Ted, I do not agree on the installation of cams in the stock head. The Revolvers will absolutely pick up power on a stock head, so will these, Jun's and Tomei's. The rest of what you said I do agree with.

The one key though is springs/retainers. Without an extremely good set you will be screwed with any of these larger cams.

 

I don't blame you, your in buisiness to make money. You can't be expected to be a non-profit foundation. Comparing prices from other manufacturers, you seem to be giving a good deal.

 

Ted,

If we assume a higher lift camshaft generates additional flow in the cylinder head then the turbo will flow more at an equivalent boost. Remember, boost pressure is created because of the resistance to flow. So, for a given pressure if you decrease the resistance you will increase the flow.

Simple way to view it, if you put your finger over the end of a garden hose the water will flow less, but the pressure inside the hose will increase. As you let your finger off the hose the water flows more and the pressure decreases.

 

Dave you have a PM!

 

Hydrodynamic principles are much different than that. Liquids can't be compressed therefor you will raise pressue and decrease flow. Air is compressable. A restriction in the air flow will increase the speed of that air but will also decrease the pressure. The volume of that air remains the same.

 

True, but a small turbo won't be able to generate equivalent boost, simply because the compressor can't flow enough air mass to create the same boost condition. And even if it could be overspun and forced to do so, the resulting high air temp negates an increase in air mass flow.

My point is that with a small turbo, the turbo will be the limiting factor, not the camshaft.

 

I agree there is no benefit to telling who ground the cams. The reality is that anyone can buy your cams and copy them regardless if you have given the specs. I know several engine shops that will spec a cam if I ask(lift/duration/ramp rates). The basic specs that cam companies provide on a cam card is not sufficient to copy a cam.

Also, saying that you set the cams to 0 deg is bad advice in my opinion. You need to reference the crankshaft and not your cam gear. I guess it makes little difference as most wouldn't reference the crank anyway and just set the cams in and run them. I guess also for someone with cam gears it makes little difference as most engines will require difference changes to cam timing depending on the mods to the vehicle.

Just my $0.02.

 

I have no way of saying this other than to sound like the dick I am.

I don't care if you think saying set the cams to 0 is bad advice. Actually I could give a S hit less what anyone thinks anymore.

We have cams in my car, Daniel's car our black car etc., etc., all set up the way the factory does, set them at 0. Is there a better way, debate all you want as I don't care about that either.

We have the quickest EVO8 in the world and these cams are in that car set at 0. My car is the quickest radial tired GT35R EVO and they are in there that way. Daniel's car makes an additional 70 whp over my car and they are in that way.

Should I honestly have to get this ticked off everytime I come to EVOm and listen to what someone else thinks about what I recommend or what I am doing?

Could everyone that doesn't like what I have to say just go **** off and waste your time bothering someone else?

Until "you" are faster than I am, making more power or doing something to make me wonder if you are smarter than I am, please leave me alone.

The crankshaft is "referenced" by the way, it has a timing mark on it too, line them all up, put stock gears on the car and call it day.

 

What he is illustrating is the fact that "0" on the cam gears for one set of cams doesn't mean anything from one brand of cams to another, simply because EVO cams are ground on a variety of different lobe centers. This means that "0" for one set actually works out to "2" or maybe "-2" for another.

For example, a set of Cosworths set at "0" is a more advanced setting than a set of HKS also set at "0", simply because that's the way the manufacturer chose to grind it. It doesn't mean they actually invested hundreds of hours of engine dyno testing with a variety of settings, and it definitely doesn't mean it's the best setting for all applications (which does not exist).

Just FYI

 

I understand that Ted. That is why I said to install these cams at 0. They were ground to work setting them in the car straight up at 0.

This is why I end up so pissed off all the time. We have the cams ground, we have tested them, installed them and set records with them. I suggest putting them in the car set to 0 and I have someone tell me I am giving poor advise.

Oh well.................off to NASIOC! haha

 

Everyone on NASIOC is so calm, its funny.

 

You get pissed because you are pompous. If you are going to make a post under the technical forum instead of the classified section to sell your "wicked affordable camshafts" then you should expect folks to challenge you and ask questions. That is the whole purpose of a technical forum. Having the fastest car doesn't make you right. I have built turbo setups that make more power than any EVO you have built, but that also means nothing.

I didn't invent the idea of referencing the crank to set cam timing. I am trying to understand so please be patient with me. You designed these so that they mimicked stock cams with respect to position and you set them to 0. These are also designed for folks with ported heads so we can also assume the head was decked. In this case we now know that cam timing has been affected and the original desire to set the cams to stock "0" will not occur. So what position is optimal? 0 on an undecked head or 0 on a decked head?

So the moderator doesn't think I am name calling.....
pompous - exhibiting self-importance, arrogant

 

so the cosowrth cams are good on a new evo 9? any upgrades needed to the head. or is the stock drive train ok.

 

David, for those of us who have upgraded springs and retainers already such as crower, or any other single spring/ retainer design, what problems could we confront with your cams?

 

Nitrotiger, David used Cosworths in my latest build.