You shouldn't be run this injector unless your running E85 or E98 because there is no need for that big of an injector on gas. And With Ethonal spray pattern doesn't matter as much.

 

the FJO is great bang for the buck. ive used both and the FJO is first choice over the aem

 

What fuel pressure are the dead times from? What if you want to run a different fuel pressure?

 

This kinda interesting. I've actually done benchtop latency measurements on these injectors at 43 psi. These injectors without a ballast resistor have about 1.5-1.75x higher latency than FIC 1050cc with a 6 ohm ballast resistor (Evo spec value). I assume that you've seen the same. Do you have any reservations about this aspect of these injectors?

 

Dead time is just that, dead time. More or less doesn't make for a better injector, it's just important that the ecu has the actual correct data.

There's a good explanation of that here.

http://www.injectordynamics.com/questionsanswered.html

 

What values are you getting in your measurements and how are you measuring? Are you measuring injector flow?

 

Thanks, but I understand injector concepts pretty well already. I agree about dead time. Lots of people like to make a big deal of injector latency/dead time as if it matters (and it could if it were a large fraction of the available injection time). Just wondering if you thought the same. Seemed like a good way to test the BS factor to get a better idea of the value of your comments about spray pattern with these injectors. :-) Hope you don't take offense.

Values are in the pics below. For measurements, I setup a recirculating water loop with a gear driven pump and back pressure regulator. The injectors were powered with an adjustable power supply with ample current capacity. Measurements were done by using an o-scope to observe the waveform across a resistor in series with the injectors. When the circuit is engaged (using an SSR triggered by a waveform generator), the rising voltage across the resistor will have a little kink at the point where the injector begins to move. The story is similar when the circuit is disengaged. I had to use a 1 ohm resistor in series with the saturated injector so I could have a signal to observe, but 1 ohm is much less than than the resistance generated by the saturated injectors when they are engaged, so it has a neglible effect on available power to open the injector being tested.

Thanks for the thoughts on the spray pattern. I may be tempted to try these on my Evo.

Bosch injectors


Delphi injectors

 

Good stuff, you've obviously got a pretty good understanding of things.

The main thing we've found is that testing the dead time with a scope doesn't give you actual data. It's better than nothing, but it stems on assuming full fuel flow happens as soon as the injector opens and stops as soon as the injector stops. Actual data can only be observed when measuring fuel flow from the injector. Even if you had actually done it by testing flow, the specific gravity and viscosity of water is very different from gasoline so your data would be skewed from that.

Kudos to your testing though, you've taken things MUCH further than most!

If you want to try a set of these out, let me know. I'll give you a money back guarantee. If you're not happy with them, send them back within 30 days and i'll refund them in full as well as shipping both ways.

 

Yeah, I didn't have access to any fluids with the same density and viscosity as gasoline. You are correct about the values from the benchtop testing not matching the values needed to dial in the fuel trims, but it was pretty close, and I was able to establish a sensible latency vs voltage curve shape from the bench testing.

I'm definitely interested in giving these injectors a try, but it won't be for a few months. Looks like a well thought-out package with nice adapters for the length and the electrical connection. Does your package include either some adapter to shunt the resistor pack on the firewall or instructions on how to cleanly shunt it?

 

No, don't have a solution for the resistor pack that's plug and play. I have no idea what it looks like on the EVO. Anybody got a pic of one and the connector? If I can get a mating connector then maybe I can do something. If not, whack it off and tie all the wires together like it should be.

 

Here's a jiffy pic from the FSM. Now that I look at it, it should be fairly easy to set up some kind of shunt in place of the resistor pack. Maybe you or Injector Dynamics can come up with a plug'n'play solution eventually.

 

Anybody have a real picture of the connector by chance? It's going to come down to finding the mating connector to make something plug and play.

 

I'll post a pic tomorrow if someone doesn't post one before me.

 

Here's a few pics. The first one shows the exterior of the plug that's needed, and the other pics shows the plug attached to the wiring harness. The scale is centimeters. It looks like it would be easy enough to cut and solder the wires going to the resistor pack, but I would rather not do it.

 

Take a resistor pack from a turbo DSM, any generation, and cut the plug off. Solder all 5 wires together and it plugs into the evo harness. I took the resistor pack plug off a 90 AWD talon and put it on my 06 Evo. $20 at a local junkyard or local DSM owner. I have about 4 I could buy right now, most are spoken for as they are going to friends of mine.

I've used Rochesters and I've used Delphi's. I don't care about spray pattern or atomization buzzwords. You can tell me anything you'd like and I'm not going to listen. You can quote any tech sheet or scientific "test". I don't really care. FACT: The new Bosch 1000cc/min injectors will out idle and out drive any Delphi or Rochester equipped car that is larger than 650cc/min on gasoline. If you disagree then you are wrong. I think the idle is better than the stock evo injectors gasoline to gasoline. On E85 only the Delphis do ok, but around town gas mileage is a little low. On gas a modified Delphi does not do so great in my experience and many of my personal friends experience.