03whitegsr

iTrader: (8)

Wow, sounds like you guys have some serious work cut out for yourselves.

Thanks for the hard work. While it can't become some be-all/end-all comparison, as there will always be some reason somebody isn't happy. I think it will greatly improve the understand people have of how the different setups perform.

It would be interesting to see a TS vs. single scroll comparison at a lower boost level. It seems like TS setups that use big cams with decent overlap just make SICK power at low boost levels where exhaust flow is the controlling factor and not compressor flow.

bolio

I only said the Shearer mani because I asumed that's what was on the car when it came from Buschur with the HTA35 kit. Nothing wrong with using a single scroll Full-Race mani when you're the ones putting in the time and work. And I recommended the 4088R since that seemed to be one of your favorites when you said it would outpower and outspool(real world transient response) the single scorll 35r T3 kits.

bolio

For some people like myself, the real top end power proof is trap speeds(with car weight considered), which we have yet to see on Full-Race t4 TS kit on a 35r frame turbo or 4088r with a built ***** to the wall 35psi+ pass. Still waiting for that proof. IMO The best thing for all Evo owners would be for Full-Race to have an incredible trap speed to go along with their great response and quality kits. That way everyone would have to step up their game.

GotWheelHop

iTrader: (39)

Come on, man. Keep the clutter out of this thread. If you want to pick a fight with Buschur, take it to PM's.

juanmedina

iTrader: (1)

I know man I like David Buschur, I have his parts on my suby, but thats just childish. I reread Geoff post 5 times and I don't see anything offensive at all,

GEOFF
maybe is because he capitalize NOT

dsm25psi

iTrader: (44)

wow nice spool for the BW turbo, i guess if you get the right housing etc that turbo will spool easy like a BB

94AWDcoupe

iTrader: (125)

Should have left " twin scroll/ single scroll" out of the title. I dont think this turbo shootout is a waste of time. I think you will learn some interesting things. But from what I am reading here so far, comparing single scroll setups to TS here is a complete fail. When doing back to back comparisons it is pertinent to change only one variable. IE exhaust housing only, primary runner size only, turbo only. I have never seen a good test comparison of single scroll to twin scroll. And that is because it would be very time consuming to change only one variable at a time. I have seen plenty of graphs showing TS has the ability to spool a turbo faster. But non of those have shown the potential HP gain or loss compared to same turbo in perfected single scroll setup.

GotWheelHop

iTrader: (39)

I was told by many people that a twinscroll 67mm will have a more usuable powerband and have much better drivability than my old open volute gt3582r. I should have the twinscroll setup under my hood soon. I will absolutely chime in with my impression on whether it feels better on the street.

scheides

iTrader: (10)

Cool test, just try and keep as much of the tune the same as possible (i.e. boost! afr, timing)

Good luck, ignore the haters/commentators

juanmedina

iTrader: (1)

Bump.

03whitegsr

iTrader: (8)

A back to back comparision might not even be the best way to prove which is superior anyway. It seems like what is optimal for a twin scroll setup isn't too optimal for open scroll housings.

To get the full benefits of a TS setup, it seems like you need to focus much more on getting huge exhaust flow out of the motor. Conventional wisedom seems to show that a large imbalance between intake and exhaust flow is optimal, where with the TS stuff, it seems like you want an intake:exhaust flow ratio closer to 1. More exhaust cam, more overlap, larger exhaust runners, etc.

This design idea on an open scroll turbo seems to make it prone to exhaust reversion and the motors don't do as well at high boost as a motor with a more conventional intake:exhaust ratio.

twkdcd595

Full-race...

I have to give you guys and mangumpsi a ton of credit undertaking such a great test like this. I am VERY interested to see the results. Should make for some great brain food from what I have seen so far.

I really hope the childish stuff and knit picking nonsense by the overly critical people with a less than constructive agenda does not railroad it.

I wish there was a 6262 with a TS housing available, even a TS 6265 would be very interesting. Precision probably has one under development... lets hope.

In for the results and on-going discussion.

Done

iTrader: (2)

Could we possibly get a Garrett GT3076R vs HTA3076r, both .63 a/r and .82 a/r housings?

Edit: Reason I ask for this, this is perfect for the "mild setup." People who are interested in keeping stock blocks/stock clutch/stock ecu. Power ranging from 400-500whp.

scorke

iTrader: (18)

Geoff initially wanted to do that but instead decided to go with manfolds built for each application.

If Geoff knows that one manifold built for a twin scroll manifold will not perform as well one built for open scroll housings when paired with a twin scroll housing, why would you even bother testing the un-optimized parts. Geoff believes his product is good(best?), and also knows that in order to get the most out of each particular application everything has to be accounted for.

There is no such thing as a "perfect" test, all you can do is try your best to minimize and document conditions, and try to account/correct for the variables that are outside of your control. Full-Race makes manifolds for all types of cars in all flange configurations, sells the spread of turbos so I don't see how this test could be done in a much more controlled way by anybody more passionate about making cars go fast....

Scorke

RevMoto

iTrader: (19)

What size turbo's are the BW units you are going to test comparable to? I know you said it is similar to a 40r but which one? If they are both larger than the 35r's than can you also test a comparable sized BW to match the hta?