Stage 2 Turbokit v500
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From: Burbank
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu
Just looked at some dyno results today on our dyno computer at the shop. Compared to the ATP 30R kit, our 30R Stg2 kit has a 200ft-lb advantage at 3800rpm and a 50whp advantage at 7000RPM, on race gas. Even on pump gas, the "sweet spot" on the Stg 2 kit is much wider. Most of this has to do with the ATP hotside which gives up efficiency when it comes to spoolup and top end power. This has been proven over and over again on many different cars.
Shiv
Shiv
Originally Posted by Jaylenospoolboy
It made 373 in 100 degree weather on 91 I think with 2 octane points and a little cool air and you'd be very close to 400.
Why would you want to stroke your motor and then use a 3071? It spools fast on a stock block and can rev to 8k if you want it to. Did you mean a 35R?
Why would you want to stroke your motor and then use a 3071? It spools fast on a stock block and can rev to 8k if you want it to. Did you mean a 35R?
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From: Burbank
Originally Posted by statix
I imagine he's thinking the same thing I did, with a stroker and a 3071 you would have a very fun street/track car with great power and very quick spool..
If a 3071 hit's peak boost by 4500 rpm on a stock block, it 's probably good to just a little over 8000 rpm then would fall off.
A stroker might lower peak boost to 3500 RPM. A peak operating range of more than 4000 rpm is very optomistic, but I'm no expert.
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From: Work - New York, Alaska, Mexico or the Caribbean. -Home - Tx Hill Country
Originally Posted by meisnerboy
makes it look like you aren't getting full boost until around 5000 rpm
Last edited by robertrinaustin; Jul 28, 2005 at 06:34 AM.
Originally Posted by robertrinaustin
You're confusing peak trq with peak boost. I hit peak boost at 4000-4100 rpm and don't hit peak trq until 5000 rpm.
Scorke
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From: Los Angeles
Originally Posted by scorke
Thank christ, you understand this as well!!!!!!!!!!!!! Peak boost does not equal peak power, you will almost never make peak power at full boost, it usually comes quite a bit later.
Scorke
Scorke
Shouldn't you be making the most power when you're pushing the most air???
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From: Burbank
Originally Posted by meisnerboy
Interesting. But intuitively it doesn't make sense to me. Why?
Shouldn't you be making the most power when you're pushing the most air???
Shouldn't you be making the most power when you're pushing the most air???
Your engine and turbo are moving the most air at redline, but not the most power.
The amount air going through the motor would increase with rpm's(if the turbo can flow enough air). Although the engine would be taking in the same amount of air and fuel with each stroke, the fact that the engine is reciprocating faster will mean that it will make more power, if the turbo can supply the added air the engine wants.
Scorke
p.s. if you were running 4 psi do you think your car would make peak power at 3300 or whatever rpms it would be at? No, it would still probably lie somewhere between 5-6k.
Scorke
p.s. if you were running 4 psi do you think your car would make peak power at 3300 or whatever rpms it would be at? No, it would still probably lie somewhere between 5-6k.
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From: Los Angeles
Originally Posted by Jaylenospoolboy
Like making the most torque when you're making the most hp?
Originally Posted by Jaylenospoolboy
Your engine and turbo are moving the most air at redline, but not the most power.
But, I would think you would see MAX torque with MAX spool psi???
And... I believe someone was saying that this turbo was spooled by 3400rpm (therefore, to me and my misguided logic = max power)
Last edited by meisnerboy; Jul 28, 2005 at 11:10 AM.
Originally Posted by meisnerboy
Interesting. But intuitively it doesn't make sense to me. Why?
Shouldn't you be making the most power when you're pushing the most air???
Shouldn't you be making the most power when you're pushing the most air???
If you stop to think about it, the charts make a lot of sense, because the order of events go something like this (assuming WOT):
1.) reach max boost, maximum pressure of air flowing into the intake manifold
2.) all that pressurized air gets mixed with fuel
3.) the engine does its thing...
