The Exhaust manifold has a divider built in because it a twin scroll manifold, the two runners are separated from each other. I was talking about the turbine housing, it has a divider wall built between the WG flapper doors and the turbine wheel exhaust exit.

On a stock frame turbo EVO X (stock, FP white/green/red/etc) the wastegate will be closed or almost closed under high power conditions (High rpm max power). By that fact alone WG flow won't have an affect on Max Power.

The AMS widemouth has the largest exit area/volume post turbine housing of all downpipes. This is good for hot expanding exhaust gases and then it has a long smooth transition to the rest of the downpipe/flex section area.

-Martin

 

Martin,

The wastegate is open under WOT. This is the reason the dump tube exhaust systems make such a loud noise under WOT. All of the excess gasses are vented to the atmosphere through the wastegate dump tube.

I'm just telling you what we have observed from our vendors. AWD Motorsports is a prime example. We have a customer who did a back to back dyno results because he was mad he lost power when he switched from our dump to atmosphere to your wide mouth downpipe. He ended up switching back.

Honestly, I have never tested your downpipe. I'm just going strictly off of our vendors and customers.

I'm also not trying to argue with you, just state what I was trying to say.

Thanks,

Michael

 

Both are amazing. Personally, I'm going with ETS though.

 

I use parts from both companies.

 

why is it harder to tune when the air is that cold? i thought the cooler the charge the better?

 

I considered both AMS and ETS for Intercoolers. I wanted a direct bolt on type without having to trim the bumper beam for my daily driver '06 Evo MR with stock turbo (but am planning on upgrading to BBK Full). What I gathered is this:

AMS IC:
The bar and plate style core is 12.4" tall, 20" wide (28" with end tanks) and 3.625" thick with over 1250 cfm flow and only 1 psi pressure drop at 650 whp! This gives a cross section flow area of 45 inches square, the largest on the market that fits without cutting the bumper and it’s only 2% smaller than the competitions 4" thick race core! This intercooler has over 80% more internal flow area than its stock counterpart.

ETS Wide Tank IC:
22"x11.5"x3.5" Bar & Plate Core, 1115cfm-758hp at 80% efficiency (Direct Replacement)

There you have it. The ETS is like $599 and the AMS is $749.95. They both give you 80%+ efficiency, but the real difference is in the cfm. Are you willing to pay $150.95 more for 135+ cfm more? If so, then do it. If you're on a budget, then don't. Or buy the ETS and then invest the rest in lower IC piping.

I honestly believe that AMS is the better product of the two, but for the price, c'mon. For a daily driver direct bolt on IC, ETS is the way to go because of pricing. For a racing car set up you'd probably wanna go at least 4" or more and we wouldn't even be talking about this. My opinion, it's a pissing contest at this point. Depending on how deep your pockets are, go with your gut! You'll be a winner either way.

 

It's the consistently of the tune, you can't always count on 40 degree charge temps pass after pass.

If you pay $100.00 more with our 4.0" core, it has way more CFM Granted both are going to be great products.

We have spent a ton of time and money R&Ding our core.


Here is a quick pick of our core inventory, this is at the new shop, so it's not all on the shelf's yet.

 

hrmmmm still split on the down pipe....

is there a diff in spool up for either dp?

is either one faster for any reason? i wont get the dump dp for sure i can have the extra noise ahaha dont wana draw too much attention as its my dd it will have to be a recirc dp

 

+1 for AMS....I mentioned earlier I was a bit disappointed that their prices have gone up so much, but frankly they make good shit! They have the best, if not one of the best, reputations and like someone also mentioned, high resale second hand value...can't count how many people not into Evo's or the turbo community have heard of AMS and the stuff they do..

 

Horry chit!! that's a lot of product

 

I got my first ETS part! It was some kind of alluminum shield for something... lol. The rest of it comes tomorrow!

 

Wish I could stroll through the ETS and AMS warehouse, I'll prolly drool all over the damn place lol. I love my ETS stuff and my AMS stuff. Both companies make amazing products when it comes down to efficiency/durability/craftsmanship and the best part of it all is that I never had any problems dealing with Michael@Ets nor Dan@Ams, both are great guys and willing to help you out.

 

i just picked up some ETS ic pipes. great craftsmanship. i plan on mounting it to an AMS ic. cant wait

 

The wastegate is open to control boost, doesn't matter if you're WOT or part throttle. If it was open all the time under WOT then you wouldn't be very happy with the spool as you mashed the gas pedal.

It opens at a certain boost level and bypasses the turbine to keep shaft speed down to the desired boost level. What happens if you're trying to make max power on a FP red for example? I guarantee you the amount of WG bleed at high RPM and high boost is minimal. The only reason it's opening is because the exh. manifold pressure is overcoming the wastegate actuator spring pressure and the flapper door is bleeding a small amount out, so yes you will hear the slight bleed of from this in an external dump setup.

When we designed our widemouth we tested it against a few downpipes and ours came out the highest. I don't think we've tested it against an external downpipe though but I have run cars with ext. dumps and normal downpipes on EVO VIII's & IX's. External dumps will pick up a little power when running on lower boost levels (like pump gas), because you're effectively creating a larger exhaust right after the turbo (where you need it the most). You now have the downpipe flowing turbine exh. gas and the ext. WG pipe flowing the WG exh flow.

The downside of course is that it's extremely loud when open and in my opinion doesn't sound very good, I try to stay away from it on daily driven street cars.

I'm not trying to argue either, just stating facts and explaining on how things work.

-Martin

 

LOL @ this conversation. Let me try:


When spooling up a stock turbo evo X, the flapper door is CLOSED. If you have an MBC set to 20 psi for example, once there is 20 psi of pressure in the charge pipes, the wastegate is going to OPEN, hence creating the large sound. So the wastegate door opens up at full boost. I'm not saying its open 100%, it prob isn't. Because I'm sure it could run at 10 psi where it would be flowing more exhaust gas (bypassing the turbine) to keep the boost down.

To say the flapper door is closed or almost closed at full boost is not correct. External gates work the same way, they are open at full boost (whatever the boost is set to). The gate is what is keeping the boost AT THAT LEVEL!!





Now what Martin said describes something different. Lets say you wanted to run 35 psi of boost on a stock evoX turbo. As the hrpm's got higher, the amount of exhaust gas being bottle necked into the turbine house will cause back pressure. Eventually that backpressure can exceed the spring pressure of the wastegate. It that happens, then it will literally push the flapper door open from the inside, instead of the pressurized air from the pressure source forcing the diaphragm open. The gate being forced open would cause the amount of exhaust gas driving the turbine to decrease, hence lowering shaft speed as well as the compressor wheel which in turn, lower boost. This is why companies like FP make the stiffer actuators. To "HOLD" boost at higher rpm's, or hold the flapper door closed from the increased exhaust volume.