I got the Vishnu Xflash today, let me tell you guys that its a monster to drive and I second the fact that Shiv is crazy ****, he test drove my shiznit and he drove my car the way its meant to be driven, I was ****ting bricks for a few seconds whilst in the car during the test drive.

That aside, my first impressions of Xflash are as follows:
If you granny shift and drive normally, it makes no difference between stock and xflash, not that anyone didnt know that... however once you start to open more than 50% throttle, the beast awakens.

Peak boost on my evo right now is pretty insane, i'll give more details later, but I'm having to shift through 1st to 3rd in a matter of seconds, I do not have too much time to watch my Tach and check my boost gauge, after a quick glance, i need to shift (god damn it pulls hard) and I definetly feel mid range to upper range torque improve dramitically. For the price, i think its money well spent. That being said, I am not a hardcore tuner, thus I just went with the xflash and not the xede/xflash combo. However, the car is indeed a different beast after the xflash and torque and the power band feels smoother. Now some details:

The only mods i have on the car is a HKS Catback and K&N drop in filter.

My theory on the boost.

First off, when people say in the stock car that the boost peaks at 19psi and tapers to 16psi, there is a miss conception, Im not sure about other people but for me as a newbie i thought that it hits 19psi of boost and slowly tapers down to 16 psi, however that is not the case. In case you dont have a boost gauge this is how the boost works on a stock car.

WOT = hits 19psi for a split second and immediatly it drops to 16psi and stays there until redline.

Now thats how stock boost works, hope that helps the newbies, cuz i didnt know thats what it did, i had the misunderstanding of the longer tapers of boost.

.......

Works P2 flash:
From what I've seen and ridden in a P2flashed car, this is how the boost works:
WOT = hits 20psi for about 1 second then tapers to 19psi (again instant drop) but however, this holds to redline, so now you're boosting at 19psi constantly, 3psi over what stock does, is that better??? I have no idea, but thats how boost is working on a P2 flash.

......

Vishnu Xflash:
This is based on my car and what I've seen during my test drive.

WOT = hits 23psi (yes 23 god damn psi, crazy shiznit) holds boost there for 1-2 seconds, then drops/tapers to 21psi, holds that for 1-2 seconds drops to 19 psi holds that for 1-2 seconds, then tapers 18psi and stays there till redline.

As you can see, when Vishnu advertises his xflash to taper from peak boost to 18 psi, his really does taper in the sense that it slow drops, however in the Stock trim, when people are saying boost is tapered down to 16psi, its a misconception, i think the beter way to describe it is to say hits peak boost and drops down to 16psi.

Now on why people feel xflash is pulling harder than p2 flash:

As you can read above, p2 flash only hits 20psi peak, however with xflash i am hitting 23 psi for almost 2 seconds and then drops to 21psi and then 19psi...
for the first 1-2 seconds i'm boosting 3 psi over works p2flash, and the following 1-2 seconds i'm still boosting 2 psi over works p2flash because p2flash has dropped to 19psi where as xflash is dropping to 21psi, on the following 1-2 seconds both cars are boosting at 19psi and the folllowing 1-2 seconds p2flash is only 1psi over xflash, but at that time, i believe both cars rev should be ~around 6000rpm to 6500rpm therefore you have less than a second before the next shift, and during the next gear, the same happens, thus xflash inadvertenly will always be faster than p2flash unless your both in 4th gear or 5th gear and topping out, but even then, its still pretty even given theres only 1 pound of boost difference verses the many psi of boost xflash has already pulled on p2flash during the initial phase of the turbo spool.

Hope this makes sense to some people and also that it can be a reference point for people to decide on which flash to get.


Now, if anyone decides to respond, please do not turn this into a **** contest, I am merely stating what I can observe from a consumer standpoint, that is not a tuner nor do i have any technical expertise. Inputs are welcome, as long as we keep it on topic

Thanks,
Nebolic

 

Welcome to the club ... of people who have nearly pissed themselves driving with Shiv that is.

Congrats on the XFlash ... Good notes on your impressions of Works P2 vs. XFlash.

To my knowledge (correct me if I'm wrong) Vishnu is still the only shop to have decoded actual boost control maps vs. just the boost delay parameter; I think this is the reason some shops/ECU tuners still tune reflashes with manual boost controllers/replacement boost lines?

 

Shiv also replaced the hose in my car, and took out the pill, i think he mentioned the pill removal is necessary because otherwise you cant sustain higher boost? however dont quote me on that.

 

All the original post is showing is that the Xflash does a pretty lousy job of holding boost compared to the WORKS P2. The Xflash drops a full 5 psi of boost from peak compared to 1 psi for the WORKS P2.

Not only that, WORKS were the first to decode not only the boost maps on the Evo, but the other maps as well (remember who originated the flash for our cars). I checked with DavidV about this and WORKS provides their a re-engineered boost tube so that the factory solenoid continues to work just as it had before, only this time holding the higher boost levels allowed by the new WORKS boost maps.

