Yeah, but that's not the guy that I was addressing. The guy that I was addressing was bench racing and referencing things like the advan 9 vs X thing, which is stupid because the 9 was much more heavily modded and had ayc to boot. Either way man, that's comparing apples to oranges. I don't know of any gutted and fully prepped evo X's out on the road yet.

There hasn't been enough development time on the car. If you took a X and gutted it like that and turned it into a hardcore race car then it would be competitive. I'd say that a comparably modded/gutted/race prepped X that had around 30 hp more to make up for the weight difference would walk all over that 9.

Anyone who says that the X will never be the track car that the 9 is is a fanboy, period. The 9 is better suited to drag racing, but the X is better suited ot road racing. You yourself have even said this many times in the past. You of all people should know that what makes a great track car is the handling, not the straight line power. Not saying that powerisn't important, but races are won in the turns. Give the X the 7 years + of development time that the ct9a platform had and you'll be singing a different tune.

 

These guys (Jeff Jeske, dbsears, etc) are talking about really hardcore track cars and track guys. Look at this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sy1ZGBiZxCk
On the last lap, this dude is freakin' gettin it!

The problem with the X is its weight.

 

^ Excellent video.... I'm willing to bet on that track AYC wouldn't make a bit of difference.

I disagree.... I think the 10 is a better than average track car and a fine choice for a daily driver. I don't think it a better handling platform for track duty. There are some applications where the 10 may help the average yahoo on street tires get around the track faster than they would without the help of the computer.

That being said enthusiasts that track nearly every weekend and run big wide sticky r-compounds do not require this assistance. Instead of the computer helping me through a turn I would rather have less weight and more power.....you see all the added grip from sticky tires tends to slow you down in the straights.

For a daily driver (If you like the look and feel) the 10 may take the win. Hard to argue that having cruise control and navigation aren't a step in the right direction for a commute to work or road trip.

For a track car it suffers from gadget load. I'm not ripping on the 10 now. Hell I'm willing to bet that a fully modded EVO6 could still whoop an EVO9/EVO10. Weight and size do play a major role in track performance.

 

See one problem is I think is how can you state the X is the better track car? It could very well be but it hasn't YET. The VII, VIII, and IX's have won in just about every venue of racing. The X hasn't so to say it is better on the track is quite a fairy tale. Look at the success Nils has...hell he sets faster times on RE01R's than most do on NTO1's

I think you will also see many of the last people people that have commented all have a fair amount of track experience. Little hard to argue when they have been there done that instead of watching youtube and reading motortrend.

Who is going to take there 35k+ and gut it so they can beat a VIII/IX? Not when you can get a IX for 23-24k or an VIII for 18-19k and do a few minor things and it will be very competitive. I guarantee if somebody is going to buy an evo for a track car it won't be the X unless they have alot of $$$ When you start throwing alot of mods in the differences aren't going to justify the 15k extra that it will cost for the X.

Don't take this as me "hating" on the X because I own a IX. Truth is I probably wont even own a mitsubishi soon. I hope the X does well...especially the MR. For the small amount of time it has been out it has done wonderful. But its sure not the end all track car.

 

Again, agree 100%.

 

We keep talking about weight, but the new GTR is laying down the law on everthing and it weighs a ton. Its a porker and laying down ridiculous numbers because of all the gadgets in it. I think the X will be the same. Mod the hell out of it, get as much power as you can out of it with some handling tweaks and Im would bet alot of money it will be hell on wheels at the track cause of all the fancy electronics. F1 guys are best drivers in the world and they have every fancy traction control/handling/braking gizmo/transmission out there to give them an advantage. It doesnt make it more or less of a drivers car, it makes it a faster car around the track period. I dont know about you but I just want to go faster. Give the X as long as the IX has had in developement and Im willing gaurentee the IX will be eating the Xs dust. Im not a fan boy, but the vette crowd said the same thing when the current generation vette came out. It happens to every car. I still love the IX, but in a couple of years it will obselete.



