evo owners from going to the site and shop? Please explain? This may even get them more business. Its like a double edge sword! To each is own!
Maybe AMS etc.... may have to re-think marketing strategy. There will always be someone smarter and cheaper no matter what! VIVE LA
Maybe AMS etc.... may have to re-think marketing strategy. There will always be someone smarter and cheaper no matter what! VIVE LA
Its not like you see advertising anywhere else except for on websites or magazines... in the magazines all you see is AMS, buschur, and bigger shops
I completely agree with Eric @AMS. Most if not all small shops (I also work for one) depend on sales to keep the place going, labor cannot always get it done. We barely make any money on parts due to all the cheeseball, guy in his mom's basement sellers. Wise decision to drop them, definitely not going to benefit the community.
Bad enough having chinese knockoffs of every part, now guys come in and sell stuff at cost. Its not competition when the doors get closed.
Bad enough having chinese knockoffs of every part, now guys come in and sell stuff at cost. Its not competition when the doors get closed.
[QUOTE=bigric09;4993682]out of sight, out of mind.... that simple. If the site doesnt support them, then people will be hesitant to use them.
Its not like you see advertising anywhere else except for on websites or magazines... in the magazines all you see is AMS, buschur, and bigger shops
I am sure this thread is giving them advertisement indirectly! Look at me I did not know about yoprat and I went to go check it out.
Its not like you see advertising anywhere else except for on websites or magazines... in the magazines all you see is AMS, buschur, and bigger shops
I am sure this thread is giving them advertisement indirectly! Look at me I did not know about yoprat and I went to go check it out.
Evolved Member
iTrader: (37)
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,146
Likes: 2
From: Spec-Ops Motorsports, Fayetteville, NC
soon threads like these will disappear or become closed and be put away or closed because eventually someone will come in here and start some trouble and the mods will be forced to close it. Yoparts will vanish and be forgotten except by those still ordering from them
We cant stop you members or the public from buying from them, nor are we trying. We are simply making a stand that we will not support it or allow it to happen here. I am sure that all this commotion will undoubtedly gain them some business in the short term. However I would not be surprised if their attack on us and our vendors backfires on them as well. If I was another site considering adding them and I came across this or the page that they previously had on their site about this situation, I would think twice about adding them. And while we are the first, I would not be surprised if we are not the last to remove them. A lot of this can probably be summed up as my fault as I am the one that choose to add them in the first place which now in hindsight was a mistake. Unfortunately, I rarely have the time to do thorough checks of new vendors and as described to me, seemed more harmless than it so turned out to be. Anyways, if you want to shop with them, go ahead, we jsut simply cannot have them as vendors here.
Newbie
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
From: NY
Of course i'm biased. Everyone likes low prices including myself. I'm an enthusiast too, but its more then just pricing. When I was young and ignorant I would surely be eager to jump on that ship and buy parts from that type of outfit. But knowing and caring about whats best for everyone should steer people away from that.
Point is, they are not competition, that kind of seller will ruin the market and slowly kill companies designing trick new parts and products. Its going to come down to buying crap on ebay and yoparts....crossing your fingers that you get results, fitment etc....
Evolved Member
iTrader: (37)
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,146
Likes: 2
From: Spec-Ops Motorsports, Fayetteville, NC
Of course i'm biased. Everyone likes low prices including myself. I'm an enthusiast too, but its more then just pricing. When I was young and ignorant I would surely be eager to jump on that ship and buy parts from that type of outfit. But knowing and caring about whats best for everyone should steer people away from that.
Point is, they are not competition, that kind of seller will ruin the market and slowly kill companies designing trick new parts and products. Its going to come down to buying crap on ebay and yoparts....crossing your fingers that you get results, fitment etc....
Point is, they are not competition, that kind of seller will ruin the market and slowly kill companies designing trick new parts and products. Its going to come down to buying crap on ebay and yoparts....crossing your fingers that you get results, fitment etc....
you are biased and fall to the side of AMS because of that. What if you were a smaller wholesale company watching your big brother get booted out of the business ? do you then get angry because they were forced to leave ? judging by how you attacked this subject, id say, you bet your *** you would. Being biased does not solve issues, being biased actually does nothing for your side of the arguement. Just because you are an enthusiast doesnt mean you see both sides... for that to be true, you'd have to have a shop or work at one like you do, but not order things thru your contacts, order them the same way everyone else does. But in the end, for you, the important thing is your business being sucessful, in the end, for me, the important thing is getting what i want for my car at the best price possible, or while supporting the vendor i think deserves it.
