disagree here.

give us a few examples of well known cars either brand new model or totally overhauled model (recently) that had issue with drivetrain.

dboz, i would totally agree with you. No company in their right mind would release a car with known mechanical bugs.

ambystom01, as for issues with the mr tranny, i dont think that there are any that we know of at this time. there is a post somewhere with a tsb which explains a few things about how tranny works; designed behaviors which can be mistaken for issus, i will be back with link

here it is


https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=367629

 

Of course no company would release a car with known mechanical issues but there isn't a car out there that doesn't have some problem. This is especially true when it's a completely new vehicle/drivetrain/etc. Hell, the new lancer is having issues with alignments and the new Evo has had issues with the factory tune, the gas pedal (at least for one person), the paint and I'm sure somethings that I'm missing or forgetting.
I'll see if I can find the link that discusses the overheating issue.

 

Truth is this technology is far from new. It may be new to mitsu but not to those making the transmissions and doing the true R&D on it. It has already proven itself on high end cars and other companies. They are trying to remove manny's from the US in general because studies in the government say it is one of may driving distractions. Those like us who want to keep the manny alive may live to see it Die is a possible realisation. Still this does not make the TC-SST invincible or without flaws. They talk about abussive treatment of the car causing errors. Anyone in the business know more and more tsb's come around every day. They are only posted to the dealers after enough issues come through that explain the same problems. On a sports car they should have added the tranny cooler from the get go. Now to enjoy a spirited drive we will need to add one before even modding the car. On top of that they say "any" performance modification will affect the transmission in an adverse way. They are saying its a sealed tranny and not servicable so the gears cant be swapped out ,yet, with stronger ones, and the clutch plates in the SST most likely will need to be upgraded but there is no aftermarket support yet. We all know it will take 1-3 years for aftermarket suppliers to hit full swing and finish the R&D they need to do to make sure their product is reliable. So as for right now the TC-SST is great for a DD and using what comes with the car but any true fun= Abbuse with the car should not be done with that tranny without severe testing. Robi is in the middle of this and will probably see some of the problems that may come along with this. Our best source of information is through the team working with them.

 

True the technology isn't new but that doesn't mean this particular application will be good. The internal combustion motor has been around for more than a century but manufacturers still get it wrong from time to time.
I seriously doubt that the manual will disappear any time soon. It's still the fallback transmission for many manufacturers.

 

The tranny is made by Getrac, Mitsu has a contract with them most likely to supply them with the DCT for the Lancers.

 

This isn't an issue of TUNING anymore. It has become more of an issue of perceived reliability. A car company can produce a car to run for 50K miles because people, on average, are keeping their newly purchased cars less and less nowadays. It only takes a service manager to NOT warranty a powertrain claim. NOT the maker. Aftermarket add-ons are an automatic "NO" from a service manager, and the owner is stuck with a huge bill. You can cry about it, but that's the harsh reality.

To simply state that X manufacturer makes a quality product, and Y Automaker incorporates that product into their model line, so an outcome of Z can only be assured of, is preposterous. There are too many variables involved to have a closed mind about it.

Tune these cars with care, and expect to pay out of pocket for upkeep, and failures. Company heads in charge of PUSHING their vehicles are not in the business of being honest about "down the road expenses," but rather getting the cars off the dealer lots so they can make more cars...

 

+1000, it seems like too many people are going headstrong into this without stopping to think about what problems may occur. You have to pay to play.

 

Let's not start exaggerating now. I'm pretty sure you can drive it hard without breaking it, even in stock form.

 

Possibly but that depends on the driver and the abuse it receives. As far as reliability that is a huge question. For the Service writer to say 'no' on a manufacturers warranty over a minor mod can be faught. If I find the link I'll pass it on but there is a site dedicated to fighting with dealers over not warrantying equipment. If I remamber correctly, they can only deny the claim after prooving that the upgrade or modification is the root cause of the problem and not another system in the car. There are certain laws that are required to be followed just so the dealer can use the word warranty instead of another term like service plan and such. You can contact a lawyer for more information but as far as the law states they would have to proove it or loose it. You are not guilty until proven innocent in this case. A small claims judge would side with you if they could not provide without a doubt evidense that the cause was the modification. Plus there are lawyers that do nothing but warranty work issues for false voiding of warranty at dealerships and used car dealers that sell extended warranties that do not state otherwise. It almost like buying a house, lawyers can be your best friend and your enemies worst nightmare.



