No, it's the same company and same product line. Why would they want to hurt the reputation of the Red like that? With such a high demand, I doubt cutting cost was a big concern of theirs.

My guess would be they were working within the constraints of a different sized turbo, and then it was only tested on race gas at high psi. That's why those of us running pump are seeing some of these issues (low-mid rpm surge/flutter, lower power, low torque, etc.) I think my future with the Red will soon involve keeping it at the boost levels and octane it was designed for .

 

I saw that you mentioned you had one of the originals... there was supposedly a design change with them. IIRC Buschur even mentioned it in there changing over to the Dominator turbo thread. You might want to call FP and ask them if there has been a change since you got yours.

 

Good idea. I called today and emailed. Oh yeah, these guys are hard to get a hold of!

 

Tell me about it... I average about 2-3 calls to actually get someone to pick up over there.

 

um, does this mr have some kind of voodoo magic or something cause those are extremely high numbers for a pump red on the sst. I would like to know the mods, and see a dynochart.

+1 with hiboost, I would like to know what a base sst mr does on your dyno.

For instance: i have Ported fp red,Kelford stage2's Kelford vlavesprings,Ams fmic,uicp,licp,Intake, 02 dump,testpipe,cbe,800ccinj,walbro255,ams fuel rail, and ecutek tuned for 374hp 326wtq on a dynojet.

430 on pump "not pushing it" is a 56 whp diff from mine. And on the dyno you could see the throttle backing off, and the mr tcu working it's magic on the dyno chart. There are several MR's that have just gotten reds installed also within 5-10hp of mine.

 

as i was doing some research with turbo upgrade, i had a feeling that i would run into this tyope of problem. I have a friend right now with a full time attack evo x that is dealing with this compared to an evo x with fp reds. the concluciosn of this thread i had pulled off was that alll these variations that people are commenting on have something to do with the fact that it does affect on power issue we are dealing with.

 

Guys, lets not turn this into a dyno # debate from one dyno to another. Only talk about your experiences if you have solid back to back evidence that EVO X's are making less power, same dyno, than 8/9's with FP Reds.

One interesting thing that I came across, is that the 8/9's with FP GREENS seem to make very similar power to what EVO X's with Reds do, but with better spool. (I know, because I recently got beat by one).

- Louis

 

sorry but im tired of hearing how its unfair we are making more power and blah blah blah. you guys paid like 400 less for your turbo so with that extra 400 save up a little more and get some cams or meth or something. i paid 1795 for my fp red brand new.

 

Wow, I don't think I see any complaints like that. We're just trying to figure out why one particuar turbo behaves the way it does. For most people willing to put a turbo on a 2008-2009 car, spend $5-10K+ in mods, and void the powertrain warranty, +/-$400 doesn't mean a whole lot.

 

I don't think you can compare a Green at all either. It seems they spool fast and make a lot more torque than what we're seeing. FPReds are getting decent results at high boost, but not at 25psi.

I don't want to get into a dyno #s debate either, but I do think it's a relevant discussion when a lot of us are seeing 360-380whp / 320-330tq:

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...-baseline.html

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...ne-fp-red.html

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...d-content.html

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...-iveytune.html

...and others are claiming 430-450whp with similar setups. I would just like to know if there's a secret to unlocking this power, or if this was actually on meth or something.

 

Nobody is crying. We're all here just trying to find out factual information. You paid $1795? That's right, you should be making more power because of a MINISCULE $400 difference. The cost was not a factor to me whatsoever. The Red's proven performance on EVO 8/9's was my biggest factor, which seems to be lackluster on the X's.

I recently received a response from Robert at FP... here it is:

"I prefer to stay out of forum discussions. If you would like to discuss a topic with me or get my impressions on comparative performance between different types of cars and turbos, please give me a call. 972-XXX-XXXX ext XXX, or give me your number and I will be happy to ring you. I have not read that thread, and I dont read many threads at all anymore, it eats up too much time that is better spent directly helping my customers. Unfortunately the forums have become a place where bullies rule, and I prefer to just stay out of it and work on our parts.

I can see the topic in the link however, and yes it is true that typically a x makes less power than a 9, but people have been working on the 9 setups for 4+ years, the X is much less developed as a whole.

Thanks!
Robert Young"

Still, after reading this, no concrete evidence or factual data. I don't think if I park my car for 4 years and turn it back on, that it will make more power than it is now

- Louis

 

I still think people are ignoring the fact that the X turbo housing is SMALLER than the VIII/IX frames. Thus, the X has problems with surge at lower (pump gas) boost numbers and results in yielding less power. If I turn my boost to 24ish psi the car will surge at peak boost and not feel smooth/strong...when I goto 26ish psi the car feels totally different. I really think it's a matter of the X 'needing' meth or race gas to really unlock the potential of the Red where the VIII/IX owners didn't have to worry about this with the larger frame on the turbo. I'm going to be doing an Aquamist HFS-1 on my car so we'll see how much of a difference 30ish psi makes on the X Red. I'm hoping a huge one seeing how well Ryan Gates car is running on race gas.

THanks,

Justin

PS - Lou - Tell Tony I said HI!

 

Will do!

Damn, looks like an HFS-6 might be in my future.

 

No it doesn't, it has a LARGER turbine housing and the same 'large' TD06 or 'small' TD07 comp hsg scroll design as the 9. Wheels are the same. It ain't the turbo, and there is no such thing as a 'pump gas turbo', turbo is just an air pump, it don't care what its fueled by, pump gas numbers are effected by the overall package and the tuner more than anything else.

If you wish to place blame look at-

Factory ECU 'torque management' (what do cars with aftermarket ECU's do?)

Unfamiliarity with optimal dual MIVEC operation.

Engine design differences.

'Potato in the tailpipe' inherent in the overall package is being overlooked.

 

THANK YOU for some great information there. Is this guy the first person to say the housing is LARGER on the EVO X? Very interesting...