4g64 2.1L Build Up
Originally Posted by Ted B
What's interesting about the 2.1L vs. a 2.0L aside from the nominal 5% increase in displacement is the fact that the 2.1L uses the same 88 mm stroke with a longer rod, which would theoretically improve the potential for high rpm efficiency. This option is perhaps best suited for those who intend to wring lots of rpm out of it for the purposes of being able to stay in 4th gear for dragstrip racing with a big turbo and enough power to run 125+ mph traps. This setup would make good use of head porting, long duration cams, and an aftermarket intake manifold with shorter runners, all of which will be most helpful toward maintaining the flattest possible torque curve in the upper rpm ranges, which directly increases high rpm hp.
Rod/Stroke ratio comparison:
4G64 w/ 4G63 crank - 2.1L - 1.77
4G63 - 2.0L - 1.71
4G63 w/ 4G64 crank - 2.3L - 1.5
In contrast, the small rod/stroke ratio of the popular 2.3L stroker will give the greatest mechanical efficiency at low and midrange rpm, which makes it best suited for street action and road racing, where transient response and a wide powerband are most useful.
Rod/Stroke ratio comparison:
4G64 w/ 4G63 crank - 2.1L - 1.77
4G63 - 2.0L - 1.71
4G63 w/ 4G64 crank - 2.3L - 1.5
In contrast, the small rod/stroke ratio of the popular 2.3L stroker will give the greatest mechanical efficiency at low and midrange rpm, which makes it best suited for street action and road racing, where transient response and a wide powerband are most useful.
Fun stuff
Originally Posted by Ted B
This setup would make good use of head porting, long duration cams, and an aftermarket intake manifold with shorter runners
Originally Posted by SlowboyMR
Curt Brown is running one of our 2.1 destroked motors we built for him.. you will see.. we have ran one on our AWD dsm and it took 10k like a champ!
anyone email me if you are interested mas@slowboyracing.com
mark
SBR
anyone email me if you are interested mas@slowboyracing.com
mark
SBR
The three that come to mind are the Magnus, AMS, and BJ's. AFAIK, all of those have shorter intake runners and greater plenum volume. That isn't necessarily what you'd want for a street driven car (won't spool as quickly), but fits the bill for drag racing where a large turbo and lots of rpm are required.
Originally Posted by joeymia
BTW do you have any pictures/instruction of the modifications needed for the alternator and water pump for the block? I would love to know what to expect before I drop the block in since this is my daily driver and I will only have friday, saturday, and sunday to get everything working.
Mark
SBR
Originally Posted by SlowboyMR
alt arent a problem.. but you need a shim plate for teh water pump.. Its like 16gs and you will need a 2.4 water pump gasekt to go to the block. then use your 2.0 waterpump.
Mark
SBR
Mark
SBR
I will take a ton of pictures when I get to that stage of the build.
I will most likely only shift at 8k+ going from 3rd to 4th. Right now I take my motor up to 8500 and shift just fine from 3rd to 4th. I have a Tilton Twin Disc, Kartboy Short Shifter, Kartboy Bushings and run Penzoil Syncromesh with some Redline Heavy Duty Shockproof mixed in.
Evolved Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,137
Likes: 2
From: Oxnard Ca.
Originally Posted by SuperHatch
Do you people understand how these motors work?
A 4G64 has an 86.5mm bore and 100mm stroke
A 4G63 has an 85.0mm bore and 88mm stroke
The bore is dictated by the piston/block selection.
The stroke is dictated by the crank. The cranks are interchangeable between the two motors.
Stock 4G64:
An 86.5mm piston has a cross sectional area of ~5877mm^2, times 4 pistons is ~23508mm^2, times 100mm stroke is ~2350800mm^3 which is ~2.35L or 2.4L, voila!!!
Stock 4G63:
An 85mm piston has a cross sectional area of ~5675mm^2, times 4 pistons is ~22700mm^2, times an 88mm stroke is 1997600mm^3 which is 1.99L or 2.0L, magic, right!?
To STROKE a 4g63 you put a longer stroke crank in it. A 100mm crank from a 4G64.... do the math again.
