really considering a 2016 STI
Aug 21, 2015, 04:51 PM
#46
EvoM Guru
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Don't kid yourself, the X still pushes, just not as bad in stock form. With what my car has done now, it has easily surpassed a similarly equipped X..
Aug 21, 2015, 10:18 PM
#47
I had a IX, then a Boss (what a ****show that was), and now have an Sti. I bought the Sti bc my Boss broke down (again) in front of the Subaru dealer on what happened to be the day the 15 Sti's arrived. Bought it on a whim, because I just wanted the other car gone. Had I been thinking clearly, I would have sold the Boss and waited for the new motor (I just don't like the X, and at this point I don't think I'll ever own another Ford). Subaru said that every car they sell here will have DI by the end of 2016, so unless they lied the 17s should have a new motor.
The EJ is a piece of ****. Spools late and slow, runs out of steam fast, knocks all the time on stock tune (only on shifts with a tune, so far, which might be phantom knock), heat soaks bad and the motor overheats if ambient is over 100 even if you are on the highway, and the turkey gobble exhaust has not grown on me at all.
I like just about everything else about the car, even the looks though I'm going to get rid of the wing. I liked the IX wing, but it doesn't go well with the Sti. Interior is good enough, shifts well, brakes are OK though not as solid as the IX, and I like the way it handles better than the IX, though the IX had better turn in. Sti feels a little rubbery on turn in, but is even easier to control than the IX and if you set the center diff one click off locked then the rear will move around a lot but totally under control. I was running faster laps in full unlock (as most people recommend) but it was a lot more fun almost locked. And then I shredded my rear tire and had to limp home
Fronts were still in good shape, the rears were sliding a lot so ate the tires.
Around town, it is good except for the motor. It is gutless off boost even compared to the IX, and it spools later. Really sucks in traffic.
So yeah, wait for the DI motor or the Ford. I won't buy the Ford, but I had really bad experience with them. Everyone I know with Focii like them a lot.
The EJ is a piece of ****. Spools late and slow, runs out of steam fast, knocks all the time on stock tune (only on shifts with a tune, so far, which might be phantom knock), heat soaks bad and the motor overheats if ambient is over 100 even if you are on the highway, and the turkey gobble exhaust has not grown on me at all.
I like just about everything else about the car, even the looks though I'm going to get rid of the wing. I liked the IX wing, but it doesn't go well with the Sti. Interior is good enough, shifts well, brakes are OK though not as solid as the IX, and I like the way it handles better than the IX, though the IX had better turn in. Sti feels a little rubbery on turn in, but is even easier to control than the IX and if you set the center diff one click off locked then the rear will move around a lot but totally under control. I was running faster laps in full unlock (as most people recommend) but it was a lot more fun almost locked. And then I shredded my rear tire and had to limp home
Fronts were still in good shape, the rears were sliding a lot so ate the tires.Around town, it is good except for the motor. It is gutless off boost even compared to the IX, and it spools later. Really sucks in traffic.
So yeah, wait for the DI motor or the Ford. I won't buy the Ford, but I had really bad experience with them. Everyone I know with Focii like them a lot.
Aug 22, 2015, 11:51 AM
#48
i've always been told the Sti is a torque monster, compared to Evos. half a liter more displacement and a small turbo (reason for it dying up top) makes lots of torque. i've never seen anyone complain about lag with the Subaru (though i'm not sure a Subaru owner would; they are very loyal customers). it's interesting to hear something different.
Aug 22, 2015, 02:51 PM
#49
The X pushes much less, but I'm sure lots of that is the yaw controller. I'd argue on the similarly equipped department too, but we're probably splitting hairs at that point. You can put 265 wide tires under an X with 9.5" wheels before even looking at rear fender rolling.
