My HTA dyno results (more boost)
Jan 16, 2008, 07:23 AM
#46
If you read the literature about Shootout mode.. it says nothing about flywheel estimates. So what you are saying is contrary to DD's own copy.
Secondly, I can post to you literally hundreds of Shootout 44 graphs which are ATW power as posted on the MLR.
I just wish a DD operator in the states would get off his *** and call the company they bought the 100k dyno from and ask them why every DD operator in the UK used Shoutout 44 mode. And trust me, DD won't be saying it is a flywheel estimate. To say there is a mode in what is likely the best dyno system out there that only spits out a flywheel estimate is ridiculous.
DD more than anyone respects the fact that the only thing it knows is at the wheel power.
It is no coincidence that the shootout graphs list all the variables like intake temp on the bottom of the graph. Put an intake temp probe near an exhaust manifold and see what results you get. Shoutout mode prints this data on the graph so there is no mystery to how the number was arrived at.
Secondly, I can post to you literally hundreds of Shootout 44 graphs which are ATW power as posted on the MLR.
I just wish a DD operator in the states would get off his *** and call the company they bought the 100k dyno from and ask them why every DD operator in the UK used Shoutout 44 mode. And trust me, DD won't be saying it is a flywheel estimate. To say there is a mode in what is likely the best dyno system out there that only spits out a flywheel estimate is ridiculous.
DD more than anyone respects the fact that the only thing it knows is at the wheel power.
It is no coincidence that the shootout graphs list all the variables like intake temp on the bottom of the graph. Put an intake temp probe near an exhaust manifold and see what results you get. Shoutout mode prints this data on the graph so there is no mystery to how the number was arrived at.
I'm pretty sure the owner of Dyno4mance is from the UK and lived in London most of his life before he came to the states.
I think we agree on certain things, but are not understanding each other online. Just know that this is not corrected to show anything strange, and that shootout mode would be higher. Have a great day.
Jan 16, 2008, 08:03 AM
#47
I'm pretty sure the owner of Dyno4mance is from the UK and lived in London most of his life before he came to the states.
I think we agree on certain things, but are not understanding each other online. Just know that this is not corrected to show anything strange, and that shootout mode would be higher. Have a great day.
I think we agree on certain things, but are not understanding each other online. Just know that this is not corrected to show anything strange, and that shootout mode would be higher. Have a great day.
I'm just a guy that was reading the MLR before this forum began. And have been reading this forum since 2002. So here I am, used to seeing DD graphs posted just about every day for the last 7 years on the MLR.
Then I start seeing DD graphs posted on EvoM... and for one there is not all that neat data at the bottom of the graph. And I'm like, huh? Then I read about Shootout mode and I'm like, "that sounds cool..", but UK uses it but US don't? Why?
Then I see someone making a lot of power ATW considering it's a DD and on less than 28 psi, and AFR's in the 10's... and I'm like, uhhh.
Jan 16, 2008, 10:59 AM
#49
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You couldn't be more wrong. Have you ever read what Shootout mode is or what it is for? All the UK Dyno Dynamics operators use shootout mode. And it has been proven several times by taking an engine from an engine dyno, into a car, and onto a DD that 24% is a good estimate to convert from Shootout power at the wheels, to engine flywheel power.
LT1 sorry to go slightly off-topic in your thread. I bet your 2.3 HTA is the bomb. I just wish I had a better orientation of how to compare DD results like this to others.
By the way LT1... your spoolup looks terrific in the dyno graph. Any chance you could log a 3rd and then a 4th gear pull on the road so we could all see how the spool is on the road ofthe 2.3 + HTA combo?
I have spoolup results for 2.4 + HTA and I would love to see yours to compare. If I recall, I make 30 psi by 4500 in 4th.
LT1 sorry to go slightly off-topic in your thread. I bet your 2.3 HTA is the bomb. I just wish I had a better orientation of how to compare DD results like this to others.
By the way LT1... your spoolup looks terrific in the dyno graph. Any chance you could log a 3rd and then a 4th gear pull on the road so we could all see how the spool is on the road ofthe 2.3 + HTA combo?
I have spoolup results for 2.4 + HTA and I would love to see yours to compare. If I recall, I make 30 psi by 4500 in 4th.
I don't know how the dyno's are calibrated in the uk or how the oem's rate power in the uk but on this dyno we get within 10 to 20 hp of what the oem claims when we use shootout mode.
I'm not disagreeing with your observations, just stating that they do not match ours for U.S. cars.
In the future, if people plan to post on evom, I will try to remeber to do a shootout plot for them.
If you want to discuss further, feel free to pm myself or noise.
For now, back to LT's thread.
Jan 16, 2008, 12:22 PM
#54
I don't want to derail this thread man, but our experience does not match yours. When we run a stock car in shootout mode on our dyno we get within 10 - 20 hp of what the manufacturer rates the car at.
I don't know how the dyno's are calibrated in the uk or how the oem's rate power in the uk but on this dyno we get within 10 to 20 hp of what the oem claims when we use shootout mode.
I'm not disagreeing with your observations, just stating that they do not match ours for U.S. cars.
In the future, if people plan to post on evom, I will try to remeber to do a shootout plot for them.
If you want to discuss further, feel free to pm myself or noise.
For now, back to LT's thread.
I don't know how the dyno's are calibrated in the uk or how the oem's rate power in the uk but on this dyno we get within 10 to 20 hp of what the oem claims when we use shootout mode.
I'm not disagreeing with your observations, just stating that they do not match ours for U.S. cars.
In the future, if people plan to post on evom, I will try to remeber to do a shootout plot for them.
If you want to discuss further, feel free to pm myself or noise.
For now, back to LT's thread.
Seems like an obvious question to me?
Are you a Shootout mode accredited shop?
Jan 16, 2008, 12:23 PM
#55
Interesting... so you run a lower lambda when you are pushing a lot of meth than you would with gasoline? Can you explain why?
Honest question from someone trying to learn about tuning for meth injection.
Honest question from someone trying to learn about tuning for meth injection.
Jan 16, 2008, 12:57 PM
#57
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Mark
Jan 16, 2008, 02:27 PM
#58
Hi Mark... got that much down.. but if he is running 10.x:1 gasoline AFR spraying meth... then it seems to me they have decided to run a lower lambda when spraying meth than if they were running straight gasoline.
So I was just curious how you decide what lambda to run when spraying meth. Same as gasoline, or different?
So I was just curious how you decide what lambda to run when spraying meth. Same as gasoline, or different?
Jan 16, 2008, 05:29 PM
#60
Yep I followed that with interest... but I still am not 100% on reasons why lambda should be where it is. Definitely interested to hear more opinions. That said I think I'm content to think that keep lambda the same as where you would on gasoline is an ok approach.
However here is a case where they are lowering lambda on meth
However here is a case where they are lowering lambda on meth