Product Release: Grimmspeed Electronic Boost Control Solenoid For EVO!
Its interesting to see how the product is advertised to be superior. A faster response time (i.e., less time for the valve to open) is always a good thing but there are diminishing returns. The GM BCS I tested was around 6 ms, and the MAC valve was around 4 ms. However, since both have fast response times relative to the duty cycle period of the Evo (~50 ms), its kind of moot whether it takes 4 ms or 6 ms. With 3-port solenoids, greater flow is good only up to a point for boost control. If the flow too high, the upper range of usable duty cycle begins to drop (e.g., 80% duty can give nearly the same response as 100% duty with a really high flowing solenoid). A very high flow rate BCS also causes greater pressure variations in the WGA as the solenoid is cycled open and shut. This is what happened with the MAC solenoid that I tested.
As long as the Grimspeed actually did some performance testing and realized that too much flow is bad, it will be a fine solenoid, especially since the mounting and electrical connection are plug-n-play. The boost lines still have to be completely redone though. It would be great to see all the needed boost hoses (good quality stuff) and hose clips included with the Grimspeed. That would make it a true plug-n-play solution that would be very worth of purchase if the performance is good.
As long as the Grimspeed actually did some performance testing and realized that too much flow is bad, it will be a fine solenoid, especially since the mounting and electrical connection are plug-n-play. The boost lines still have to be completely redone though. It would be great to see all the needed boost hoses (good quality stuff) and hose clips included with the Grimspeed. That would make it a true plug-n-play solution that would be very worth of purchase if the performance is good.
As a side note, I couldn't help but notice the RS200 in your signature. I am a huge euro ford guy and am currently building a 1986 3-door Sierra RS Cosworth. I have always been extremely impressed with the RS200!
-Chad
Last edited by GrimmSpeed; Sep 11, 2009 at 12:58 PM.
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You really have a good understanding of the system (more so than most) and I can appreciate that. I understand your point that having too much flow isn't always the best thing because the only input to the boost control solenoid is a frequency that pulses the solenoid and as you pointed out you can get oscillations in your boost setting if it were to flow too much. But keep in mind that we did not double or triple the flow. We did not notice a detrimental ammount of boost oscillation but we found a benefit to the approximately 10% increase in flow in the form of faster response and quicker control especially with external wastegates. We have 1300+ of these things out there in the Subaru world with no complaints and lots of praise.
As a side note, I couldn't help but notice the RS200 in your signature. I am a huge euro ford guy and am currently building a 1986 3-door Sierra RS Cosworth. I have always been extremely impressed with the RS200!
-Chad
As a side note, I couldn't help but notice the RS200 in your signature. I am a huge euro ford guy and am currently building a 1986 3-door Sierra RS Cosworth. I have always been extremely impressed with the RS200!
-Chad
Yeah, the RS200 is a pretty cool car (the current WRC Fords are also sweet machines). Not only is the car cool, but those were the wild days of WRC when HP levels were not yet governed. The guys who drove those cars were nuts.
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Oh man I have my notebook out right now this looks like this will be the new 3 port solenoid of choice. I have time to make my decision so I'm just waiting for more data on use of the solenoid.
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I kinda doubt there will ever be a definitive comparison between the GM and the Grimmspeed. The most reasonable comment I've seen so far is Petey Turbo's.
I have the GM BCS with the Plug and Play mod and ROOKHOE is a local buddy who just got this unit. We will have to leave our settings the same and just swap BCS's one day soon so we can get some definitive results.
.
But this is a boost control solenoid and not a standalone electronic boost controller. It still requires changes to the ECU, although fairly straightforward, not required for a full electronic boost controller.
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I'll post a full review, but let me share my experience from today. Tuning done by CAMTuning in New Mexico.
