DIY Transmission Re-Build Tips
Jul 27, 2009, 11:05 AM
#35
So how exactly are you guys shimming these? ANY time you replace a gear or any part on the tranny shafts you have to shim them to spec. Not one of you has mentioned ordering shims (since you can't know which one you will use until you reassemble the tranny and do a solder test.) This includes the input, output and center diff shafts.
SCARY stuff reading this rookie DIY thread.
Also you guys are over paying big time for your parts from the sources that have been listed in this thread. Also does everyone realize you need access to a shop press and special tools to remove and install the bearings and gears?
The cost savings is HUGE doing it yourself with the right part sources but from what I see so far, some of this should have been thought out more and researched more. The EVO tranny is not as pin point as it seems. A grinding 4th gear does not mean syncros replacement.. it means syncro, speed gear, syncro ring, syncro sleeve, and possibly hub. Any time an evo with more then 20k is down for a tranny rebuild the input shaft bearings should be replaced, they eat these things like candy. I can go on and on, fluids, assembly short cuts, and so on.
SCARY stuff reading this rookie DIY thread.
Also you guys are over paying big time for your parts from the sources that have been listed in this thread. Also does everyone realize you need access to a shop press and special tools to remove and install the bearings and gears?
The cost savings is HUGE doing it yourself with the right part sources but from what I see so far, some of this should have been thought out more and researched more. The EVO tranny is not as pin point as it seems. A grinding 4th gear does not mean syncros replacement.. it means syncro, speed gear, syncro ring, syncro sleeve, and possibly hub. Any time an evo with more then 20k is down for a tranny rebuild the input shaft bearings should be replaced, they eat these things like candy. I can go on and on, fluids, assembly short cuts, and so on.
Last edited by Nasty Evolution; Jul 27, 2009 at 11:13 AM.
The following users liked this post:
Icecruncher (Nov 19, 2023)
Jul 27, 2009, 11:59 AM
#36
Well quit your *****ing and school on then... everyone loves to listen to those who are obviously brilliant. Nobody wants to listen to those who always want to TELL you they are brilliant. Hoping you are the former on this subject matter. If you find fault, correct it in a positive way. I TOO was worried about the shimming aspect (if needed), however have no PERSONAL experience to offer as I shipped mine out to have a professional do it right (time for some freshening though). If someone could SHOW me the proper way to do it right, I have the tools required to help out myself, and maybe some locals (when the EXTREME heat dies down here). So preach on my man, but keep it positive and informative as we'd ALL like to know the right way (esp in this increasingly plummeting economy).
Last edited by Zeus; Jul 27, 2009 at 12:02 PM.
The following users liked this post:
WestPalmEVO (Aug 3, 2019)
Jul 27, 2009, 03:03 PM
#39
Yeah no worries I was at work, could not make a huge post but wanted to gather some attention for those who are reading..Sometimes you gotta be blunt and throw up flags for people to see. (it worked). I'd be happy to lend my help on the matter just as I mentioned on page 1.
It would be easier for me if anyone who has already posted that needs help post up what your problem is/was once you get the tranny apart or if you need some help on what to look for once you get it apart. (I advise taking pics of things as you take them off or apart since your tranny may be apart for days or even weeks waiting on parts.
I've got all the specs for bearing preload and end play. Most of all the part numbers. I've also got ideas for tools to use as long as you have a shop press with atleast 5 tons of power. I'm a machinest and made my own. I'll post up pics of the tools I made and used tomorrow since they are sitting at my work.
I'll dig up my notes and post the method I used for measuring the preload and end play for the bearings. It's kind of a tricky process and gets confusing, the FSM does not really cover it very well.. IMO.
I know I'm missing some stuff so if you have a question or are unsure about something just post it up. I'll do my best to help out.
To those who think the rebuilding a tranny would be a crazy job.. it's really not all that bad. Looking at in a book makes it look scary but it's a very well designed and user friendly job for the most part as long as you have the tools to do it. Off the top of my head I used :
* 5" or 6" bearing seperator/splitter, but it's not 100% needed if you are not trying to save your bearings. If you plan to install all new you can use other methods since the bearing puller can be rather pricey to use it so rarely.
* Shop press the one I used was a 20 ton, friend of mine used a 50 ton. I believe the job could be done with 6 ton, maybe less.
* Good quality lock ring pliers, I picked mine up at an Advance Auto part store for less than $20.00 Please see the pic, http://www.tooltopia.com/index.asp?P...gn=shopping_r1 these are not the same as a snap ring or circlips pliers. These can be a PITA, and you WILL damage yourself if you try using screwdrivers to remove these. Some people say these are throw away clips but if you do it right they can be reused and I've yet to ever have a problem reusing them. If you're in doubt in any way order new lock rings. Measure your old rings with a micrometer since the lock rings actually act as a shim for the gear sets on the shaft.
* .062" diameter solder to check bearing race shims
* torque wrench and a 14mm socket
* 0-1' micrometer or a dial caliper with .001" readings on the dial.
* a tiny bit of wheel bearing or other thick grease (used to help hold the solder in place.)
* some method of cleaning up your tranny oil soaked parts as you remove them from the tranny. Either a parts washer or you can use brake cleaner and a rag.
* a seal puller (not needed but helps a lot) since I ALWAYS replace the input shaft seal for prevenative measures since it's cheap and no one wants oil on their clutch.
* bushings to press bearings on to the input and output shafts. I made mine
* Gasket scraper to remove old gasket material from tranny and lower cover, shifter cover
* new gasket material.. I used Hondabond, it's like RTV but much stiffer and wont rub off so easily
* tranny oil since you must coat the parts before you reassemble the tranny. The ONLY fluids you should be using are: Diaqueen tranny oil, Redline MTG-90 or MTL, or Amsoils MTF. That is it.. nothing else!