Aug 24, 2015, 10:11 AM
#51
I had a IX, then a Boss (what a ****show that was), and now have an Sti. I bought the Sti bc my Boss broke down (again) in front of the Subaru dealer on what happened to be the day the 15 Sti's arrived. Bought it on a whim, because I just wanted the other car gone. Had I been thinking clearly, I would have sold the Boss and waited for the new motor (I just don't like the X, and at this point I don't think I'll ever own another Ford). Subaru said that every car they sell here will have DI by the end of 2016, so unless they lied the 17s should have a new motor.
Aug 29, 2015, 03:30 AM
#54
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The 4663 evo's feel like ****. Their to raw for dd. I had 9 gsr, 9 se, and a 9 mr. All felt like junk as a dd. X drives, and feels much better as a dd, and going fast. And is still fun.
Sep 1, 2015, 08:32 PM
#57
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1. The community is ****. No really, I mean the people are idiots, don't really have much knowledge of what they have, and are cheaper than the worst of the Honda communities from the 00's
2. EJ's are garbage. No really, they're garbage. They don't breathe well, even with full head work and 1mm over valves, they are extremely hard on headstuds and rod bearings due to their design and ignition pattern, and they are not a reliable engine. Even if you throw everything at it, it will still blow up and cost you an extreme quantity of money. The difference between a "fully built ej" and a "mildly built ej" is what turbo is on the damn thing. There is no "Oh just rods and pistons". You need sleeves. You need headwork because it can't breathe. Boom $10000 dollars later and you have a half decent block that will still blow up because of the poor design.
- look at the lengths that shops will go to keep the heads on, 1/2 inch headstuds with orings from Outfront Motorsports
- The rod ratio is extremely hard on bearings. If you stroke the engine, you're asking for a spun bearing
- Want to go over 25 psi? You are going to sleeve or close deck your block.
- AVCS doesn't help much, with most aftermarket cams you're limited to under 15 degrees of total control. Meaning 7 degrees advance or retard
- They're always on the cusp of knocking. Go look at the timing map of one and compare to a normal engine. Because of the design, they have to run extreme advance to make any power, which is another reason why the head studs are such an issue
3. The exhaust manifolds are garbage. An 8473 spools at 4k on an Evo. Where do you think it spools on a STI? Try 5k. Why? Because the exhaust manifold is 4' of piping. Unless you do a lowmount, which requires an oil scavenge pump, you're wasting your time. This combined with how badly they breath means that they don't ever make power.
4. The community is garbage. I have to bring this up again, because I still can't get over how uneducated and boy ricer it is. Its primarily a lack of education, where as people here might understand what the pros and cons of a 4032 and 2618 piston might be, there is no concept that there is different alloys there. Its just dawg is that an i beam or h beam?
Source: I have a built Subaru. I regret it every day. My friends have built Subarus, they regret it every day. Acquaintances who have built Subarus are selling them, because its not feasible to maintain them at the tune to $10k a built block for the rate that they eat them when you beat on them. Nobody I know other than shops that can bankroll races Subarus vs all the privateers that race Evos.
2. EJ's are garbage. No really, they're garbage. They don't breathe well, even with full head work and 1mm over valves, they are extremely hard on headstuds and rod bearings due to their design and ignition pattern, and they are not a reliable engine. Even if you throw everything at it, it will still blow up and cost you an extreme quantity of money. The difference between a "fully built ej" and a "mildly built ej" is what turbo is on the damn thing. There is no "Oh just rods and pistons". You need sleeves. You need headwork because it can't breathe. Boom $10000 dollars later and you have a half decent block that will still blow up because of the poor design.
- look at the lengths that shops will go to keep the heads on, 1/2 inch headstuds with orings from Outfront Motorsports
- The rod ratio is extremely hard on bearings. If you stroke the engine, you're asking for a spun bearing
- Want to go over 25 psi? You are going to sleeve or close deck your block.