The difference in all of that is i support yoparts as a vendor due to their customer service and pricing because in the end, they are a great source for the end item consumer, i also support AMS, Buschur and CBRD because they are down in the trenches doing things their own way, R & Ding the crap out of things and providing reviews and products for the community that are proven by them to hit where it counts and actually benefit the community as a whole the most
Evolved Member
iTrader: (37)
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,146
Likes: 2
From: Spec-Ops Motorsports, Fayetteville, NC
As promised I have reopened the thread given that this does not get out of hand. And now to outline the problem, events, and decision.
To start, this is not an issue that just popped up and AMS was not the first or last to complain. They are getting an unjust amount of the blame for this simply because they are the ones that started to most recent thread. Starting with the first week yoparts were a vendor, we started receiving multiple complaints from other vendors. The complaints really heated up after they started offering free trial memberships and monthly memberships making it totally unnecessary to have to pay the $100 membership original described to me. This went on for a little while with a good number of the vendors being represented either by posting or contacting us directly. Even more complained indirectly fearing making public complaints (probably for this exact reason). At the time, it was a delicate issue as it is now, so rather than act rashly, we made a decision to monitor and investigate. Over the next 4 months, we watched and monitor complaints. In this time, I explained several times that all the complaints would go away if they choose a less controversial business model which was politely declined. Also in this time, the issue of this vendor has apparently been discussed in many venues other than this site and through many businesses in the industry. This leads into the final complaint. By the time this complaint arose, we were already pretty sure that this was not going to work well out well. After discussing the issue at length amongst ourselves and many other businesses (not just AMS), we made a decision and stuck with it as the right thing to do for the long term strength of the community and the supporting industry. With the removal, we now also have higher levels of potential vendor screening and new rules. I made it quite clear to the vendors that this will not be a precedent to invite pricing witch hunts and vendor removals. Each removal is taken very seriously and it will be us and only us that make the decision. So to those who will say that we did this for financial gain or out of being threatened vendors, I can only say that this is not at all the case as it is in a way a loose loose scenario for us. Finally, we removed yoparts with almost a weeks notice in the most polite manner possible. They then choose to directly violate or rules and copyrights with a slanted attack on us and our vendors which has since been removed by them. As a result of this action, they are no longer welcome here in any fashion including as regular members.
The Decision:
Many of you will feel that this is an unfair decision and only hurts you, the member. Many asked why this could not be a public vote which has a simple answer. As general public, most will not understand nor greatly care about the long term negative aspects in comparison to getting a better price on your next purchase. As such, there is no way we could get a bias free vote. Even if some did consider it, and make a fair decision, the majority would not. Same goes for the vendors. Ask any vendor if they would like another vendor selling cheaper than them to be removed, and they are going to say yes, right thing or not. Therefor, the decision had to be made by us, the site ownership, alone. We straddle both sides being enthusiasts and consumers as well as seeing it from the industry perspective.
So why are they so bad and why are they any different than something like costco or ebay? Well, for the second issue, see my post a few back on what makes them so different from costco. As for ebay, as many of you know and have had experience with, ebay is a crap shoot. There is a certain level of risk involved that many are not willing to deal with. By being an authorized evoM vendor, we are standing behind them, and stepping in to mediate if there is a problem. The real negative side is not what happens today, but over time. If businesses like this are allowed to operate under our roof, it devalues the product. Profit is not a bad thing, just excessive profit. I don't think anyone here with and inside knowledge to this industry can say there is excessive profit available. Profit is necessary to run a business and provide a quality product and service. The business model for yoparts relies on taking a larger market share and volume to make this profit. This then means that other businesses need to either match their business model, or not sell the product eventually. Another argument I have heard is that this one company could not devalue an industry worth of product, but I disagree. We have a relatively small community here and if one company is given away everything for free to be extreme, it wont be long before no other vendor can sell those parts. It starts small and spreads one community at a time. Once devalued, there are a few problems. Many of the businesses that support our community(and make it possible) and offer great services can no longer afford to operate, and the premium/niche market suffers as well. Many of the premium or specialty items have less markup and cost more to make. Faced with competing products that are now cheaper, sales suffer. While most of these specialty items can continue on being different, there is only such much of a prices differential they can stand.
