Can't we all get along. For what it's worth, I plan on getting products from both Dave and Shiv

Maybe if Dave took a proactive approach and called a mag like SCC, he'd have more luck getting magazine coverage.

I also understand the wearing your heart on your sleeve (i.e. David's comments). Happens to me all the time

 

umm, maybe when appealing to the masses do you need to market yourself but in the auto aftermarket industry word of mouth makes or brakes you. I found bushur's products by reading about them on chat boards/mailing list and chatting with other people. These were not advertisements I was reading/chatting about but first hand experince of other people with their products. I could obviously see they put thought into his products by design and what they recommended. In the world of custom rides you can market your fast and furious head off but in the end the person who has the money to be spent regularly (not the dude who buys a exhaust because it'll *complete* his car but the guy who has a ever unfinished project.) is going to know who he wants to buy from to get the most out of his money. So you can market your little *** off but sorry in the end those who know and regularly have the money to spend will know who to buy from. period.

bryan

 

Hey guys I'm sorry but I'm with Dave on this one. Granted looking good is one thing but when you purchase after market parts it all comes down to one thing, performance. I know of Buschur only through friends who are hardcore DSM guys these guys are all about speed and having a good reliable product as well. Thats my 2 cents on this whole saga. Have a good one.

Jesse

 

David is making 343 to the wheels with these mods.


BR 3" exhaust, BR MAS pipe with BR airfilter, BR Upper i/c pipe, AFC with BR settings, BR manual boost controller set to 19-20 psi, 94 octane Sunoco fuel.


He is also trapping at 111MPH, which is getting in 03 Cobra territory and you may yank a convertible.


This all done the old fashoned way, with real numbers, no ambigiousness or vaugeness in products.

Buschur is more direct in products and service, you may not have the Bling effect, but you have the most power for the least $$$$$$$$$$$$


And the 500WHP is withOUT internal mods, hell if a 1G can do it, so can the EVO VIII, just boost and fuel gentleman, and if he sells teh AEM with proper programs, it'll be quite easy, you will have a giant killer.

 

OHHHHHHHHHHHHH David, is that new turbo a Internal gate?

Is it similar to a FP Green or bigger, LAG!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Oh yeah, when is your 02 eliminator DP comming, waiting for that.

 

Izengrey,

You must have mis-understood. The entire thing started out with my stating I wish we could get a call for some of these shootouts that are being done. It is just like the WRX exhaust shootouts. As many times as we tried to get in we couldn't. We have a WRX exhaust that is full 304 SS and mandrel bent that from the turbo back weighs in at just 2 pounds more than anyone that they tested from just the catback. Same thing here, it has to have something to do with who you know to get included in these shootouts. As Shiv just mentioned he worked "with" the magazines, it has to help.

Marketing and advertising, my failure, if it is it is one of the few I have had.

Thanks for the input,

David Buschur

 

I don't think I was trying to cover up the real price and make it sound cheaper than it was. I stated what it would take for 500 whp in my opinion and said I wasn't sure because of the durability of the bottom end being unknown at this point to make 650 whp.

This is what I see so far. Everything we have available at this point to make the car run 12.4's at 111 mph costs just short of $2100. This gets you the SS MAS pipe, SS IC plumbing, AFC2 w/settings, MBC, boost gauge, gauge mount, SS downpipe, offroad pipe, catback and a high flow aircleaner.

To make 500 whp you are going to need the other $3400 in parts on top of this. I also think you will need cams as I stated. That is not $10,000.

When you decide that isn't enough my guess is the bottom end will not hold up and to move to 600+ hp you will have to upgrade that too.

Currently we offer a Stage 3 shortblock and cylinder head for the 4G63. The shortblock is $3,000 retail and the head is $1650. These are the same two parts that are currently in both of our 4G63 race cars. The Street Class car has gone 8.71 at 151 mph and made 661 HP to the wheels through an automatic trans with a VERY ineffecient 8" torque converter. The Pro Class car makes 800 whp through the same converter. Both of these cars are run to 9500 rpm every pass they make. The engine will go over 10,000 rpm and stay together. The torque converter alone has a 17% loss in it at 9500, forget about normal driveline losses that you get with chassis dynos. This is a flat out-right off the top loss of 17%. The engine RPM is 10,000 rpm, the output of the transmission is 8,300 rpm. I am only pointing this out so you can get an idea what these shortblocks and heads can produce and live with. I am also letting you know that if you bought the best stuff available and had the best people put it together the entire head/shortblock is still only $4650.

Add to this a set of camshafts, a kick butt clutch and a larger FMIC then you are finally at over $10,000.

When you sit back and think about it, for the times the car would turn that is NOT alot of money. An EVO with 650 HP, even at full weight, should run in the 9's.

There was a time that $10,000 in an import wouldn't get you into the 12's. We've come a long, long way.