- AVCS doesn't help much, with most aftermarket cams you're limited to under 15 degrees of total control. Meaning 7 degrees advance or retard
- They're always on the cusp of knocking. Go look at the timing map of one and compare to a normal engine. Because of the design, they have to run extreme advance to make any power, which is another reason why the head studs are such an issue
3. The exhaust manifolds are garbage. An 8473 spools at 4k on an Evo. Where do you think it spools on a STI? Try 5k. Why? Because the exhaust manifold is 4' of piping. Unless you do a lowmount, which requires an oil scavenge pump, you're wasting your time. This combined with how badly they breath means that they don't ever make power.
4. The community is garbage. I have to bring this up again, because I still can't get over how uneducated and boy ricer it is. Its primarily a lack of education, where as people here might understand what the pros and cons of a 4032 and 2618 piston might be, there is no concept that there is different alloys there. Its just dawg is that an i beam or h beam?
Source: I have a built Subaru. I regret it every day. My friends have built Subarus, they regret it every day. Acquaintances who have built Subarus are selling them, because its not feasible to maintain them at the tune to $10k a built block for the rate that they eat them when you beat on them. Nobody I know other than shops that can bankroll races Subarus vs all the privateers that race Evos.
Sep 2, 2015, 02:56 AM
#58
1. The community is ****. No really, I mean the people are idiots, don't really have much knowledge of what they have, and are cheaper than the worst of the Honda communities from the 00's
2. EJ's are garbage. No really, they're garbage. They don't breathe well, even with full head work and 1mm over valves, they are extremely hard on headstuds and rod bearings due to their design and ignition pattern, and they are not a reliable engine. Even if you throw everything at it, it will still blow up and cost you an extreme quantity of money. The difference between a "fully built ej" and a "mildly built ej" is what turbo is on the damn thing. There is no "Oh just rods and pistons". You need sleeves. You need headwork because it can't breathe. Boom $10000 dollars later and you have a half decent block that will still blow up because of the poor design.
- look at the lengths that shops will go to keep the heads on, 1/2 inch headstuds with orings from Outfront Motorsports
- The rod ratio is extremely hard on bearings. If you stroke the engine, you're asking for a spun bearing
- Want to go over 25 psi? You are going to sleeve or close deck your block.
- AVCS doesn't help much, with most aftermarket cams you're limited to under 15 degrees of total control. Meaning 7 degrees advance or retard
- They're always on the cusp of knocking. Go look at the timing map of one and compare to a normal engine. Because of the design, they have to run extreme advance to make any power, which is another reason why the head studs are such an issue
3. The exhaust manifolds are garbage. An 8473 spools at 4k on an Evo. Where do you think it spools on a STI? Try 5k. Why? Because the exhaust manifold is 4' of piping. Unless you do a lowmount, which requires an oil scavenge pump, you're wasting your time. This combined with how badly they breath means that they don't ever make power.
4. The community is garbage. I have to bring this up again, because I still can't get over how uneducated and boy ricer it is. Its primarily a lack of education, where as people here might understand what the pros and cons of a 4032 and 2618 piston might be, there is no concept that there is different alloys there. Its just dawg is that an i beam or h beam?
Source: I have a built Subaru. I regret it every day. My friends have built Subarus, they regret it every day. Acquaintances who have built Subarus are selling them, because its not feasible to maintain them at the tune to $10k a built block for the rate that they eat them when you beat on them. Nobody I know other than shops that can bankroll races Subarus vs all the privateers that race Evos.
2. EJ's are garbage. No really, they're garbage. They don't breathe well, even with full head work and 1mm over valves, they are extremely hard on headstuds and rod bearings due to their design and ignition pattern, and they are not a reliable engine. Even if you throw everything at it, it will still blow up and cost you an extreme quantity of money. The difference between a "fully built ej" and a "mildly built ej" is what turbo is on the damn thing. There is no "Oh just rods and pistons". You need sleeves. You need headwork because it can't breathe. Boom $10000 dollars later and you have a half decent block that will still blow up because of the poor design.