Now many of you have stated that this only affects other "price ******" or online retailers. Yes, this is the group that it affects most, however to say it does not affect a shop just because they also make money off labor is naive. I know because I have personally run a shop before. Yes, labor is more profitable than parts, but for many, that added profit gained by selling parts makes the difference.
So in summation, they would have a negative impact on the mainstream performance parts industry (both manufacturers and resellers), damage existing vendors of which many provide invaluable services, and hurt the long term longevity of this community. While they may not single handedly cause a a catastrophic downfall, it is our independent opinion that their lasting negative effects outweigh the good. We still retain a great wealth of vendors dedicating to serving you and giving you great prices. This site probably has the greatest selection of vendors of any site out there which is something to be thankful for.
Lastly, I apologize for the novel and hope that you, the members will be able to read this and understand the larger picture.
To start, this is not an issue that just popped up and AMS was not the first or last to complain. They are getting an unjust amount of the blame for this simply because they are the ones that started to most recent thread. Starting with the first week yoparts were a vendor, we started receiving multiple complaints from other vendors. The complaints really heated up after they started offering free trial memberships and monthly memberships making it totally unnecessary to have to pay the $100 membership original described to me. This went on for a little while with a good number of the vendors being represented either by posting or contacting us directly. Even more complained indirectly fearing making public complaints (probably for this exact reason). At the time, it was a delicate issue as it is now, so rather than act rashly, we made a decision to monitor and investigate. Over the next 4 months, we watched and monitor complaints. In this time, I explained several times that all the complaints would go away if they choose a less controversial business model which was politely declined. Also in this time, the issue of this vendor has apparently been discussed in many venues other than this site and through many businesses in the industry. This leads into the final complaint. By the time this complaint arose, we were already pretty sure that this was not going to work well out well. After discussing the issue at length amongst ourselves and many other businesses (not just AMS), we made a decision and stuck with it as the right thing to do for the long term strength of the community and the supporting industry. With the removal, we now also have higher levels of potential vendor screening and new rules. I made it quite clear to the vendors that this will not be a precedent to invite pricing witch hunts and vendor removals. Each removal is taken very seriously and it will be us and only us that make the decision. So to those who will say that we did this for financial gain or out of being threatened vendors, I can only say that this is not at all the case as it is in a way a loose loose scenario for us. Finally, we removed yoparts with almost a weeks notice in the most polite manner possible. They then choose to directly violate or rules and copyrights with a slanted attack on us and our vendors which has since been removed by them. As a result of this action, they are no longer welcome here in any fashion including as regular members.
The Decision:
Many of you will feel that this is an unfair decision and only hurts you, the member. Many asked why this could not be a public vote which has a simple answer. As general public, most will not understand nor greatly care about the long term negative aspects in comparison to getting a better price on your next purchase. As such, there is no way we could get a bias free vote. Even if some did consider it, and make a fair decision, the majority would not. Same goes for the vendors. Ask any vendor if they would like another vendor selling cheaper than them to be removed, and they are going to say yes, right thing or not. Therefor, the decision had to be made by us, the site ownership, alone. We straddle both sides being enthusiasts and consumers as well as seeing it from the industry perspective.
So why are they so bad and why are they any different than something like costco or ebay? Well, for the second issue, see my post a few back on what makes them so different from costco. As for ebay, as many of you know and have had experience with, ebay is a crap shoot. There is a certain level of risk involved that many are not willing to deal with. By being an authorized evoM vendor, we are standing behind them, and stepping in to mediate if there is a problem. The real negative side is not what happens today, but over time. If businesses like this are allowed to operate under our roof, it devalues the product. Profit is not a bad thing, just excessive profit. I don't think anyone here with and inside knowledge to this industry can say there is excessive profit available. Profit is necessary to run a business and provide a quality product and service. The business model for yoparts relies on taking a larger market share and volume to make this profit. This then means that other businesses need to either match their business model, or not sell the product eventually. Another argument I have heard is that this one company could not devalue an industry worth of product, but I disagree. We have a relatively small community here and if one company is given away everything for free to be extreme, it wont be long before no other vendor can sell those parts. It starts small and spreads one community at a time. Once devalued, there are a few problems. Many of the businesses that support our community(and make it possible) and offer great services can no longer afford to operate, and the premium/niche market suffers as well. Many of the premium or specialty items have less markup and cost more to make. Faced with competing products that are now cheaper, sales suffer. While most of these specialty items can continue on being different, there is only such much of a prices differential they can stand.
