We don't try to make our parts "look nice." They look nice because they are nicely made with nice components and nice material. It wouldn't be very difficult to make a low buck exhaust system. I just don't want to anything but a best-effort approach. Likewise, it would also be easy to sell and tune S-AFCs. But I like having higher resolution, ignition timing control, intergrated boost control, the ability to run water injection, additional injectors, map switching, plug-in harness, optional MAP referencing, etc,. It has been argued that having these features will provide performance advantages to tuners and customers alike. The opposition has responded to this seemingly cogent argument with a resounding "***-wipe!"

I suspect our products will appeal to others who have the same priorities as we do. Not everyone feels the same way, of course. This is fine because there is more than one option in this (and most every) market. Spend your money where you feel its best spent. Doesn't have to be with us. That is o-kay.

And I've never even been to a car show

cheers,
shiv

 

That may be the case, but that is not the only consistent hypothesis. As i mentioned before, the Buschur setup IS a bit cheaper. Other companies probably feel the same way. But interestingly enough, there may be an even better reason. Much more people are familiar with and understand the AFC than what Shiv does with the XEDE. Ease of use and lower barrier to entry, im my opinion, may be the primary reason.



1) it took you a couple hours. Thats a significant difference. The XEDE takes 10 minutes to pull out. The cumulative time difference after several trips to the dealer is substantial.

2)I agree that you get more bang for your buck. Its in ths post above.


Did you just completely blow off what i said about the ECU harness? thats where the cost comes in. But hey, i counted the boost control as $50, but we can go with $40 if you like. The difference is immaterial.


1) Shiv doesn't tune DSM's
2) the above mentioned companies DO indeed have lots of experience. But even they were at a point in their existence where they were just new and starting. Do not equivocate lack of experience with lack of results and lack of potential. Furthermore, Shiv's experience is fairly extensive in my opinion.

 

Well back to the original post:

when is this manifold coming out??

 

For a Honda it still does..lol Dave, I live here in California and plan on getting a Evo when the 04's come out. Does your instruction for the AFC differ with my weak sause 91?

Sam

 

I guess the difference is what you call "best-effort". I'm a performance enthusiast - I want my stuff to be light, fast and [relatively] bang for the buck. If being a top performer and competitive isn't the primary objective - then I understand why it would be difficult. I'm not saying your stuff doesn't look nice (and I'm sure it performs), but so far I've seen NO ONE try to knock Buschur down as the best overall 3" performance exhaust offering for the Evo. How much does your turbo back exhaust weigh?

Nah, you're not an asswipe, and I have never called you that - your posts are often level-headed and positive. I like all of those things too; thats why I went with the EManage. The AFC is good for what it does though, no one can argue against all you get for $300 with that setup.

How are your priorities aligned? I like performance - as much as I can get. Do you have a turbo kit under development? How will your prices compete / compare with Buschur, AMS, UR, AVO, etc. (this is a fair question).


BS.

 

Sounds like your goal might be warranty deception. I don't have those goals / concerns, so being able to disassemble the aftermarket ECU mods are not a huge concern of mine.

Nah, I didn't discount it - I didn't use it with my AFC. I'm not trying to hide my mods, so I didn't need the harness.


Yep

Yep

I didn't say Shiv wasn't experienced - I said he wasn't experienced with 4G63's as much as his competition. I'm glad that he's getting into the game, and a fair share of the Evo community are giving him a chance to prove himself. This in no way discredits the assumption that many of us who are spending money want to benefit from tuners with the most experience possible. This is why my tranny is being rebuilt by John Shepherd, and not a local guy who I could "give a chance" since he's just starting to work with Evo's.

Shiv sounds like a nice guy, I may even buy from him in the future - god knows I spend too much of my money on this car. Relating this back to the central topic - I would sooner give my money to an experienced 4G63 tuner for something as expense as a turbo kit. These are guys who have already built and ran single digit Evo's / DSM's.

 

Many of us, that still want the waranttee coverage to diminish costs, still do.

Nevertheless, the ease of removability inherent to the Xede is a cost that the Buschur approach can avoid, if one so chooses. But this does not make it reasonable to compare the AFC without the removeability to the Xede, with removeability, unless the potential aggregate loss to consumers due to the non-removability is factored in to the cost.

 

Don't be so quick to badge quick install/uninstall features exclusively as devices of "warranty deception".

Too many of us have gone to the dealer with defective parts unrelated to our mods and had warranty coverage challenged because of those mods.

Quick uninstall features are warranty defense.

 

This is really GAY,...................bothsides I just dont understand this retarded human nature.
So about that turbo kit, lets here about that!!!!

 

So ALEX is the one who restarted the trash talking, cut the crap and start worrying about EVO's in general. Dont stoop to other peoples level.

 

Avatar it seems like you might have an inside scoop on things, have you heard of anything at all???

 

I think the RNR kit will be publicly available before eitheir.

Sean

 

I went with the patch harness on the SAFC II because it makes it easily removeable for when the AEM EMS comes out for the EVO Makes it much easier to sell on the DSM parts trader

Keith

 

Me, trash talking?, please explain

 

People who say nasty things about Buschur are newbies, plain and simple. If you even know Buschur's history, you guys will shut the hell up. Did you know that even Dan Cokic, owner of Pruven Performance used to use Buschur's parts extensively and appeared in Turbo magazine years ago with their 9 sec dsm (in florida?)? That's probably why Alfriedesq has nothing but good things to say about Buschur. Granted that Buschur's exhaust isnt as good looking and it sounds loud, but knowing who David Buschur is, I wont even dare to comment about his products because they do produce some brutal hp and they have years of track record to prove themselves. Sure Shiv knows his stuff...but if Shiv says one thing and David Bushur says another, I will definately trust Buschur.

As to who makes crap parts... Pruven wins the title of "junk". I have friends who bought exhausts and intercoolers from Pruven. The intercooler core is big and nice, but the tanks at the side are just so poorly designed i believe it's more restrictive than the stock intercooler. The exhausts rust in a matter of weeks, plus the fact that it has so many unnecessary bends that restricts/slows down airflow. I have nothing against Pruven, what I speak of is nothing but the truth.