4G63 STROKER:
An 85mm piston has a cross sectional area of ~5675mm^2, times 4 pistons is ~22700mm^2, times a new longer 100mm stroke is 2270000mm^3 which is 2.27L or 2.3L, amazing!!!
You CANNOT DEstroke a 4G63 because there is no shorter stroke crank readily available!
You CAN DEstroke a 4G64 with a 4G63 crank! Do the math again....
4G64 DEstroker:
An 86.5mm piston has a cross sectional area of ~5877mm^2, times 4 pistons is ~23508mm^2, times a SHORTER 88mm stroke is ~2068704mm^3 which is ~2.06L or 2.1L, incredible!!!
Why do this?? The destroker is essentially a 4G63 with a taller deck height (read: londer rods decrease rod angle creating less cylinder side loads = higher RPM tolerance) and punched out 1.5mm for a bit more displacement.
Geometry is fun!!!
- Steve
A 4G64 has an 86.5mm bore and 100mm stroke
A 4G63 has an 85.0mm bore and 88mm stroke
The bore is dictated by the piston/block selection.
The stroke is dictated by the crank. The cranks are interchangeable between the two motors.
Stock 4G64:
An 86.5mm piston has a cross sectional area of ~5877mm^2, times 4 pistons is ~23508mm^2, times 100mm stroke is ~2350800mm^3 which is ~2.35L or 2.4L, voila!!!
Stock 4G63:
An 85mm piston has a cross sectional area of ~5675mm^2, times 4 pistons is ~22700mm^2, times an 88mm stroke is 1997600mm^3 which is 1.99L or 2.0L, magic, right!?
To STROKE a 4g63 you put a longer stroke crank in it. A 100mm crank from a 4G64.... do the math again.
4G63 STROKER:
An 85mm piston has a cross sectional area of ~5675mm^2, times 4 pistons is ~22700mm^2, times a new longer 100mm stroke is 2270000mm^3 which is 2.27L or 2.3L, amazing!!!
You CANNOT DEstroke a 4G63 because there is no shorter stroke crank readily available!
You CAN DEstroke a 4G64 with a 4G63 crank! Do the math again....
4G64 DEstroker:
An 86.5mm piston has a cross sectional area of ~5877mm^2, times 4 pistons is ~23508mm^2, times a SHORTER 88mm stroke is ~2068704mm^3 which is ~2.06L or 2.1L, incredible!!!
Why do this?? The destroker is essentially a 4G63 with a taller deck height (read: londer rods decrease rod angle creating less cylinder side loads = higher RPM tolerance) and punched out 1.5mm for a bit more displacement.
Geometry is fun!!!
- Steve
I Learn something NEW everyday!!!! Good Info.
Question to some of the old timers out there....
Would the 4G61t crank interchange like the 63 and 64 cranks? It's a 75.5mm stroke btw....
4G64 "Double-D"stroker:
An 86.5mm piston has a cross sectional area of ~5877mm^2, times 4 pistons is ~23508mm^2, times an EVEN SHORTER 75.5mm stroke is ~1774854mm^3 which is ~1.77L or 1.8L...
Would the 4G61t crank interchange like the 63 and 64 cranks? It's a 75.5mm stroke btw....
4G64 "Double-D"stroker:
An 86.5mm piston has a cross sectional area of ~5877mm^2, times 4 pistons is ~23508mm^2, times an EVEN SHORTER 75.5mm stroke is ~1774854mm^3 which is ~1.77L or 1.8L...
Evolving Member
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 294
Likes: 0
From: Kent, WA
Originally Posted by SuperHatch
Question to some of the old timers out there....
Would the 4G61t crank interchange like the 63 and 64 cranks? It's a 75.5mm stroke btw....
Would the 4G61t crank interchange like the 63 and 64 cranks? It's a 75.5mm stroke btw....
Wait a second. Am I missing something here? Are you guys talking about swapping in a 4g64 block into an Evo? Will an Evo head actually fit on this type of block, or will a dsm head have to be mounted? I am very confused...