A local customer just picked up an EVO 9 with a turbo back exhaust. The previous owner already had an accessport and it was only making 17psi on the stage 2 map. I installed the Grimmspeed BCS (in the rain no less). It took about 15 minutes including the time to remove and reinstall the stock airbox. The fit is stock and having the same plug as the factory bcs is convenient. Now to the tune. I set WGDC to 0% and did a pull. It made ~12psi. I set it to 30% across the board and made 16psi. Within the next 3 pulls I had it dialed in perfectly hitting 20psi and 22.5psi. I have tuned a lot of EVOs with MBC's but never a solenoid. I probably tune 20 Subarus for every EVO I tune. I have tuned dozens of 3 port solenoids on Subarus so I'm pretty familiar with them. Tuning this EVO was much easier than setting up a Subaru with a 3 port. The perfect boost curve speaks for itself.
Not bad for an hour on the dyno. Thanks to Justin at Grimmspeed for sending the solenoid for testing.
A local customer just picked up an EVO 9 with a turbo back exhaust. The previous owner already had an accessport and it was only making 17psi on the stage 2 map. I installed the Grimmspeed BCS (in the rain no less). It took about 15 minutes including the time to remove and reinstall the stock airbox. The fit is stock and having the same plug as the factory bcs is convenient. Now to the tune. I set WGDC to 0% and did a pull. It made ~12psi. I set it to 30% across the board and made 16psi. Within the next 3 pulls I had it dialed in perfectly hitting 20psi and 22.5psi. I have tuned a lot of EVOs with MBC's but never a solenoid. I probably tune 20 Subarus for every EVO I tune. I have tuned dozens of 3 port solenoids on Subarus so I'm pretty familiar with them. Tuning this EVO was much easier than setting up a Subaru with a 3 port. The perfect boost curve speaks for itself.
Not bad for an hour on the dyno. Thanks to Justin at Grimmspeed for sending the solenoid for testing.
Last edited by 06rexwagon; Sep 14, 2009 at 09:06 PM.
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^ wow that looks very nice and smooth.....seems to be fairly simple and straight forward. It looks like this will be my 3 port or choice.
I'll post a full review, but let me share my experience from today. Tuning done by CAMTuning in New Mexico.
A local customer just picked up an EVO 9 with a turbo back exhaust. The previous owner already had an accessport and it was only making 17psi on the stage 2 map. I installed the Grimmspeed BCS (in the rain no less). It took about 15 minutes including the time to remove and reinstall the stock airbox. The fit is stock and having the same plug as the factory bcs is convenient. Now to the tune. I set WGDC to 0% and did a pull. It made ~12psi. I set it to 30% across the board and made 16psi. Within the next 3 pulls I had it dialed in perfectly hitting 20psi and 22.5psi. I have tuned a lot of EVOs with MBC's but never a solenoid. I probably tune 20 Subarus for every EVO I tune. I have tuned dozens of 3 port solenoids on Subarus so I'm pretty familiar with them. Tuning this EVO was much easier than setting up a Subaru with a 3 port. The perfect boost curve speaks for itself.
Not bad for an hour on the dyno. Thanks to Justin at Grimmspeed for sending the solenoid for testing.
A local customer just picked up an EVO 9 with a turbo back exhaust. The previous owner already had an accessport and it was only making 17psi on the stage 2 map. I installed the Grimmspeed BCS (in the rain no less). It took about 15 minutes including the time to remove and reinstall the stock airbox. The fit is stock and having the same plug as the factory bcs is convenient. Now to the tune. I set WGDC to 0% and did a pull. It made ~12psi. I set it to 30% across the board and made 16psi. Within the next 3 pulls I had it dialed in perfectly hitting 20psi and 22.5psi. I have tuned a lot of EVOs with MBC's but never a solenoid. I probably tune 20 Subarus for every EVO I tune. I have tuned dozens of 3 port solenoids on Subarus so I'm pretty familiar with them. Tuning this EVO was much easier than setting up a Subaru with a 3 port. The perfect boost curve speaks for itself.
Not bad for an hour on the dyno. Thanks to Justin at Grimmspeed for sending the solenoid for testing.
You're right, it is. That's one of the bad things about living at 5400 ft and having atmospheric pressure of 11.8-12psi. Even a 60lb/min turbo has a hard time holding a flat boost curve here. I've tuned a lot at sea level and the difference is incredible when it comes to boost taper. Even a manual boost controller won't make it hold more boost to redline.