David Buschur
President
Buschur Racing, Inc.
440-839-1900

 

The turbo is our new internally gated turbos that PT&E produce.

I had no intention of doing an 02 eliminator downpipe. I am starting on a SS 02 housing tomorrow if the tubing comes in that ordered to do it with.

The stock 02 housing is a very nice piece. The only downside to it is the actual outlet that goes to the downpipe. Changing it and improving on it is going to be a job. The stock 02 housing has a huge bellmouth at the top, it needs to be like this for the stock turbo because of the twin wastegates that are in the turbine housing. I have an idea on how to make one work and perform well, just have to get it built.

The new turbos will come with the turbo, manifold, 02 housing and all gaskets, oil lines and such needed to install it, that was all for that under $2500 price.

Take care all,

David Buschur
President
Buschur Racing, Inc.
440-839-1900
www.buschurracing.com

 

....as I recall Dave Buschur was one of the first people to rush to get a half baked cat back to market for the evo...he briefly enjoyed a large segment of that market until others presented thier offerings a few weeks later that where and still are of superior quality....
I have seen both the Buschur and the Vishnu side by side and to be honest there is no comparison....Vishnus sig cat back, although priced higher, is leagues above the Buschur in quality and sound.....The buschur system is far too loud
The evidence that Buschur rushed this cat back to market is in the fact that the rear hanger on the early systems are not substantial enough to carry the exhaust, a little bit more R&D could have avoided this problem completely...having said that though Dave was big enough to take responsibility for his mistake and recall it which is more than others have done....MMC included.
My point is Dave ....don't rag on Shiv because he chooses to put out a quality product and does it right the first time...I have seen it lately also with his xede's new harness... he will not release that thing until he is sure it is right...the reason he does this is obvious it is so he can stand behind his product in the future

 

when it comes to exhausts.... price, performance and sound are my deciding factors. Looks are minor. I mean c'mon, how much of the exhaust do you actually see? And any after market exhaust is going to be nice and shiney where it will be seen, where it matters most. I personally don't care if the whole system is finished to a mirror like shine. Don't get me wrong, the Vishnu exhuast are very pretty, but pricey. You are gonna pay for that excellent finish, but if thats what you like then go nuts. I am still a big fan of what Vishnu is doing with the EVO (XEDE ). I totally agree with David when he talks about the exhausts, but not the XEDE! I think that thing is amazing.

David, what kind of settings do you include with the AFC? I mean, do you have setups for aftermarket intakes and without? and so on.... If not, would you be able to help customers if they have tuning questions that are mod specific?

 

What is Vishnu back ground with the 4G63? I have never seen anywhere he has ever developed a quick 4G63. I maybe incorrect though.

 

im not trying to make enemies here, but i agree with David about the whole shootout thing, i was reading in scc and the vishnu evo was in the shootout, i have only 1400 in my evo but im putting down a 12.6 1/4, granted what i have done doesnt look all that pretty but it works, if your going for show i say go with vishnu's exhaust, if your just going for something that gets the job done go with buschur, i havnt dealt with either shop but i know that im not rich, im already kinda broke for having to pay for a 30k car, and i just want to go fast, i want to see a shoot out between all the shops that have project evo's and give them a 4k limit in what they can do, and they have to use the products that they sell to the public(and the price they sell them for), i think that would kick ***

 

i don't think a strret car needs parts with a "show-quality finish". if you're going to drive it, it will get dirty. that being said, i would put my trust in the guy that has been working on the 4g63 for over a decade long before i would trust a guy that just started working on it. correct me if i'm wrong, but wasn't vishnu mainly a wrx tuner before the evo? i agree the man's got skills with a computer program, but i feel with bushur you can still go faster for less money.

 

I don't understand what you are all talking about...the Vishnu sig series has a polished Magnaflow Muffler on it...big whoop...it was probably polished by magnaflow as a part of thier manufacturing process and prior to Vishnu purchasing it....
The vishnu system has race style v band clamps...very strong hangers...the downpipe has additional support to the transfer case a braided expansion joint all the welds are first rate...and on top of all that it sounds amazing....that is what I am refering to as quality...not because it is shiny and sparkly

 

Dave, I have much respect for your willingness to speak your mind and your no nonsense approach to modding, no doubt you are a legend in the dsm community.

Shiv I have much respect for the quality of your products, your laid back nature, and your attitude towards modding as well.

I do think that Dave should get an invite to some of these tune offs. Like I said, he's a legend in the dsm community. Perhapse if you sent a quick email out to your customer base and asked them to petition some of these tuner mags..... I'm sure your customers would go to batt for you.

I guess my whole point is, I'm glad we have a choice of vendors for aftermarket evo parts. Modding is all about personal preference (once you start getting dyno results that is) and without having a choice between vendors... well.... everyones evo would be just like the next....