Originally Posted by davidbuschur

Martin, I just want to remind you that I have the utmost respect for you and your company, I've said it countless times. I am 110% certain that YOU can tune a car safely at the same boost and octane that I am doing. I realize you chose not to and I am fine with that, completely. I have absolutely nothing negative to say about you for chosing that. Hell I may very well be crazy for doing it. I have two builds here now that are expecting this same level of power on 93 next week.

I was not trying to be confrontational I hope you can see my point about what I was saying. I keep making points about something or another and then someone says, "Been there done that". it was getting tiring is all.

As I said, there is NO doubt in my mind you can do this exact same thing. I'll be even more honest, I hope you don't. It leaves me a decent market to mess with and I am willing to take the risk in doing it You guys are busy enough! haha

I went and read the post you made in 2004. Yes, that was damn good power back then but we both know how high the power read when we were both using 2wd dynojets with our EVO's then. Not really in the ball park of what we are reading now. I think you'll agree. I remember making 400 whp on the stock turbo back then with **** poor parts compared to what we are both running today.

Originally Posted by DynoFlash

I would like to add my thoughts on the subject for what they are worth

I have been tuning Evos daily for 5 years and I find Mr. Buschur's work on the Bad Bish both ground breaking and totally revolutionary.

Every so often someone does something so radical and so cutting edge it changes how others think about a subject.

I have never seen anyone tune an EVO as agressively on pump gas with such success and find it to be a brilliant advancement.

My opinion is that the combination of the closely matched Buschur Parts along with the FP HTA Wheel and Driven Innovations intake manifold have enhanced the VE of the Evo motor to such a degree that the motor is able to be tuned to a much higher condition on pump gas.

I know this becuase I have experienced tuning thousands of Evos on the same pump gas to the point of knock and seen that the limit is no where near the kind of boost and power level of the Bad Bish car is making - simple FACTS.

There is no magic in tuning its a rather simple process - fuel and timing and a few other minor things.

I give credit to Buschur, FP and Driven Innovations for their work in making parts which enhanced the 4G63.

Also due credit must be given to David Buschur for knowing what he is doing and having the confidence in what he is doing to send out a high profile customer car with this level of tune into the real world.

In life those who take risks often are rewarded with great results.

Again, kudos to Master Buschur for staying on top of the scene.

Al


PS - the thread that Martin cited above was claiming 470 whp on pump gas at 25 psi and then 505 whp with WATER INJECTION. Clearly that is a totally different subject that pure pump gas.

Query to anyone willing to entertain a rational conversation is why wouldn't a guy like the Bad Bish consider a quality alcohol injection system as a additional means of saftey and to provide an additional margin for the event of a bad tank of gas?

Originally Posted by davidbuschur

Al, Peter's car would make more power with an alky injection kit. A few pages ago I put up a post about how I feel about the alcohol injection and safety features and such.

Which kit are you using now? I know you aren't installing the SMC's anymore. What kind of safe guards do the new kits you are using have?

Peter's car would be as safe or safer with an alky kit on it. I wire them into the AEM and if anything happens it basically kills the power.

I think my problem with installing an alky kit on the car is I have become closed minded again. I've been making so much power on just pump and not having problems that I have stopped suggesting an alky kit on most of the builds. Maybe I need to open up my mind again and put an alky kit on one of these cars. I'd think 35 psi would be pretty easy then..............that would add another 50 whp on a car like Peter's. It's getting crazy.

Originally Posted by IHUNTV8

Ok, im only on page 11 of this thread and i have to make a post My car has come up several times during all the conversations. Alot of people know i drive my car 120 miles to and from work, and obviously i wanted the car to make good power on pump gas. After Dave tuned my car at 525 horse, i have put 8000 miles on it and I go to the dragstrip twice a week, and i have taken the car to Mid-ohio ran in hpde3 all weekend, went and attended several track days at nelson ledges. I am 100% sure my car is safe at that power level on 93 octane!

With the gas prices jumping up, I just started running 87 octane in the car now. This is going to be news to Dave. Dave I hope you do not get upset with me, but i have pulled 5 degrees of timing out and turned the boost down to 25 psi, the car seems to pull good and has little knock. I am going to keep messing around with it, (if Dave dont care)! I was getting around 28 miles to the gallon on 93, but it seems it has fallen to a bit with 87. I plan on running 87 octane for the summer, and going to hit the track with the car this way. I have logged 967 miles so far, whooped one mustang.

I know im not as smart as alot of the Tuners on here, but i did stay at a Holiday inn last weekend Im going back to page 12 now, i will try and catch up.



Trent

Originally Posted by IHUNTV8

Ok, im only on page 11 of this thread and i have to make a post My car has come up several times during all the conversations. Alot of people know i drive my car 120 miles to and from work, and obviously i wanted the car to make good power on pump gas. After Dave tuned my car at 525 horse, i have put 8000 miles on it and I go to the dragstrip twice a week, and i have taken the car to Mid-ohio ran in hpde3 all weekend, went and attended several track days at nelson ledges. I am 100% sure my car is safe at that power level on 93 octane!

With the gas prices jumping up, I just started running 87 octane in the car now. This is going to be news to Dave. Dave I hope you do not get upset with me, but i have pulled 5 degrees of timing out and turned the boost down to 25 psi, the car seems to pull good and has little knock. I am going to keep messing around with it, (if Dave dont care)! I was getting around 28 miles to the gallon on 93, but it seems it has fallen to a bit with 87. I plan on running 87 octane for the summer, and going to hit the track with the car this way. I have logged 967 miles so far, whooped one mustang.

I know im not as smart as alot of the Tuners on here, but i did stay at a Holiday inn last weekend Im going back to page 12 now, i will try and catch up.



Trent

Originally Posted by davidbuschur

Al, Peter's car would make more power with an alky injection kit. A few pages ago I put up a post about how I feel about the alcohol injection and safety features and such.

Which kit are you using now? I know you aren't installing the SMC's anymore. What kind of safe guards do the new kits you are using have?

Peter's car would be as safe or safer with an alky kit on it. I wire them into the AEM and if anything happens it basically kills the power.

I think my problem with installing an alky kit on the car is I have become closed minded again. I've been making so much power on just pump and not having problems that I have stopped suggesting an alky kit on most of the builds. Maybe I need to open up my mind again and put an alky kit on one of these cars. I'd think 35 psi would be pretty easy then..............that would add another 50 whp on a car like Peter's. It's getting crazy.

Originally Posted by davidbuschur

WHAT??!!! Trent you've been tuning again!? haha Good for you. The reduced timing will have an effect on the mileage, might have to add some back in at the lower end of the map. Is the 02 feedback turned on? Does it have enough correction to keep the car running lean enough? Also, I think your car was the first one I broke 500 with on pump gas now that Al mentioned it, isn't it? I think it was at the shootout or something too, wasn't it?

gsnt, sorry, I assumed you were talking about the AEM since that's what the topic has kind of been focused around.