- look at the lengths that shops will go to keep the heads on, 1/2 inch headstuds with orings from Outfront Motorsports
- The rod ratio is extremely hard on bearings. If you stroke the engine, you're asking for a spun bearing
- Want to go over 25 psi? You are going to sleeve or close deck your block.
- AVCS doesn't help much, with most aftermarket cams you're limited to under 15 degrees of total control. Meaning 7 degrees advance or retard
- They're always on the cusp of knocking. Go look at the timing map of one and compare to a normal engine. Because of the design, they have to run extreme advance to make any power, which is another reason why the head studs are such an issue
3. The exhaust manifolds are garbage. An 8473 spools at 4k on an Evo. Where do you think it spools on a STI? Try 5k. Why? Because the exhaust manifold is 4' of piping. Unless you do a lowmount, which requires an oil scavenge pump, you're wasting your time. This combined with how badly they breath means that they don't ever make power.
4. The community is garbage. I have to bring this up again, because I still can't get over how uneducated and boy ricer it is. Its primarily a lack of education, where as people here might understand what the pros and cons of a 4032 and 2618 piston might be, there is no concept that there is different alloys there. Its just dawg is that an i beam or h beam?
Source: I have a built Subaru. I regret it every day. My friends have built Subarus, they regret it every day. Acquaintances who have built Subarus are selling them, because its not feasible to maintain them at the tune to $10k a built block for the rate that they eat them when you beat on them. Nobody I know other than shops that can bankroll races Subarus vs all the privateers that race Evos.
i know one guy that races one. i'm not sure how many engines he's gone through.
i know a guy that Sti swapped is bug eye. he's on at least his third engine.
they use weird vocabulary ("stage" and "protune"), and swear their cars are fast (some aren't really bad at all, to tell the truth... but only one or two that i know of personally).
i will say they are more enjoyable to hang around with. yeah, they love their cars and think they are the best things ever built, but don't we all? there is MUCH less **** talking and everyone pretty much gets a long and support each other. the Evo community isn't so much that. and it's getting worse.
i'm speaking very generally and only of MY experience. others may differ. also, this doesn't apply to ALL suby owners, of course.
Sep 2, 2015, 08:59 AM
#59
1. The community is ****. No really, I mean the people are idiots, don't really have much knowledge of what they have, and are cheaper than the worst of the Honda communities from the 00's
2. EJ's are garbage. No really, they're garbage. They don't breathe well, even with full head work and 1mm over valves, they are extremely hard on headstuds and rod bearings due to their design and ignition pattern, and they are not a reliable engine. Even if you throw everything at it, it will still blow up and cost you an extreme quantity of money. The difference between a "fully built ej" and a "mildly built ej" is what turbo is on the damn thing. There is no "Oh just rods and pistons". You need sleeves. You need headwork because it can't breathe. Boom $10000 dollars later and you have a half decent block that will still blow up because of the poor design.
- look at the lengths that shops will go to keep the heads on, 1/2 inch headstuds with orings from Outfront Motorsports
- The rod ratio is extremely hard on bearings. If you stroke the engine, you're asking for a spun bearing
- Want to go over 25 psi? You are going to sleeve or close deck your block.
- AVCS doesn't help much, with most aftermarket cams you're limited to under 15 degrees of total control. Meaning 7 degrees advance or retard
- They're always on the cusp of knocking. Go look at the timing map of one and compare to a normal engine. Because of the design, they have to run extreme advance to make any power, which is another reason why the head studs are such an issue
3. The exhaust manifolds are garbage. An 8473 spools at 4k on an Evo. Where do you think it spools on a STI? Try 5k. Why? Because the exhaust manifold is 4' of piping. Unless you do a lowmount, which requires an oil scavenge pump, you're wasting your time. This combined with how badly they breath means that they don't ever make power.
4. The community is garbage. I have to bring this up again, because I still can't get over how uneducated and boy ricer it is. Its primarily a lack of education, where as people here might understand what the pros and cons of a 4032 and 2618 piston might be, there is no concept that there is different alloys there. Its just dawg is that an i beam or h beam?
