TrEvoRS

iTrader: (5)

I have been reading the STU and SM prep threads and read most of the other similar threads as well. I want to prepare a competitive STU and NASA TT car that will also serve as a daily driver for a father of two. I was decided on Vishnu/Ohlins, but now they are not available. My next alternative is Zzyzx, but I don’t think I can afford those. What I basically need is:

1- Competitive in both Solo and TT (I know there is a compromise in set-up here)
2- Does not ride worse than stock (Another compromise -at least at my price range, but is a must in my case)
3- Easy to set-up and long service life. I don’t want to mess up with it constantly and service it every year.

Read a lot of good things about Robispec KW’s but it looks like people are constantly having them serviced (I guess mostly set-up related) for one reason or the other (I may be wrong). Then of course there are all those other KW/Ohlins/DMS/tein/etc systems from many different vendors. All claim to have their own specs.

I will not buy Megan’s, but I don’t want to spend much over 3k either. Can I get some ideas from people who have experience with various options out there?

Thank you!
Akad

Warrtalon

iTrader: (6)

1) I have the Ohlins you speak of and had the same desire of being HIGHLY competitive in both SM and NASA TTS. For you, you will be much less modded in order to be in STU, so you'll probably be able to stay in TTA, although it's a very tough class (aren't they all?). I know the Ohlins aren't available, so maybe one of Robispec's staged packages in the same price range? If you want to stay in the sub-$2k range, then go with the PIC/Pure Tuning TSOs for $1550.

2) I cannot imagine having a competitive setup that does not ride worse than stock. My 700lb/900lb springs are nothing like the stock Bilstein setup - they are very stiff and rough compared to stock, but that's part of what it takes to be REALLY fast. However, I do drive my car on this setup daily to work and for everything else, including a Recaro baby seat in the rear.

3) I don't consider mine easy to setup, but that's relative to the individual. It took 16 hours to install and setup everything (coils, springs, camber plates, tophats, bushings, fender rolling, corner weighting, alignment X2). However, due to Paul's rigorous testing, I don't have to make changes other than playing with damper click settings and tire pressure. I also get it re-aligned every few events, since things get knocked out of whack some...

Dave Mac

iTrader: (2)

The quality of the damper is going to make a huge difference in performance. Do not get any Chinese made crap. Stick to KW, Ohlins, Tein, JRZ or Bilstein. Actually now that you mention it Bilstein may be the best route. KW's are good but you have to know how to adjust them to get better traction. Give a call to GT Worx and they'll help you out. Talk to Andrew or Mike. See my signature for their website.

russjnco

iTrader: (36)

Rick can probably chime in on the Bilsteins but I think that would probably be your best bet as well.

GTWORX.com

iTrader: (35)

I'm a big fan of KW's, but the problem with them for NASA TT is the fact that they have piggyback canisters, which costs you a few more points. Double adjustability is nice, but yes, can get tricky.

You do have to go pretty stiff to be competitive, especially in STU.

Servicing Ohlins/KW/Koni is not going to be an issue. All have American rebuild/revalve centers with very knowledgable people. Intervals are faily long, too.

I would go with Ohlins Sportlines (which are easily available, although i guess Warr is talking about the Vishnu Ohlins). We've used Ohlins extensively, and although we do not have a custom valved set-up of our own, we have experimented with spring rates and found a few great set-ups for different uses. We hope to become an authorized Ohlins rebuild/revalve center within the next year, but in the meantime, we've been pretty happy with the standard valving on the Ohlins Sportlines, especially the just updated DFV Sportlines.

Set-up is a good bit simpler then it would be with KW's, since these are only rebound adjustable.


- Andrew

TrEvoRS

iTrader: (5)

Thank you, already some excellent feedback!!

Warr, it is the first time I hear of PIC/Pure Tuning TSOs. They look very promising, but maybe a little less suitable for daily driving? I have a RS, so it already rides quite a bit worse than the stock Bilstein set-up. I bought this on the promise that it will double as a family car when needed (lol!) so I need to keep the ride as is (or not noticably worse). Do you know how would ohlins DFV's from Works or GTWorx compare to Vishnu/Ohlins?

Dave, I like the Bilsteins, but remember reading somewhere that their optimum spring rate range is lower than some comparable systems. It is a plus that they are easier to set-up than KW's.

