Which race gas?

So far we have retuned 100, 110 and 116 octane with E85 and made more power on E85.

Can I assume you haven't used/tuned E85 personally?

 

Thanks for the support.

BTW I think you were really close on the hp improvement. I'm seing more power at wastegate then i did at 25-26psi on 91 octane. The evoscan graphs aren't that great but still showing a nice healthy 380whp or so with a 3100lb setting for vehicle weight its closer to 400whp if i add my own fat *** into the equation.

My car is as damn close to full weight as you can get in an RS including a full sized battery in the trunk.

 

Well hats off to the FIC guys very nice people to talk with.

Unfortunately for me they didn't find a problem with the injectors but kindly offered to send me another set in place of my old ones anyways. I opted to go down a size in bluemax injectors to a set of 1250's which hopefully will be easier to tune up then the last set.

 

Holy crap i am so pissed right now. I have the 1250's tried installing them in the car today and spent several hours trying to dial in the latencies. I found out with this particular set it was impossible.

Idle impossibly rough as if one injector again was not firing properly. On dissambley I checked the fuel side and outlet side for obvious differences. Found one of the injectors has a different looking inlet port maybe damaged or clogged I don't even know. Tapping the injector upside down released fuel and made the inlet port look a tad cleaner. I am offically giving up on these injectors and moving on to something else maybe precision 1200's since the precision 880's work like a dream in my car.

Also side note, while the injectors where in an ominous cloud of white smoke was coming out the exhaust. I checked its smell and it was unburned e85 telling me i had an injector issue or latecy. Despite latencies down to rediculously lean conditions the smoke persisted so that told me one of the inectors probably wasn't firing properly.

Anyways rant done, I pretty much have the feeling MAP and FIC are going to blow me off. I bought the injectors from MAP and i have the extreme doubt he'll accept a return. Argh what a waste of 4 weeks.

 

Oh this is bad news I think one of my piston rings is done oil smoke is coming out of the car lightly at idle and pretty heavy when giving it gas. I'll do a compression check later today but my hopes are not that high.

Edit:
Compression check and leak down test was good
145 130 140 140

Think the smoke was accumulated in the exhaust from the last time the FIC injectors where installed.. The white blue smoke probably was just excess ethanol burning off.

 

interesting, before the BR dbl pumper my tuner tuned for C16 and I'm embarrassed to say we got 470whp... threw down some E85 and got 501whp, can't honestly say what the boost was (C16) but I know my tuner was very disappointed! the boost on the E85 was 27psi (pte1200). I know I'll never go back to that Race fuel ($11.00 bucks plus a pop!!!), I have seen more success stories with reds on E85 than the latter... just my .02 bits... great thread

curious to know of those that are running FP Red on corn that are not surging @4k high gears, lets say 4th-6th are you running stock intake manifolds and heads?

 

I'll say that Race gas is better than E85 in my opinion. I have used and tuned E85. It is a great fuel and for the money it can't be beat.

I've always hated meth injection for the lack of a quality fuel system that 99% of them come with. Typically a meth injection system is the first step to a new shortblock. No such thing as fail proof until you put it in the tank. So...naturally E85 is a HUGE step up from methanol injection IMO.

Yes you made more power on E85 than Racegas...I can believe that. Ethanol is quite oxygenated...thus the -ol. Not to mention the chemical cooling that you achieve with the ethanol. All big benefits. However E85 is not as stable as race gas, nor will you achieve the octane, and more importantly anti-knock that comes with using Leaded Race Fuels such as C16 or VP Import. In my case....fuel stability is an issue because of the amount of moisture in the air. The stability issue is further complicated by the frail distribution network in the Pacific Northwest. The combination of the alcohol being hygroscopic, not having as much knock resistance, it's poor cold start characteristics, and (least importantly) you produce formaldehyde as a bi-product. Those are my basic reasons for choosing race gas over E85 that are performance related.

My other reasons... (in order to support 600awhp) twin pumps, custom fuel system, huge-mongous injectors...and maybe even two per cylinder... not to mention the lack of E85 support in the Northwest region. I've been able to make 580 on a single walbro on C16 with the factory fuel lines and rails with a set of 1000cc injectors.

Back on topic. OP, please do yourself a favor and contact Tony Palo of www.T1racedevelopment.com and pick up a set of Injector dynamics injectors from him. Speak with him in detail about your setup and he'll get you a set of injectors that will take you SECONDS to setup and not hours of wasted time trying to guess what latency values work for your mismatched "1450cc" Injectors. I've wasted hundreds of dollars on FIC injectors getting them flow tested and replacing them with other FIC injectors...only to be disappointed by having two different styles of spray pattern in "ONE MATCHED SET" of 1000cc injectors. Read up on the Injector Dynamics injectors as well as paul yaw. (www.yawpower.com)

<-- I may come off as an a-hole...that's natural. I'm not.

 

I already have a set of 1200cc precision injectors on the way I'll try these out first and if I can't get them to run I'll give that guy a call.

 

Return the Precisions and call Tony. I'm not being dramatic...and I typically don't swing from anyone's sack. The product IS better and if you take the time to read you'll understand why. Please take a half an hour and read the ID site.

 

Not to be an *** but that's not money smart to just not even try. I'd have to pay shipping back to AWDMotorsports and ask for a return since they are already half way here.

 

You Will be happy with the PTE's . These are similar to the RC1200's and I believe them both to be disc based rather than ball and seat type injectors. Disc based injectors have an advantage at metering fuel more accurately due to their design.

I currently run some Custom Lucas 1200 injectors also and I previously ran FIC and RC ball and seat injectors.
Just got my clutch upgraded so Red should be going in soon as it has been sitting in my garage

PS These injectors scale much lower at both global and latency than what you are used to seeing relative to ball and seat style injectors like the FIC.

Good Luck

 

Buying 10 sets of sub-par injectors is a waste of money. Used injectors are worth less than new ones.

"You never have time to do things right, but you'll find time to do them twice." (In your case you can add money in with the time)

 

As a Red owner told me, if you go Red make sure you get the aftermarket Oil Feed Line. Then you have to wonder why FP is considering not warrantying turbos whose owner did not buy their oil feed line...

 

Took me a matter of minutes to scale in a set of 880cc injectors even without knowledge of how to scale in injectors the first time. If these 1200cc's are anything like the 880's I'll have the car running in under 2 minutes with 1-2% variation for SFT.

Then its simply getting the scaling right which doesn't take long maybe 10 minutes of just playing with it at various loads.

EDIT:

Oh not to mention there are many people using these injectors opposed to your single recommendation. I think the choice is clear to go with what is a known good.

 

Good luck.