E-85 and EcuFlash
Updates during cold winter?
PVD04,
I see that you are in Illinois like me, so since we just went through a couple of weeks with subzero air temperatures, not to mention like -30 wind chills, how much trouble, if any, did you have starting your car on e-85? I'm pretty sure the winter blend over here is more like e-70, but I'm curious if you had any problems starting in the cold. I'm very interested in converting to e-85 (a pump is about 5 mins from me) and just want to gather as much data as I can. Also, do you have stock ignition setup (coils, etc)?
Also, I have another question that I can't wrap my head around for some reason:
E-85 is electrically conductive, whereas gasoline is not. Our fuel pumps are in-tank fuel pumps and our wiring to the pump is exposed. So, I think I may just be missing something obvious here, but whats keeping the + and - on the pump from shorting out and either blowing a fuse or worse yet, starting a fire/explosion (small chance with lack of enough O2 in tank)?
I've been reading up a bit on the GM FFV vehicles and some research papers where some college students have been converting cars for class projects, and I have seen a few mentions of GM electrically shielded fuel pumps. A brief search for these didn't turn up much more information. That's the only thing that has me somewhat confused/worried at this point. The rest I am comforatable with. Can anyone clear this up for me?
Thanks,
Eric
I see that you are in Illinois like me, so since we just went through a couple of weeks with subzero air temperatures, not to mention like -30 wind chills, how much trouble, if any, did you have starting your car on e-85? I'm pretty sure the winter blend over here is more like e-70, but I'm curious if you had any problems starting in the cold. I'm very interested in converting to e-85 (a pump is about 5 mins from me) and just want to gather as much data as I can. Also, do you have stock ignition setup (coils, etc)?
Also, I have another question that I can't wrap my head around for some reason:
E-85 is electrically conductive, whereas gasoline is not. Our fuel pumps are in-tank fuel pumps and our wiring to the pump is exposed. So, I think I may just be missing something obvious here, but whats keeping the + and - on the pump from shorting out and either blowing a fuse or worse yet, starting a fire/explosion (small chance with lack of enough O2 in tank)?
I've been reading up a bit on the GM FFV vehicles and some research papers where some college students have been converting cars for class projects, and I have seen a few mentions of GM electrically shielded fuel pumps. A brief search for these didn't turn up much more information. That's the only thing that has me somewhat confused/worried at this point. The rest I am comforatable with. Can anyone clear this up for me?
Thanks,
Eric
Last edited by l2r99gst; Feb 11, 2007 at 06:48 PM.
Thanks for the info on the LEL and UEL. That's part of the data that I was missing. Doing a quick search, it looks like E85 may be 1.4% - 19%.
But, OK, that should settle the potential for fire/explosion given that not enough oxygen is present (like I assumed), but what about the electrically conductive properties of E-85? Why wouldn't the pump circuit be shorted out upon contact with the fuel?
Eric
But, OK, that should settle the potential for fire/explosion given that not enough oxygen is present (like I assumed), but what about the electrically conductive properties of E-85? Why wouldn't the pump circuit be shorted out upon contact with the fuel?
Eric
Last edited by l2r99gst; Feb 11, 2007 at 08:12 PM.
PVD04,
I see that you are in Illinois like me, so since we just went through a couple of weeks with subzero air temperatures, not to mention like -30 wind chills, how much trouble, if any, did you have starting your car on e-85? I'm pretty sure the winter blend over here is more like e-70, but I'm curious if you had any problems starting in the cold. I'm very interested in converting to e-85 (a pump is about 5 mins from me) and just want to gather as much data as I can. Also, do you have stock ignition setup (coils, etc)?
I see that you are in Illinois like me, so since we just went through a couple of weeks with subzero air temperatures, not to mention like -30 wind chills, how much trouble, if any, did you have starting your car on e-85? I'm pretty sure the winter blend over here is more like e-70, but I'm curious if you had any problems starting in the cold. I'm very interested in converting to e-85 (a pump is about 5 mins from me) and just want to gather as much data as I can. Also, do you have stock ignition setup (coils, etc)?
-Paul
So I have 880 injectors scaled right now to 790's in ECUFlash. What would I scale them to if I converted to E85? Also if I converted to E85 am I still looking for the same A/F's as on 110 gas tuning wise (i.e. WOT 12.0-12.3a/f and 14.7 cruising a/f?)
It'll take a little trial and error to figure out where to scale them. You could start around 500 and work from there.
The A/F ratios you listed would work fine on E85.
Also for perspective my 1000cc are scaled to 609.
http://www.e85mustangs.com/tuning.html
"If you already have a standard gasoline AFR meter hooked to a wideband O2 sensor, you can still use the displayed gasoline AFRs in determining your engine's true AFR. For example, if your gasoline meter is showing 14.7, then we know this is Lamda of 1.0. The equivelent on the E85 side is around 9.7. Therefore you can effectively use existing gasoline AFR components or software to tune an E85 evo without buying special equipment."
"If you already have a standard gasoline AFR meter hooked to a wideband O2 sensor, you can still use the displayed gasoline AFRs in determining your engine's true AFR. For example, if your gasoline meter is showing 14.7, then we know this is Lamda of 1.0. The equivelent on the E85 side is around 9.7. Therefore you can effectively use existing gasoline AFR components or software to tune an E85 evo without buying special equipment."
I used the injector scaling to create an across the board adjustment and then did fine tuning from there. My fuel maps won't do you much good because I'm using the MaftPro to run speed density. I currently have my injectors scaled to 609 and the same latency I had with gasoline. Beyond that it's pretty much the same as tuning gasoline.
-Paul
Evolving Member
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 203
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From: Midland Mich
no, turbo f4i is so big and heavy and doesn't make any more power then a non turbo f4i on 93. weight is the name of the game in formula sae. cost, complexity, reliability, weight are all worse when you turbo the 4fi. the f4i on 93 will already max out the restrictor, so if your drivers can shift theres no need for a wider power band.
our 06 car was super light with the 250 turbo. the car weighed 395 pounds without the wings, not using any titanium, and a steel tubeframe. and it made 73 hp (which generally the other sub 400 pound cars were all single cylinder cars making 40hp at best. with the wings and other last second bull**** it weighed 450lbs.
the 06 wings were much more effective then any other years, with the car being able to pull 1.8g's in a 200 ft skidpad. previous years were significantly slower.
the problem with the 250 is it is really unreliable and only myself and our engine lead had any idea what was going on with that engine package. dr. bob the self claimed "king of the world" at engine tuning had no idea what was going on, as shown by his poor showing of the 06 car at the texas autocross weekend. and yes, he was the one telling the team what to do, and the one tuning the car after california (also a week before california while i was at a friends wedding... thats why our engines all blew when i was gone, and thats why we never had a running car in cali... but thats another story)
our 06 car was super light with the 250 turbo. the car weighed 395 pounds without the wings, not using any titanium, and a steel tubeframe. and it made 73 hp (which generally the other sub 400 pound cars were all single cylinder cars making 40hp at best. with the wings and other last second bull**** it weighed 450lbs.
the 06 wings were much more effective then any other years, with the car being able to pull 1.8g's in a 200 ft skidpad. previous years were significantly slower.
the problem with the 250 is it is really unreliable and only myself and our engine lead had any idea what was going on with that engine package. dr. bob the self claimed "king of the world" at engine tuning had no idea what was going on, as shown by his poor showing of the 06 car at the texas autocross weekend. and yes, he was the one telling the team what to do, and the one tuning the car after california (also a week before california while i was at a friends wedding... thats why our engines all blew when i was gone, and thats why we never had a running car in cali... but thats another story)
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