Now many of you have stated that this only affects other "price ******" or online retailers. Yes, this is the group that it affects most, however to say it does not affect a shop just because they also make money off labor is naive. I know because I have personally run a shop before. Yes, labor is more profitable than parts, but for many, that added profit gained by selling parts makes the difference.
So in summation, they would have a negative impact on the mainstream performance parts industry (both manufacturers and resellers), damage existing vendors of which many provide invaluable services, and hurt the long term longevity of this community. While they may not single handedly cause a a catastrophic downfall, it is our independent opinion that their lasting negative effects outweigh the good. We still retain a great wealth of vendors dedicating to serving you and giving you great prices. This site probably has the greatest selection of vendors of any site out there which is something to be thankful for.
Lastly, I apologize for the novel and hope that you, the members will be able to read this and understand the larger picture.
Evolved Member
iTrader: (4)
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,007
Likes: 0
From: Germantown, Maryland/Carbondale, IL
It is hard to pick a side with this issue. On the one hand my broke college *** cant afford parts and am always looking for a good deal. But then again when buying performance parts I only buy those that I have seen tested in true, which is only vendors like AMS/ buschur/ ETS who go racing.
I personally dont think yoparts would have hurt many of the vendors on here. They would take buisness away from the smaller vendors that sell cosmetic stuff like rexspeed. If I need a performance part, I go for a true company that has raced it and shown the part works. Now when I look for rims/mirrors/ gauges/etc I go to lancershop not AMS or Buschur.
Not sure if this made since haha to tired from COD4 to make complete thoughts
. Either way the EVOM staff made a decision so life on this forum should move on 
I personally dont think yoparts would have hurt many of the vendors on here. They would take buisness away from the smaller vendors that sell cosmetic stuff like rexspeed. If I need a performance part, I go for a true company that has raced it and shown the part works. Now when I look for rims/mirrors/ gauges/etc I go to lancershop not AMS or Buschur.
Not sure if this made since haha to tired from COD4 to make complete thoughts
. Either way the EVOM staff made a decision so life on this forum should move on
Newbie
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
From: NY
I do know what i'm talking about in this matter. Just looking at the big picture here thats all. I did'nt say they sold chinese parts or compare them to ebay. Nobody is wrong for their reasons. I'll just disagree with your outlook and leave it at that.
i see both sides,for example if your shoping for an intercooler and you see the ams for blank amount,go to yoparts and see an arc for not that much more. it becomes an issue then.they are both good,but the arc use to cost a lot more now with yoarts the diference is not that great.while before an arc ic wuld have been out of the question now is not.....just my .02
Newbie
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
From: Ocean City, New Jers
It is hard to pick a side with this issue. On the one hand my broke college *** cant afford parts and am always looking for a good deal. But then again when buying performance parts I only buy those that I have seen tested in true, which is only vendors like AMS/ buschur/ ETS who go racing.
I personally dont think yoparts would have hurt many of the vendors on here. They would take buisness away from the smaller vendors that sell cosmetic stuff like rexspeed. If I need a performance part, I go for a true company that has raced it and shown the part works. Now when I look for rims/mirrors/ gauges/etc I go to lancershop not AMS or Buschur.
Not sure if this made since haha to tired from COD4 to make complete thoughts . Either way the EVOM staff made a decision so life on this forum should move on
I personally dont think yoparts would have hurt many of the vendors on here. They would take buisness away from the smaller vendors that sell cosmetic stuff like rexspeed. If I need a performance part, I go for a true company that has raced it and shown the part works. Now when I look for rims/mirrors/ gauges/etc I go to lancershop not AMS or Buschur.
Not sure if this made since haha to tired from COD4 to make complete thoughts
. Either way the EVOM staff made a decision so life on this forum should move on