* lot of rags
I'm sure there is more and I will add more to this post as get to it.
Just as an FYI. I saved over $1000 doing my tranny rebuild myself since I needed to replace 3rd and 4th gear on top of a normal rebuild. At the VERY least you should save $400 just on parts and shipping cost over any of the shops out there. If you can carry your tranny into the shop and pick it up.. you will only save about $200 or so on a basic rebuild, more if you replace more parts like gears.
It would be easier for me if anyone who has already posted that needs help post up what your problem is/was once you get the tranny apart or if you need some help on what to look for once you get it apart. (I advise taking pics of things as you take them off or apart since your tranny may be apart for days or even weeks waiting on parts.
I've got all the specs for bearing preload and end play. Most of all the part numbers. I've also got ideas for tools to use as long as you have a shop press with atleast 5 tons of power. I'm a machinest and made my own. I'll post up pics of the tools I made and used tomorrow since they are sitting at my work.
I'll dig up my notes and post the method I used for measuring the preload and end play for the bearings. It's kind of a tricky process and gets confusing, the FSM does not really cover it very well.. IMO.
I know I'm missing some stuff so if you have a question or are unsure about something just post it up. I'll do my best to help out.
To those who think the rebuilding a tranny would be a crazy job.. it's really not all that bad. Looking at in a book makes it look scary but it's a very well designed and user friendly job for the most part as long as you have the tools to do it. Off the top of my head I used :
* 5" or 6" bearing seperator/splitter, but it's not 100% needed if you are not trying to save your bearings. If you plan to install all new you can use other methods since the bearing puller can be rather pricey to use it so rarely.
* Shop press the one I used was a 20 ton, friend of mine used a 50 ton. I believe the job could be done with 6 ton, maybe less.
* Good quality lock ring pliers, I picked mine up at an Advance Auto part store for less than $20.00 Please see the pic, http://www.tooltopia.com/index.asp?P...gn=shopping_r1 these are not the same as a snap ring or circlips pliers. These can be a PITA, and you WILL damage yourself if you try using screwdrivers to remove these. Some people say these are throw away clips but if you do it right they can be reused and I've yet to ever have a problem reusing them. If you're in doubt in any way order new lock rings. Measure your old rings with a micrometer since the lock rings actually act as a shim for the gear sets on the shaft.
* .062" diameter solder to check bearing race shims
* torque wrench and a 14mm socket
* 0-1' micrometer or a dial caliper with .001" readings on the dial.
* a tiny bit of wheel bearing or other thick grease (used to help hold the solder in place.)
* some method of cleaning up your tranny oil soaked parts as you remove them from the tranny. Either a parts washer or you can use brake cleaner and a rag.
* a seal puller (not needed but helps a lot) since I ALWAYS replace the input shaft seal for prevenative measures since it's cheap and no one wants oil on their clutch.
* bushings to press bearings on to the input and output shafts. I made mine
* Gasket scraper to remove old gasket material from tranny and lower cover, shifter cover
* new gasket material.. I used Hondabond, it's like RTV but much stiffer and wont rub off so easily
* tranny oil since you must coat the parts before you reassemble the tranny. The ONLY fluids you should be using are: Diaqueen tranny oil, Redline MTG-90 or MTL, or Amsoils MTF. That is it.. nothing else!
* lot of rags
I'm sure there is more and I will add more to this post as get to it.
Just as an FYI. I saved over $1000 doing my tranny rebuild myself since I needed to replace 3rd and 4th gear on top of a normal rebuild. At the VERY least you should save $400 just on parts and shipping cost over any of the shops out there. If you can carry your tranny into the shop and pick it up.. you will only save about $200 or so on a basic rebuild, more if you replace more parts like gears.
Last edited by Nasty Evolution; Jul 27, 2009 at 03:53 PM.
Jul 28, 2009, 05:49 AM
#41
How many miles were on your tranny? These cars seem to eat bearings like candy.. on the input shaft.. so much that they had to revise the bearings even. Every evo tranny I've gotten my hands on had bad bearings on the input shaft (clutch side mostly). When that happens they start to take out the shims and chip gear teeth from the extra slop on the shafts. I also believe it may be a part of the cause for the 1st gear whine a lot of evo owners are getting. The type of clutch you have also has a HUGE relationship to what is going to wear out in the tranny. I just rebuild a 40k tranny that had a quarter master clutch and it caused about $600 in extra damage. The horrid vibrations and drag from the quarter master caused the 5th drive gear to vibrate and wear out the splines on the gear and the mating shaft, junking both the shaft and gear, damaged the input and output shaft bearings, (output shaft bearings rarely go bad on these) All that vibration and slop allowed other gear teeth to touch and chip out 1st gear teeth edges a tad. OUCH.
Aug 2, 2009, 07:35 AM
#42
Evolving Member
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Greensboro, NC
Posts: 152
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Does anyone have the part numbers for the gears/shims/synchros? As well as the tolerances for the shims? Pulling my tranny and front dif next weekend to refresh everything.
Aug 3, 2009, 12:53 PM
#44
Newbie
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Maine
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks for popping in and being helpful Nasty.
Im interested to know if there are any 6spd DIY'ers out there willing to share some part numbers, processes, and other helpful DIY hints for a typical 75k notchy tranny rebuild.
Im interested to know if there are any 6spd DIY'ers out there willing to share some part numbers, processes, and other helpful DIY hints for a typical 75k notchy tranny rebuild.