Source: I have a built Subaru. I regret it every day. My friends have built Subarus, they regret it every day. Acquaintances who have built Subarus are selling them, because its not feasible to maintain them at the tune to $10k a built block for the rate that they eat them when you beat on them. Nobody I know other than shops that can bankroll races Subarus vs all the privateers that race Evos.
2. EJ's are garbage. No really, they're garbage. They don't breathe well, even with full head work and 1mm over valves, they are extremely hard on headstuds and rod bearings due to their design and ignition pattern, and they are not a reliable engine. Even if you throw everything at it, it will still blow up and cost you an extreme quantity of money. The difference between a "fully built ej" and a "mildly built ej" is what turbo is on the damn thing. There is no "Oh just rods and pistons". You need sleeves. You need headwork because it can't breathe. Boom $10000 dollars later and you have a half decent block that will still blow up because of the poor design.
- look at the lengths that shops will go to keep the heads on, 1/2 inch headstuds with orings from Outfront Motorsports
- The rod ratio is extremely hard on bearings. If you stroke the engine, you're asking for a spun bearing
- Want to go over 25 psi? You are going to sleeve or close deck your block.
- AVCS doesn't help much, with most aftermarket cams you're limited to under 15 degrees of total control. Meaning 7 degrees advance or retard
- They're always on the cusp of knocking. Go look at the timing map of one and compare to a normal engine. Because of the design, they have to run extreme advance to make any power, which is another reason why the head studs are such an issue
3. The exhaust manifolds are garbage. An 8473 spools at 4k on an Evo. Where do you think it spools on a STI? Try 5k. Why? Because the exhaust manifold is 4' of piping. Unless you do a lowmount, which requires an oil scavenge pump, you're wasting your time. This combined with how badly they breath means that they don't ever make power.
4. The community is garbage. I have to bring this up again, because I still can't get over how uneducated and boy ricer it is. Its primarily a lack of education, where as people here might understand what the pros and cons of a 4032 and 2618 piston might be, there is no concept that there is different alloys there. Its just dawg is that an i beam or h beam?
Source: I have a built Subaru. I regret it every day. My friends have built Subarus, they regret it every day. Acquaintances who have built Subarus are selling them, because its not feasible to maintain them at the tune to $10k a built block for the rate that they eat them when you beat on them. Nobody I know other than shops that can bankroll races Subarus vs all the privateers that race Evos.
2. I wouldn't call them garbage, they make good power at the stage 2, simple bolt-on stage, but past that, they're time bombs. You have to replace a significant amount of factory parts to make an EJ motor make lots of power reliably.
3. Agreed. Given the size of the engine and the turbo, spool is pretty bad.
4. Not really. There are good Subaru communities, and bad Subaru communities. There are good Evo communities, and bad Mitsubishi communities. Locally, the Subaru community is good. At the time I was a member of the local Mitsubishi community, it was ****. It was filled with the very people you complain of.
Sep 2, 2015, 11:20 AM
#60
Subarus are terrible. Everything is built cheaper and cheaper over the years and i can't imagine a 2016. The subjective is bad also in terms of "feel" steering, throttle, and etc. Only the interior is better. There is so many factors to make a great car. Laptime is only a small portion of the equation.
Go with a modern car such as the Golf R/Focus RS. I'm personally getting a final edition since i feel the evo will be a classic. Good steering geometry, rigidity, materials (not interior), good quality shocks and brakes. Flaws are, econobox NVH and interior quality, turning radius, front engine effect (hard on front wheels/ push etc..).
Go with a modern car such as the Golf R/Focus RS. I'm personally getting a final edition since i feel the evo will be a classic. Good steering geometry, rigidity, materials (not interior), good quality shocks and brakes. Flaws are, econobox NVH and interior quality, turning radius, front engine effect (hard on front wheels/ push etc..).