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EVO Aerodynamics Review

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Old Sep 23, 2014 | 10:52 PM
  #301  
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From: CA
Originally Posted by rawkus
Coming from a Kognition wing, the APR GT-1000 is pretty impressive so far.

Dan
That's essentially what the Ciro Design wing I have is. APR GT-1000 element w/ custom Ciro uprights and endplates.



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Old Sep 24, 2014 | 05:39 AM
  #302  
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From: Brazil
Originally Posted by rawkus
Think about how the loads of the wing go through the chassis and then you'll realize a split wing design is completely, utterly dumb. Now a solid, active aero wing on the other hand can be brilliant.

Dan
I like the idea of a dynamic wing helping on braking zone. The R.Dynamic is on my list. But why do you think the split wing is dumb? I haven't given much thought to it but seems a pretty slick idea - although the gains on track time are small for the cost. The monopiece dynamic wing takes 1sec off a lap and for the double amount of money you get a split wing and only a couple 0,01sec less.
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Old Sep 24, 2014 | 06:12 AM
  #303  
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From: Cedarburg, WI
Originally Posted by rawkus
This helps with loads pushing down, but not the loads trying to rip the wing/trunk backwards.

Dan
That's what hood pins on the front edge are good for! with a stock truck tho it's never going to pull the trunk off!
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Old Sep 24, 2014 | 08:50 AM
  #304  
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From: Tucson
Originally Posted by jerdeitzel
GTA, This is a kognition wing mount that used to help make it rigid. I used a bolt with a washer welded too it so the trunk rest on it when closed. The bar then is welded under the lip and too the floor so the lip doesn't flex. Basically it turns the trunk mount into a chassie mount once closed.
That was what I was thinking about doing. Thanks for the pics.. Is your bump pad for the trunk adjustible?
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Old Sep 24, 2014 | 09:13 AM
  #305  
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Originally Posted by GTABurnout
That was what I was thinking about doing. Thanks for the pics.. Is your bump pad for the trunk adjustible?
Go to a hardware store and get a coupling nut + various lengths of bolts and a jam nut. Thread the coupling nut onto the thread from the wing mount and voila, play with it until it is snug against the trunk frame.
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Old Sep 24, 2014 | 12:25 PM
  #306  
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From: Tucson
Originally Posted by nollij
Go to a hardware store and get a coupling nut + various lengths of bolts and a jam nut. Thread the coupling nut onto the thread from the wing mount and voila, play with it until it is snug against the trunk frame.
awesome I picture it now. I will try that and post up pics.
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Old Sep 24, 2014 | 03:03 PM
  #307  
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From: Lafayette, IN
Originally Posted by LCS
I like the idea of a dynamic wing helping on braking zone. The R.Dynamic is on my list. But why do you think the split wing is dumb? I haven't given much thought to it but seems a pretty slick idea - although the gains on track time are small for the cost. The monopiece dynamic wing takes 1sec off a lap and for the double amount of money you get a split wing and only a couple 0,01sec less.
So your wing splits to cause drag on one side of the vehicle to promote rotation, but also reduces downforce, which reduces grip that can be utilized for the turn. Because of how the forces translate through the uprights, there can be extremely little drag force converted into rotational movement, but a hell of a lot of downforce that was being utilized for cornering can be lost.

Dan
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Old Sep 24, 2014 | 03:05 PM
  #308  
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From: Lafayette, IN
Originally Posted by jerdeitzel
That's what hood pins on the front edge are good for! with a stock truck tho it's never going to pull the trunk off!
That's not a bad idea at all with the stock steel trunk lid, but care would have to be taken with any other material or it could fly off.


Dan
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Old Sep 24, 2014 | 04:45 PM
  #309  
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From: Brazil
Originally Posted by rawkus
So your wing splits to cause drag on one side of the vehicle to promote rotation, but also reduces downforce, which reduces grip that can be utilized for the turn. Because of how the forces translate through the uprights, there can be extremely little drag force converted into rotational movement, but a hell of a lot of downforce that was being utilized for cornering can be lost.

Dan
I think the point is the downforce on the inner side, not the less drag on the outer side. The downforce bias is made to compensate for the weight shift during corners.

Even if it looks nice on paper, the cost is steep for a couple of 1/100s. I'd take a solid dynamic wing any time of the day.
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Old Sep 24, 2014 | 05:29 PM
  #310  
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From: Lafayette, IN
Originally Posted by LCS
I think the point is the downforce on the inner side, not the less drag on the outer side. The downforce bias is made to compensate for the weight shift during corners.

Even if it looks nice on paper, the cost is steep for a couple of 1/100s. I'd take a solid dynamic wing any time of the day.
I see what you're saying... regardless, why would you ever want less downforce in a turn? I agree completely that a solid dynamic wing is the way to go!

Dan
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Old Sep 25, 2014 | 09:40 AM
  #311  
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From: Lafayette, IN
Here's a little something else we're working on.
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Old Sep 26, 2014 | 02:22 PM
  #312  
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Originally Posted by psushoe
What are you guys doing about the drag force loads? The downforce would push down on the trunk lid, and the reinforcements under the lip and large pads for load distribution on the trunk lid address that. The drag on the wing would create a moment on the attachment point, pulling up on the front of the mount. This would not be helped by the distribution pad, unless there was one on the inside of the lid, too.

EDIT: The distribution pad might help a little, buy increasing distance from the rear most contact of the mount to the forward most fastener.... but not sure if that is enough.
Hey Aaron,

We recommend using a hood pin type fastener in the front area of the trunk mount. Fairly typical practice in World Challenge.

Rick
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Old Sep 26, 2014 | 03:13 PM
  #313  
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Originally Posted by SS RX7 r2
Hey Aaron,

We recommend using a hood pin type fastener in the front area of the trunk mount. Fairly typical practice in World Challenge.

Rick
Are you talking to fasten the trunk near the wing mount to the car frame?

I saw a Miata with a turnbuckle and steel cable attached to the front of the trunk once. Not particularly what I was going for but that would support from the drag forces as well.
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Old Sep 29, 2014 | 01:14 PM
  #314  
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From: SoCal
Originally Posted by nollij
Are you talking to fasten the trunk near the wing mount to the car frame?

I saw a Miata with a turnbuckle and steel cable attached to the front of the trunk once. Not particularly what I was going for but that would support from the drag forces as well.
The pin would go through the front mount, or through a plate under the mount. Pin would be attached to a bracket mounted under the fender/ trunk rain gutter. Keeps the center of the trunk from bowing up.

Of course a brace down to the frame supporting the area under the wing, would be strongest, but may not be needed on metal trunk lids.

We'll probably incorporate the hood-pin hole into our next Evo trunk mount bracket, which still would use the stock wing mounting holes.

Rick

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Old Sep 29, 2014 | 01:22 PM
  #315  
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hey, Rick. you have an email, brotha!
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