Andrew, I don't see Ohlins on your website. Would they be similar in price to PSS9/KWV3's? Which of the three (Bilstein/KW/Ohlins) would work better with springs in the 500f/600r range (for competition and DD)? And would one have a longer service life than the other? I will probably give you a call anyway but thought I would ask some basics here for the benefit of everyone.

Dave Mac

iTrader: (2)

500/600lb range would work with the KW's/Bilstein PSS9's or Ohlins. If you go with the KW's you need to totally ignore the KW recommended adjustments though.

Dieman

iTrader: (3)

I know you said the ZZYZX stuff is out of your price range but that sounds like exactly what you are trying to describe. The ride is HARDLY comprimised at all using 700+ pound springs front and rear in my car. Some people think my car rides better than the stock Bilstiens. I'd say it's a pretty competitive set-up in terms of racing too. Also, Steve is so good about customer service. I know Chris and I both bug him a lot during the day on the phone and he always takes the time to explain things to me. I couldn't imagine running somehting else to be honest.

992gnt

iTrader: (5)

I've been very happy with the PIC's, and they are located in Chicago. Al and Jim are very knowledgeable, and extremely helpful. They are at just about every NASA event in the Midwest and OH/IN region to help with setup questions, etc. And if an issue with a strut should arise, they send you a new one then you send them back the old one. Pure Tuning will send you all the specs as far as alignment, sway bar settings, etc. Bolt them on, get it aligned, and go have fun.

Daily ride is passable, but like any competition setup, it will be stiffer than stock on the softest settings. If you get something soft and squishy for the commute, you won't have enough spring and dampening for the track.

Balrok

iTrader: (15)

I've been asked the same question several times as far as keeping the DD/Family 4 door style while making it a sleeper for the track, and its REALLY hard to do. 992 and warr have excellent points and he does very well at the track. Basically i've boiled it down to two paths to take.

A. You can get a softer setup that will improve your turn in etc. but you have to become a very good driver to compensate and know the track/tires/all the rest very well. In other words you won't be competitive at first but you'll need to be patient. Most would recomm. this as it makes you faster and not the car.

B. You can get a racing setup right off the bat and let the car do "its thing," be quite competitive with less skills, and get that much faster/better as you go. With this you will have a rougher ride yes, but in my honest opinion the evo IS a race car, and even stock (GSR/RS) suspension was rough for everyone i know. So i said to hell with it, they are gonna complain anyways so i'll do what 'I' wanted to in the first place when i bought the car.

Have fun regardless bro.

GTWORX.com

iTrader: (35)

We took the old PCV ones down and are just now getting around to putting the DFV Ohlins up.....but they are on our other website www.racecompengineering.com and we have a vendor thread. I'll add them now though!

The Ohlins are more expensive then both the KW's and the Bilsteins, but do come with camber plates and rear pillowball mounts.

Bilsteins may need to be revalved for those rates. KW's and Ohlins can handle them without a problem.

All three should be very close in terms of service intervals.

Ours do use off the shelf valving, but we have used them with 500lb/600lb rates (and more) and we've been very pleased.


- Andrew

DaWorstPlaya

iTrader: (31)

Without trying to state the obvious, the questions you pose is the same issues most people struggle with, having excellent street ride with a competetive auto-x and track setup. Unfortunately anything you choose will have to be a compromise in one area or the other. You can have great street comfort but will have to give up a little edge at auto-x and track. Or you can have good track performance but will have to give up a little bit of comfort. The difference is, with the higher quality stuff you can almost have the best of both world, almost. With the cheapo crap its one or the other despite what people say.

The valving on the Bilsteins are more street friendly and are a little too soft for the track. They can't handle too much of a spring rate change without needing a revalve.
KW V3s are good coilovers for the money but the piggy back reserviour on the KW V3s will cost you extra points in NASA.
The Ohlins Sportline with DFV is will most likely be a step up from the Vishnu Ohlins since the Vishnu setup was based on the older PCV design. The DFV design is a newer and better design. Plus the new Sportline series with DFV are monotube, have seperate spring preload and height adjustability. Since they cost less than $3000 will be less points in NASA. This is the same as the Works Stage 3 package without the custom work Works does.

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=279431

SS RX7 r2

iTrader: (1)

As others have said, the Bilstein PSS9s have a supple ride, this due to their unique valving design. You can go up to 600lbs with the stock valving. The springs supplied are good for hi-perf road use ~ 450#s. Even with the higher rates the ride is comparable to a stock GSR/RS. I've had them for 2 1/2 years with no issues.

GTWORX carries them