Im waiting for the Flaming to begin on this one lol.

 

A prepped R34 will annhiliate an R35. Same stuff we're talking about above.

 

^ I agree 100%......

Also most Vette trackers that I speak with prefer the C5 ZO6 to the C6 ZO6. Some have purchased the new sold it and gone back to the old.

 

Many of the older cars are always faster and make better track cars. I think alot of people in here cannot understand as they believe what they see on youtube as gospel. Heres a few examples:

BMW: e36 > e46
Chevrolet: c5 > c6
Honda: 5th gen > 6th or 7th gen
Acura: Integra > RSX
Evo: VI > any evo
Porsche: older 911

Those are just a few examples off the top of my head. This is again for track prepped car not OEM from the factory. Almost every one of those is faster than their newer counterpart.

Weight is a much bigger factor than electronics. Hell their are 5th gen hatches that will whoop 98% of the evos on this forum just from the simple fact of being 1900lbs but are inferior FWD and nowhere near the chassis.

I had a Probe GT that I passed more than a couple evos in. It only had 200hp but weight 2500lbs and just ran mediocre suspension/tires. When I raced with the Alfa club most the cars their were older 911's, E36's, C5's and I have yet to see any new Z06 or 997 outrun those.

When it comes down to R compounds, Slicks, prepped and even caged cars. The AYC etc will do more harm then good. For the average person that tracks the car stock it will work wonders. It needs it to overcome the added weight and bodyroll.

I will almost put money on when they start heavily tracking X's at a competitive level I suspect they will either disable the AYC or heavily reprogram it. Like Jeff said though for the average Joe at full weight and street tires it will help.

 

I agree that weight is more important than people realize. For reference though, I have a decent amount of track experience, so I am no noob that bench races and bases everything that I say off of videos that I watch like you have implied. I am most likely no where near as talented or experienced of a driver as jeff jesky and some of these super hardcore track guys because I can't afford to go to the track 15 times a year and buy new tires every week, but that doesn't mean that I don't have a valid opinion based on experience.

I disagree that AYC will do more harm than good once the car is highly modified, as even many pro racers keep it in their highly prepped evos as long as it's not forbidden in the competition rules, which is usually the reason for taking it off. I will agree that it's benefits will be reduced once the car has the understeer tuned out via suspension/chassis tuning, but it would never be a hindrance. My comments are this, that on a moderately tuned setup that the X's better chassis and more advanced AWD system with AYC will help it to be competitive with the 8s and 9s, especially considering that it can take a wider wheel and tire combo than the 8s and 9s can without fender rolling.

This keeps the handling edge in the X's favor. However, once the two are fully race prepped and turned into dedicated track cars that are all but undriveable on the street, with fully race spec suspension, rolled fenders (where fender-well limitations don't regulate tire and wheel size), gutted interiors, and slicks that the X won't be able to beat the 9 because it's just heavier. At that point the X's yaw control certainly won't hurt, but it won't really help because what it's designed to correct won't be a problem anymore. Evos this highly modified represent a super small percentage of the evo population though, and most people that track their evos are going to be street trim/non gutted and non fender-rolled daily driven/ weekend warriors with light to moderate suspension and engine mods though, and in these circumstances the X will be competitive.

 

A good watch .....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FYrMeBeBo8

You should like the ending line.....

 

^ Right, I was thinking the same thing when I watched that yesterday. At least I beleive there's one thing all VIII, IX, and X owner's can agree on... The fact that no matter what evo trim was pitted against an STI, the Evo has always come out on top.

 

Poor STI ...little unfair to pit the STI against the FQ360 but hey...still a better car. Now it would be nice to see an FQ360 model in the MR. I think that would be the holey grail of all around performance and styling.

 

Okay then...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0beb7gopeP0

 

An older 911 makes a better track car? Are you on crack? The only reason they may make a better track car is the vast availability of parts and the relative cost.