Unlike other tuners, WORKS does not rely on a delay function in an attempt to hold boost. This is also why WORKS P2 holds boost so consistently at 19psi without wavering or tapering further.

The P2 does raise the rev limit, so the rev limit is now 7800 which means the car is holding its power band out further.

 

rodw: I think you are misinterpreting what i've said. I think both systems work differently, worksp2flash is tuned to hold boost, while it seems like xflash is going for the big boost and slowly tapering off. Now, also i want to input that being the first to do something doesnt always mean you're the best, Americans were the first to build computers and cars, however, do we see the japanese on improving on those that were the inventors or innovators.

You gotta give a chance for everything. I am not justifying which one is better or what not, personally i believe that pretty much most flashes (baseline maps) are not so different across all boards, until you start getting into hard core tuning which i am not into.

Please note that i was just putting my opinions on the evom so others can see what the boost is doing, and no i do not endorse one or the other, actually if i had money id buy another ecu and reswap both flashes in there just for fun.

And hey, all technical talk aside, lets not ask who and where on what the flashes are supposed to do, how about actually going and testing it out yourself... just my opinion because if you ask the inventors of anything, they'll always give a bias opinion.

 

Hey,


I'm in Sacramento as well, and have WORKS prepared car withthe P2. Am very interested in checking out your xflashed car fro a comparo. Please see your PM's.


Percy

 

Reflashing has been available overseas.
http://www.technosquareinc.com has made it possible for tuners like Works, Vishnu, Dynoflash, etc., to flash ecu's. They all essentially use the same hardware from TechnoSquare. Works may have been one of the first to get their feet wet in tuning the Evo before the car made it stateside en mas for consumption, but they did not originate it, nor are the best.

They weren't even aware manipulating the factory solenoid until Shiv told them. It all came about in a discussion they were having for a dyno shoot out between Works and Vishnu in which Works backed out of.

 

hagakure:

check your PM's i replied to you about our mini meet in sac town.

Evo 007: thanks for the further insight on the flashes.

Personally i think everyone is stuck in the mode of "this person said this so this is how it suppose to go", I would prefer people to actually tested the products before they start commenting on it, that way, i think we can get somewhere better.

 

Oh boy... this is how it starts

Okay, back to the XFlash: It controls boost a bit differently than most I imagine. First of all, it provides a two stage boost level. Higher boost up to 4800rpm, which provides quite a midrange torque whallop without having to get very aggressive on timing and fuel mapping. Above 4800rpm, boost immediately levels off to almost stock levels (within 1/2psi of stock in most cases). At these higher engine speeds, we close to extract the extra power through running moderate boost pressures with more aggressive fuel and spark mapping.

Second, it also allows for a small time-dependant overboost much like the factory ECU code. But with a different overboost amount as well as a different overboost duration.

Why do we tackle the problem differently at different engine speeds? Because we think it provides the best result. Both in terms of output as well as safety margin. One of the nice things about having a load bearing dyno is that we can load up the car at different engine speeds and find the "ideal" combination of boost, fuel and spark advance at every RPM point along the way.

The whole idea of holding boost constant to redline means that we essentially give up control/tunability over one of the three tuning parameters which, needless to say, is a compromise. Especially in octane limited conditions where you need all the tuning flexibility you can get.

So that's the answer from the horse's mouth. By no means gospel, of course. But it's working for us and, so far, XFlash customers have been quite satisfied. So have I, for that matter. For actual XFlash dyno results (using the baseline XFlash map with no additional tuning), check out

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...threadid=59672

Or any of the other threads on our forum about the XFlash.

Regards
shiv

 

There we go, shiv puts it best, btw Shiv, thanks for hooking up the xflash today, i was all smiles on the drive back to sacramento, and my personal opinion is that my money was well spent

 

Thanks for the nice review. It was a pleasure meeting you today as well. Come by anytime....

Cheers,
shiv

 

nebolic,

Did you get it dynotuned?
Waht kind of # did you get?

 

no dyno tune cuz my evo still a putz, i dont see too much point dyno tuning since i only have a drop in filter and a 3inch catback. We'll see if we have another norcal meet at Shivs place and he can hook up some nice deals on dyno runs, i'll be up to put my car on the dyno to see what it can do. But i'm assuming i should be putting down 220-230whp right now, maybe a little less maybe a little more, but i guess thats just a numbers game, i'm just more satisfied with the real word application of it. Maybe the next couple of weekends, Ill test it out more and see whats the dealio.

 

FWIW, with a 3" cat-back, you're car will probably put down 230-240whp on our dyno. Completely stock XFlash'd EVO have been consistently putting down 220-230whp. Cat-backs do help

Shiv

 

Nebolic,
You say your car is holding 18psi 'til redline. Correct?

Shiv,
Your dyno chart, linked above, shows 16psi til redline(the dyno chart that showed boost is gone now)

Shiv and/or Nebolic, what gives?

Sean