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Short Runner T4 TS GTX3076R Experiment

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Old Aug 13, 2012 | 03:32 PM
  #256  
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UPDATE:

Got the setup back together minus the wastegate BOV. Going to reinstall that soon, but I want to now focus on the ZR1 Coils so I am trying to source some plug wires.

Someone had inquired about the K&N filter. It is 6" opening and 10" total length (RU-3280). I mated it with a plastic velocity stack from Autozone(special order) (SPECTRE/4 IN. VELOCITY STACK ADAPTER / Part #9604)



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Old Aug 13, 2012 | 06:05 PM
  #257  
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UPDATE:

So I got bored and started the ZR1 coil conversion. It appears the coils will work and fit in the opening of the valve cover with room to spare. Although I will have to make a custom mount I have verified they will fit. I tried two configurations for mounting; one configuration hooking all coils together with equal spacing and one configuration with paired coils center on plugs 1-2 and 3-4. I think I will end up pairing the coils center around the plugs as this will allow for better fitment.

Next step is to call Magnecore to get a custom wire set and the process can begin. I already ordered all of the DIY connectors for the stock wiring harness and coils so I am pretty much ready to proceed once the plug wires arrive.




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Old Aug 16, 2012 | 03:53 PM
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UPDATE:
I ordered a single wire for mockup purposes to finalize the wire length. They call this setup Coil Near Plug (CNP) instead of COP. Fitment with the wire looks great so I have ordered the remaining 3 plug wires and they should arrive early next week. I have started fabricating the coil mount and should have something finalized with pics this weekend. Final step will be to fabricate the wiring/connectors so I should be running soon. I love that these coils are used on the ZR1 Corvette and more importantly, the dwell times are available for me to program into the Haltech.

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Old Aug 16, 2012 | 06:29 PM
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Originally Posted by 240Z TwinTurbo
UPDATE:
I ordered a single wire for mockup purposes to finalize the wire length. They call this setup Coil Near Plug (CNP) instead of COP. Fitment with the wire looks great so I have ordered the remaining 3 plug wires and they should arrive early next week. I have started fabricating the coil mount and should have something finalized with pics this weekend. Final step will be to fabricate the wiring/connectors so I should be running soon. I love that these coils are used on the ZR1 Corvette and more importantly, the dwell times are available for me to program into the Haltech.

Whats the dwell on those?
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Old Aug 16, 2012 | 06:41 PM
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I get bored easily, so I spent a few hours to start fabricating the mount. In the mockup phase I was pairing two coils about the mounting hole on the plug side of the coil. What I found is this does not center the plug wire about the spark plug hole. You can see in the pic below I tried to create a single mounting point in the center, but it won't work. Therefore, each coil will require two tabs to be welded to the mounting plate so the plug wire is perfecly centered. I also had to move the outermost coil to the back of the valve cover to make more clearance to the hood. I have about 1/2" to the insulation with the hood closed so we shall see once it is running.



Last edited by 240Z TwinTurbo; Aug 17, 2012 at 06:06 PM.
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Old Aug 16, 2012 | 07:12 PM
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Originally Posted by unijabnx2000
Whats the dwell on those?
I am running the D514a coils

http://www.megamanual.com/seq/coils.htm

Last edited by 240Z TwinTurbo; Aug 16, 2012 at 07:15 PM.
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Old Aug 17, 2012 | 06:11 PM
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I just about have this figured out. Remaining plug wires shipped today and I made the new mounting posts for 2 of the 4 coils. Will finish the other 2 coils tomorrow and start on the wiring.



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Old Aug 18, 2012 | 09:17 AM
  #263  
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Just need to finish the wiring and I can test next week when the plug wires arrive. This setup will be super simple to duplicate and I am going to order some material for a simple way to make and provide drawings for anyone interested.



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Old Aug 18, 2012 | 09:40 AM
  #264  
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looks excellent
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Old Aug 18, 2012 | 11:06 AM
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love the CNP
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Old Aug 19, 2012 | 09:10 PM
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What was the main reason for those coils over the Denso pen coils?

Those things are massive and need a ton of dwell when the Denso fit well in an EVO and have been proven to 900+ HP.
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Old Aug 20, 2012 | 05:30 AM
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Originally Posted by 03whitegsr
What was the main reason for those coils over the Denso pen coils?

Those things are massive and need a ton of dwell when the Denso fit well in an EVO and have been proven to 900+ HP.
The main reason was to use a coil that has a know high output and where I can have access to the dwell times for input into Haltech Platinum PnP. I agree the COPs are much easier to install and have been shown to work on setups making 900hp, but are you getting the optimal performance?

Another thing to understand is that not all Denso's are created equal. I run the Denso 90919-02240 and some recent information I found would suggest they are not that good for my application. Unless you have access to the dwell times/output you have no idea what you have.

I see this much like the 3" vs 3.5" exhaust or the 6" Filter vs. 12" filter debate, yes you can make 600hp with a 3" exhaust and 6" filter, but it is much easier to do with a 3.5" exhauast and 12" filter.

Last edited by 240Z TwinTurbo; Aug 20, 2012 at 06:44 AM.
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Old Aug 20, 2012 | 07:53 AM
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Links to the info suggesting the Denso's aren't that great? That number you listed is the same P/N that has proven to work at the 900 level.

FWIW, my wife's Corrolla uses the longer version of those same coils and the Toyota fuses them at 25Amps. They seem to be designed to use short dwell times but with high current. If you don't wire them for the high current, I could see getting less than ideal performance from them. I think the EVO wiring is designed for 15A, for example so at 25 Amps, it could definitely have excessive voltage drop.

The newer pen coils are designed for lean burn operation which means a lot of spark energy as they need a hot spark to light lean mixtures but also a long spark to make sure the spark hits fuel every time.
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Old Aug 20, 2012 | 09:33 AM
  #269  
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Originally Posted by 03whitegsr
Links to the info suggesting the Denso's aren't that great? That number you listed is the same P/N that has proven to work at the 900 level.

FWIW, my wife's Corrolla uses the longer version of those same coils and the Toyota fuses them at 25Amps. They seem to be designed to use short dwell times but with high current. If you don't wire them for the high current, I could see getting less than ideal performance from them. I think the EVO wiring is designed for 15A, for example so at 25 Amps, it could definitely have excessive voltage drop.

The newer pen coils are designed for lean burn operation which means a lot of spark energy as they need a hot spark to light lean mixtures but also a long spark to make sure the spark hits fuel every time.
So are you advocating that we choose our coils based on vehicle fuse size?

What are the dwell times vs primary current for the Denso 90919-02240 coils and what is the spark energy for those coils vs. primary current? I suspect at some optimal dwell setting(3ms) the coil produces between 35-40mJ of spark energy.

Is this sufficient for 900hp....I guess so
Can we do better....yes
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Old Aug 20, 2012 | 11:15 AM
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Here is what I believe to be accurate based on my findings

Denso 90919-02240
Max Usable Dwell (MUD): 3ms
Primary Current @ MUD: 12a
Spark Energy: 35-40mJ (estimated)

LS2 Coils
Max Usable Dwell (MUD): 5ms
Primary Current @ MUD: 11a
Spark Energy: ~120mJ
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