4.) power is put down through the tranny to the wheels
5.) all that exhaust gas spins the turbo faster
6.) repeat cycle, but now the engine is spinning faster and can intake more air
So generally the "lag" you see between hitting max boost and max power can in part be attributed to the fact that it takes time to convert all that pressurized air into power. Eventually there is a point at which the turbo loses its efficiency and cannot supply all the air demanded by the engine, which means that boost starts to taper.
l8r)
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From: Into the Void
Originally Posted by shiv
680cc injectors. Good for 30psi/500whp/race gas (awd dynojet) applications. And will still idle smoothly and sniff clean at a 900rpm idle. Today, on TT dynojet, a 30R stg 2 set-up made 375whp on 91oct gas. 400+whp on 100oct and nearly 460whp on 109 unleaded.
Shiv
Shiv
WOuld you say the Denso Style 680CC would be enough for a 3076or your 3037?
Thanks
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From: Into the Void
Originally Posted by Statix
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dyno4mance
...ATP kits do not perform anywhere close to a full spec Garrett turbo on most of the available kits out there Vishnu, AMS, Full race and so on.
But if you want to see for yourself go right ahead
And yet another opinion, with nothing but he said she to back it up, Thanks for the info......
Originally Posted by Dyno4mance
...ATP kits do not perform anywhere close to a full spec Garrett turbo on most of the available kits out there Vishnu, AMS, Full race and so on.
But if you want to see for yourself go right ahead
And yet another opinion, with nothing but he said she to back it up, Thanks for the info......
Jesus is that your cliche' quip for anyone you disagree with?
anyway your wrong, here is one of many testimonies that happen to be VERY similar
If you read through the thread, you'd see I had the ATP kit on my car prior to the stage 2. Andrew's statement of "anywhere close to a full spec Garrett" is a little enthusiastic. The two kits have similar PEAK numbers and both are very strong runners.
The fit and finish of the Vishnu is superior, but these two kits fit different market segments. For someone who wants an inexpensive bolt on (relatively speaking) the ATP kit is a great compromise.
I wanted the stage 3 Vishnu but the reliability of the stock manifold and a quiet stock looking set-up. We compared the dyno graphs of this set up with the stage 3, and under identical environments, we're not so sure there is much of difference if any. Shiv thinks maybe there's 15 or 20 hp on race gas. On 91 there's no difference.
The ATP is not quite the stage 2. It gives up 4-500 rpm on the bottom and tapers off up top compared with the Stage 2.
In a drag race the Vishnu would jump out to a car length by second and pull away through the end of each gear but again that's my humble opinion, but I do own both
If the Vishnu stage 3 is 10/10ths, the Stage 2 is 9.5/10ths and the ATP 8.5 -9/10ths as far as what kind of performance you can pull out of a 3037. IMHO
The fit and finish of the Vishnu is superior, but these two kits fit different market segments. For someone who wants an inexpensive bolt on (relatively speaking) the ATP kit is a great compromise.
I wanted the stage 3 Vishnu but the reliability of the stock manifold and a quiet stock looking set-up. We compared the dyno graphs of this set up with the stage 3, and under identical environments, we're not so sure there is much of difference if any. Shiv thinks maybe there's 15 or 20 hp on race gas. On 91 there's no difference.
The ATP is not quite the stage 2. It gives up 4-500 rpm on the bottom and tapers off up top compared with the Stage 2.
In a drag race the Vishnu would jump out to a car length by second and pull away through the end of each gear but again that's my humble opinion, but I do own both
If the Vishnu stage 3 is 10/10ths, the Stage 2 is 9.5/10ths and the ATP 8.5 -9/10ths as far as what kind of performance you can pull out of a 3037. IMHO
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From: Burbank
Originally Posted by Supernaut
WOuld you say the Denso Style 680CC would be enough for a 3076or your 3037?
Thanks
Thanks
Andrew/Dyno4mance was looking at market as a whole and he's one of the most knowledgeable guys on the Evo I have spoken with. He's gregarious in his demenor too.
What he was saying is there are better choices and if the additional layout of money is not a huge issue; the ATP rates lowest of the kits.
I'm saying just because the ATP doesn't match up as well to the others, for the money and peak power, it's considered in the group.
If all the kits were a litter of pit-bulls, this one's the runt. When taking on a poodle it will still win, but not against a brother or even a big sister..
Originally Posted by Supernaut
WOuld you say the Denso Style 680CC would be enough for a 3076or your 3037?
Thanks
Thanks
l8r)