.... http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/.../warranty.shtm ..... This gives a minor idea of what the word warranty, limited warranty, and full warranty<<Bubper to Bumper>> is truely about. It allows us to use other companies to do "repairs" and such on our vehicle and still keep it under warranty. The verbage may be hard to follow but it is in there. This does not mean that you can push 500hp out of this sucker but that means that the limitations listed by the seller or maximum and minimum HP and TQ must be available and if you keep your equipment in certain guidelines it can NOT affect your warranty. Such as opps you put coiovers on so your engine mount warranty is void or bull like that. The tranny is not completely affected by these modification and should allow you to within reason make the car yours. How ever if you feel the need to evo this thing out then you are looking at the wrong car or feel free to kiss your warranty good bye. Out side of this I talked to a rep and if you willingly sign a paper stating that they need not warrant your car outside of Recalls you can get a better deal by 2k or so. Something to look into.

 

I drove my GTI with the DSG *pretty* hard. A few auto-x's and a couple track days sprinkled in with daily driving, and spirited runs in the hills and coastal highways. The DSG performed flawlessly without any special tranny coolers or fluids.

If you are willing to boost the RA up to higher torque levels, over time you'd better expect to pay for eventual replacement of failed parts. That's the reality. I'm still keen on getting a RA and I'm not paranoid about what's going to break down the road, but I'm surely not going to boost the hell out of it and drive the **** out it either. It's simple common sense.

If you are on the fence on whether to buy the manual or SST versions of the RA, both are going to be fine if used prudently, AND both will fail if used recklessly...

 

^+1 the question though that everyone wants to know is where that line is.

 

If you modify the car in any way, your warranty is gone. I don't think it's appropriate to expect a manufacturer to honor an agreement to fix issues on their car if you have changed the car. It's fine and dandy to say they need to do this, that and the other and wave the Magnus-Moss law at them but that doesn't mean they'll do a damn thing. You can get a lawyer but I assure you that a manufacturer can afford far better ones and they can probably even bring in some experts to tell you that they are wrong. If it goes to court, you will lose and it is likely that they'll make you pay their legal fees as well.

 

I was not saying "all" is acceptable but the truth is that they will still need to warrant the car as long as everything is professionally installed and that the problem part is not directly affected by the aftermarket modification. The dealer will look for any reason not to cover the warranty but a FMIC is not going to affect the radio or SRS for example. There is a cost that modifcations come with but it does not void the warranty completely. Body kits will not affect the trans. Thats the stuff most fanboys and ricers are gonna install first to take to the car show. Adding a high flow filter and possible exhaust modifications should not directly affect most of the parts we worry about. Everyone is afraid of the trans but as long as they are not the ones pushing the limits of the car there is no need to worry. They are protected. What affects the trans directly will be the next question if they want to keep its warranty so they know what to avoid. The obvious is that the flash or piggybacks will definately affect it. Any major mods like a new intake manifold, exhaustmanifold. Things that would affect the HP with increases more then 20hp combined I would imagine would void the trans warranty. And just because you void the trans warranty does not mean you void the car as a whole, thats the point I was working towards. What do you think would affect the trans directly to void its warranty?

 

If you modify the car, they don't have to do a damn thing. It doesn't matter if you had it installed professionally, they agreed to only warranty a stock car, which is wouldn't be anymore. Obviously the part must be in some way related to the problem (if your spoiler breaks it's not because of the exhaust) but if there's a chance that the part or the installation of the part caused the problem, you won't be covered. This is why people say you have to pay to play.

 

I must be lucky then. I installed an aftermarket stereo and amplified sub system. The AC shortly after started blowing fuses and they said it was due to the install of the stereo system. I had another professional check it out and the reason it was blowing was not at all related to the ground or system install. I had them write a letter explaining it along with a copy of the bill to the lawyer. Later that week my car was brought in the problem fixed and mitsu covered the lawyer and I received a check for the bill from the other shop. Mind you none of this is mechanical so it could be a completely different situation in that case and I will still need to read up more. I can pay to play, But, If I didn't touch it or I did nothing to affect the specific part then they will fix it, or prove to me at my expanse that is was my fault. Its a double edged sword so you need to be smart and careful how and when you use it.