I tune a bunch of World Challenge cars (Audis, M3s, etc,.) which run Motec systems. How is it any more complicated than other stand-alones as far as basic fuel and ignition tuning is concerned? It does not seem to be any harder to cal than a speed-pro or a haltec. The results, however, are usually more consistent and stable. Even the DOS based version of the Motec software is easy to use.

shiv

 

Good point

I personally like the HKS unit myself

 

Tuning the basic fuel and ignition isn't any different, but to get the car to run in the first place takes time due to its configurability. To get it to run you have to figure out the Crip, injector current & battery comp, calibrate the stock water and air temp sensors, calibrate the speed sensor, adjust ref and sync voltages, dwell, rise or fall triggers. And after all that's done... the car still isn't ready to move because it doesn't come with a basemap. That's what I meant by being complicated, but that's still only the beginning.

Where as other less configurable EFI systems require you to use GM sensors, and just plain don't have those other features user adjustable.

Also, Speed Pro is a lot easier to calibrate... The map trace overlay feature makes is possible to dial in the a/f real quick.

 

Configuring sensors/crank trigger input, etc,. from scratch is the most irritating part of any stand-alone install. It is almost completely dependant upon whether you have a basemap to start from. And that is completely dependant upon whether you have already mapped a similar application before (or know someone who has). But that's, as far as I can tell, is not a reflection upon the ECU system. Instead, it's a reflection upon the guy tuning it. But I think we're getting further and further away from the topic at hand which is EVO specific.

That said, I know of a LOT more EVO owners who have gone from stand-alone to XEDE than the otherway around Just did another one today, in fact... If you haven't used one, I recommend doing so. Until then, you're basing your opinions upon inaccurate and biased data.

Shiv

 

I think anyone that would go from a a standalone to back to an XEDE or any other piggyback style computer shows the owner of the car had a lack of tuning ability or the shop he got it from couldn't or wouldn't help him out.

As for the AEM EMS not being used by many professional race teams I would agree that on a whole the EMS is not the most popular but then again it is also one of the newest. I think in it's element (import world) you will find it is one of the most used overall with some of the best results. Look at some of the Supra's, DSM's and EVO's that run it.

No matter what you put in the car it is only going to be as good as the tuner.

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com

 

I think that only a tuning shop that had to rely on another "tuner" for tuning because their own in-house tuner quit would make such a statement. More amusing is that replacement "tuner" having to rely on yet another tuner to get his own stand-alone ECU tuned.

Shiv

 

Not sure what you are implying but from the gay eye roll I am going to assume you are directing that at me. So I will address it. I don't rely on any other tuner since our "in-house" tuner quit, I do all the tuning and have been since before he quit. The last sentence is even more confusing and makes me think you aren't referring to me at all.

Please be more specific if you are going to point fingers at something.

My point was I think it is rediculous to go from a stand alone that you already bought back to some type of piggy back system.

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com

 

Uh... okay <- "gay" winky and thumbs up face

And if you want to be technically specific with regards to ECU tuning, I'm up for it. We can put cheap shots on hold and let the readers decide for themselves. My only request is that this discussion be between you and myself. We can even start another thread if you'd like. Are you up for it?

Shiv

 

Look Shiv, I started out by making the statement that I thought it was dumb to go from standalone back to piggy back. You took it the wrong way, wasn't pointing any fingers at you trying to steer the guy wrong or anything like that. Then you seemed to be trying to imply something, not sure what it was, I was trying to find out.

I don't have any desire to enter into any discussion with you, just wanted to know what you were trying to say, that's it. What's your problem? I also did not put in any cheap shots, that was you as far as I can tell.

Want to be more specific now or not?

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com

 

Shiv, a post like this is exactly why some people will never do business with you...

For your own sake and the board's, please be professional. So far this has been a good informative thread.

 

And why many have, will, and continue to do so...

 

Ok... I'll try to make this simple. Why is it dumb to go from a stand-alone to an XEDE? You make statements like this without ever elaborating. That's my problem.

Shiv

 

So Shiv is suggesting that Dave relies on Big Al for tuning and finds it ironic that Big Al had Martin tune his EMS? Is that what this is about? I don't really give a crap. Surely this can be taken offline...

 

Just for references the EMS powers, I believe, 4 out of the 5 fastest imports in the world. Although you would be suprised to find out that the XEDE is going to be used on the new C6-R LeMans racecar.

I contemplated switching to a piggy-back from the EMS but decided not to because the EMS is a better system and I just needed to get someone to tune the cold-start it since the weather is now 20-40 degrees. The main downside is if you live in cold weather you will probably need to take a day and get it retuned. The only concievable reason to switch back is if you need OBD2 functioning.

Now, the best option is a reflash for those running moderate boost levels. If your going to spend over $1000 dollars on a piggy-back just purchase the EMS.

Shiv keeps referencing to this GT35R he tuned which he claimed he got identical results as AMS, that car ran 122MPH with a good 60 foot. So you can decide for yourself.

And more importantly, are you going to get unbiased advice from TurboXS or Shiv? Or Al (although he's expanding)? Don't you think profit margins has something to do with their recommendations?


Oh, and David tuned my EMS btw and he tuned it the same week that the person who quit left. And he was talking to me on the phone while he was out tuning it. So what are you referencing to Shiv? And my car still runs, unlike the last guy who tuned it.

 

Still waiting for Dave's reponse....

shiv